Heinous Crime- Smoking in a public place

[AitchGee]

Thought I'd have a go at this section, hope I've done this in the right place :)

I was a smoker up until my illness, which basically totally dominated my desire to puff away. Right or wrong, I still am of the opinion that there are far more issues that need addressing in society than criminalising smokers. You may have your own views and you are entirely at liberty to have them.

This "Am I being unreasonable" post is however, is about a related matter.

Every day I walk through an underpass and realised that their were no lawful signs forbidding smoking in a public place in an area that was substantially enclosed. The July 2007 legislation expressly defines what is deemed to be "substantially"

In my Local Authority, the Environmental Health Department are entrusted to prosecute.

I called them up and asked them if I found an occasion that was indeed a Breach of the law, would they prosecute? They replied, "Yes, we always prosecute" They asked me where I had noticed the Breach, I told them that it was within their own Subway. They replied that they couldn't possibly "police" a Subway and would therefore do nothing. I advised them, by email, that their only option was to close down all the underpasses or give up policing the legislation.

Is there one law for them, one law for us? Am I being unreasonable to demand that all the underpasses and subways are policed like the rest of us?

no, it just gives a whole new disgusting smell poke or or swee

If someone has a wee in a shop dorrway they get at least a £40 fine (this varies). How many of us have had a wee in the forest or woods? Should you have been prosecuted?

Smoking in an underpass doesn't take lives so they cannot justify the police manpower.

If it is a big problem then get local people involved, this has happened in the past and has stopped anti-social behaviour. I am sure you would get people involved if you provided tea/coffee and biscuits.

Start a campaign.

On a different note not all crime is delt with, banks can choose not to prosecute fraud when credit cards are stolen.

Smoking in an underpass doesn't take lives so they cannot justify the police manpower.

Neither does fraud - but they seem to find the manpower for that crime

a person or company can choose not to prosecute is actually not taking the steps further and they take the loss. The tax man doesn't pick and choose as it is public money not private. Some shops don't prosecute shoplifters either

You cannot commit fraud in the underpass or in the woods, so policing isn't needed in the same way that road blocks are, to check for unisured etc drivers. Inland revenue ('the tax man') handles the collection of tax, it doesn't set the rate. If we spend more on public services the council and tax rate will rise, then the CPS decides wether it is viable to prosecute, not all criminal activity is delt with via the courts.

The same happens across littering, dog fouling, swearing in public, even domestic violence etc,all of these, in theory, are illegal, we don't operate zero tolerance in the same way that Japan does, for example. There are lots of crimes that are ignored and many much worse than smoking if the OP wants to change our legal system. If an offence is commited against a child and the case will not stand up, it doesn't always reach court.

If there's no sign saying it's unlawful to smoke then how can they prosecute people for doing so?

I'd be more scared about being mugged in an underpass. Also no sign against it but it's a crime anyhow.

If you are illiterate does that let you off the hook then, is it only literate people that have to obey the law?

It depends on the crime as strickly speaking you are not knowingly breaking the law if you didn't know the law exsisted. The CPS will only prosecute if it is in the public interest to do so and if they think that they have a good chance of securing a conviction. The law, as such, doesn't come into it as it is full of technicalities, that can be interpreted in different ways, when it comes to minor crime and sometime serious crimes.

Mugging is covered under criminal law as opposed to civil law (which the smoking ban comes under).

"Mugging is covered under criminal law as opposed to civil law (which the smoking ban comes under)."

At least someone has noticed the difference !!

"Civil Law" as far as the English Constitution is concerned, is illegal. We are all "Freemen (and women) of the Land. Someone or some-group have deliberately hidden our rights from sight.

This may, to some, sound crazy, but unfortunately for the authorities, the evidence is open for anyone to see........ THE MAGNA CARTA agreed by King John and signed at Runnymead in 1215.

Specifically, what rights are you on about? The fact that a subway hasn't been correctly identified as an enclosed space for the purposes of the smoking ban?

Or is all the randomness a smoke screen for another point you;re trying to make?

In all fairness, although i don't agree totally with the OP, she is making the point that laws have eroded our civil liberties and are being applied when it suits.

I can remember when all the supermarkets challanged the Sunday trading ban by opening up, en masse, I was tempted that day to go shoplifting to make a point as to why if the business is big enough why does the law not apply to them, but would apply to me. I think all those arrested that day should have challenged the decision, on principle.

I think the point the OP is making is similar to one a few days ago about dogs on beaches.

There are laws to protect people from inhaling second hand smoke and there are laws to protect people from unwanted attention from dogs. Neither of these laws seem to be enforced. Why bother having them?

WRT the smoking ban, places the public can access, including churches and private businesses where members of the public can choose to enter or not, can be prosecuted by councils for not having the right size 'No Smoking' stickers all over their entrances, defacing their premises, irrespective of whether any smoking on the premises actually takes place.

The National Socialist movement during the years between 1933 and 1939, saw criminalising such as smoking in a public place to have it's uses. Reporting your neighbour for various misdemeanours was seen as a cheap option for the state machine.