To think the babyboomers have had it a lot easier than the next generation?

[DarlingDuck]

In terms of house prices, uni fees, pensions and retirement.

I'm 30 and don't know any people my age who own their own homes unless they were substantially subsidised by their parents. All my friends have uni fees to pay off and a lot of them struggled/are struggling to find work even with a degree.

Am a bit jealous of my parents generation... Had a major pang when I heard the over 65's own 85% of the UK's property, AIBU?

i havent had it particularly easy

i got married at 19, bought a house through scraping and scrimping , had children young, supported my husband by moving where his career took him, even when it meant hundreds of miles away from family with small children. Made quite a bit of profit each time I moved then lost it all when mortgage rates went up to 16% and properties went into negative equity. My husband was made redundant three times, once the week before we got married and once when I was 8 months pregnant with our second child. We didnt have benefits willy nilly in those days and it was very easy to get repossessed if you fell behind.

Now I am getting toward 50 my house is almost paid off, my children have grown up and I have a good pension to look forward to, not by luck but by scrimping, saving, planning and working bloody hard.

but I wouldnt want to be starting out these days and i fear for how my children will ever afford a pension and a house.

Perhaps houses were more affordable because they were more basic. We didn't have central heating, didn't have en suite, didn't have built-in,

YANBU. And my mum and dad (babyboomers, obv.) agree with you too.

My mum often says this. She says there were just so many more jobs, you could choose what you wanted to do, and that's without going to university.

I think YANBU about property. DH and I and 2 kids, both postgraduate qualified professionals and earning accordingly, living in a tiny 3 bed semi with a small tricky garden. We are grateful to own it but it's not where we would have lived 30 years ago.

30 years ago we purchased our first home, a flat for £21k. we lived with my inlaws for two years and saved 90% of our wages. I had a full time job and an early morning job and then an evening job.

When we finally owned our own home we could not afford any social life, we had to budget for everything. I had a saucepan with four different sections so I could cook the whole meal on one ring. All of our furniture was donated from relatives.

After property prices rose we purchased a house. Intestest rates then rose to 16% our mortgage of 48k cost £656 per month, we earned £800 per month. Our house was reposessed.

My current mortgage of £150K costs £393, I purchased my house in in 2000 for 25% of its current value.

Cannot see how it was easier 30 years ago.

I was born in 1961, so a late baby boomer. It was such a different world. I remember well the crap, miserable decade that was the 70's - 3 day weeks, social and political upheaval. If you had one car you were posh if you had 2 telephones you were practically royalty. No central heating or automatic washing machine(somebody stop me before I tell you how we all lived in a shoebox...).
It was the arrival of easy credit in the '80's which suddenly made everything seem affordable in the short term and totally unaffordable in the long term - and that goes for the country as well as individuals.
House prices now are prohibitive for 1st timers and yes we have done well out of buying and selling property sensibly, but in the 80's and 90's we had to face double digit interest on our mortgages at a time when inflation was eating away at our wages and savings - not an easy time.
But what has changed more than anything is expectations. The majority didn't expect to go to university, we didn't expect a gap year or regular foreign holidays, we didn't expect to be able to borrow to buy things easily.
I really feel for those who are struggling to get on the property ladder now, but equally, when I see the lifestyle and opportunities that many of them have compared to 40yrs ago, I think thank God that era is behind us.

Echo much of what Mateysmum and Tallulah have said. Property prices come and go and the market seems to be correcting now and might not increase for several years. Times have been very tough but I remember them being so in the early 80's and then again in the early 90's. We have been lucky and have invested well in property but our dc will be luckier because our parents weren't able to give us the sort of help that we will be able to give them. I was born in 1960 (my parents got married when my mum was 4.5 months pregnant and in 2000 my grandad told me that it took my grandma years to recover from the shame). Even the toilets at school were in an outdoor block and the same marks were up the walls the day I left as were there the day I arrived. Like another poster said very few went to uni (and that was a grammar school); I wasn't "uni" material even though I have professional quals and an MBA now.

Well, YANBU and YABU. Some boomers will reap rewards that generations after them will not; but, as with all economic discrepancies, not all share in the wealth: there are many pensioners and boomers who are in poverty.

The most important "boomer" advantages, as I see them are/were:

• house prices. For a long time, house price increases and wages kept in sync; now house prices are so out of line with salaries, and inflation runs so far ahead of wage increases that this link is long gone. A correction of the most massive scale would have to take place now for this link to be restored, and I seriously doubt current homeowners would tolerate that, and thus politicians are likely to take measures designed to protect the price of housing, at least in the short to middle term.

• pensions. Those boomers who secured a good company or public sector pension enjoy a security and terms that the generations after them will not. My stepmother retired at 50 on a full pension; she is 67 now, and likely to live a long time more. She will likely be retired longer than she worked. My father's 3 pensions are worth nearly as much as the average salary earned by a working person. No one now - except for CEOs and the rich - will enjoy such good terms in their retirement. People on this thread saying that young people today waste their money on non-essentials and this accounts for the discrepancy between theirs and older generations must be having a laugh. To have the kind of pension my (step)parents have, young people would have to save many many hundreds if not thousands of pounds a month for their entire working life. The price of a mobile phone contract doesn't even cut it. And, by the way, lots of boomers now enjoy mobile phones, and modern lifestyles: they aren't all living as if it was the 1970s, so all these holier-than-thou puritanisms are a bit misplaced.

• the NHS. It is not conceivable that the NHS will remain free at the point of delivery. After the majority of boomers die (those who currently make it politically impossible to reform the NHS wholescale, since as an ageing population, they depend on it, and - critically - they are the ones doing the majority of voting... So, actually, we younger generations should thank them for this, really...), the NHS will go; we will all have to pay - one way or another - for our health.

• the welfare state (beyond pensions & the NHS). Again, it seems unlikely that the current benefits system will survive. We are likely to move to a US model of welfare within my lifetime.

• the last historical remnants of British (political/market/intellectual, etc.) supremacy. There's been a steady decline in British power since WWII and the end of empire, and the boomers will be the last to benefit from it. Present and succeeding generations will suffer on account of globalised competition from China, Brazil, India, etc. etc. The working classes in the UK were the vanguard in the futile confrontation with global markets (the collapse of, for instance, heavy industry in the UK), and now the middle/educated-classes are feeling the pinch.

It is certainly the case that - for perhaps the majority of the population - life is more diverse today than it was 30 years ago (quality is harder to measure, I think); certain domestic improvements - in bathrooms, central heating, etc. - are now widescale and normal. But the monetary value of the NHS and pensions to the boomer generation far far outweigh the cost of installing central heating...

Now, doom-mongers may console themselves with the thought that the boomers are very likely to resist with all their might paying for their old-age care, so they are likely to be able to pass on a good deal of their collective wealth to their children. But once that wealth is spent by their children (on living costs, old-age care) there will be not much left for their children.

DH is a baby boomer and I am one of the later ones.

People forget that our parents also did very well compared to previous generations. Yes they lived through the war years and most lived with parents as newly weds, but jobs were plenyful and well paid. They were the first to have education beyond 14. Lots could not take full advantage of this but they could make sure that their DC had the chance.

SOME baby boomers ie those who passed 11+, and whose parents were a bit more forward thinking did get the chance of free university education and the chance of a career not just a job.

All of that generation enjoyed the NHS, good education, good affordable housing etc., but not everyone could take advantage of it. I for one was allowed to stay on to complete O levels, but was prevented from going further. My parents thought as many did that education would be wasted on a girl because she would be a wife and mother. This was I would say the norm wher I grew up. Most girls worked in local factories or in Woolies etc. Those with more enlightend parents did shorthand/typing, nursing, and the very lucky ones got to do A levels. Amongst the girls I was at school with A levels led to teacher training college.

It hasn't all been easy for the baby boomers. Many lost their homes and businesses during the 1980s. Those of us that clung on to our homes (just!) did struggle to feed their families and certainly couldn't afford holidays etc.
We could not afford to profit from the mass sell-off of the family silver...water gas electricity etc because we were still reeling from high interest rates. The only asset we have is a home that's paid for. We will have to sell up and downsize eventually because DH has a very average private sector pension.

Something that really has changed though is quality. I went to grammar school and the DH went to a comprehensive but it was the first year it stopped being a grammar school so it retained the grammar school ethos. We both had a really good education which included Latin, three separate sciences and the choice of three modern languages - and they were small schools. Nevertheless only a minority went to university. Our children are now 16 and 13. Our son is in the independent sector; our daughter in a cofe London comprehensive. In both schools almost all children are expected to go to university. At the independent the education is broad, rigorous and generally fabulous and I have never had a moment's worry about behaviour or ethos. At the cofe London comp, which is much sought after, everything seems to have been diluted in recent years, the behaviour is atrocious and learning for all is seriously affected. Our daughter will leave in a few weeks time because we can afford to transfer her to the independent sector. This would not have been the case when we were growing up so in many ways it is a very good thing that we are very equity "rich" because we are having to provide what used to be available for free. Also, although the NHS has developed with improvements in treatment and at the cutting edge is superb, for those of us who need routine problems resolved the quality of care is vastly diminished. Where has holistic, caring nursing gone because it certainly isn't available in the NHS.

In many ways, certainly materially I think the country is better off. In others such as quality of life and general values, I don't think we are. I think society as a whole needs a complete rethink so in many ways I am on the fence. I do think it's worth noting though that the DH's parents, who came from hard working, working class families with 4-5 children, where the mothers cleaned to help make ends meet, in an era of no benefits, remember being hungry as children. I'm not sure nowadays when very low income families spend the too little they have wisely, that the children go hungry or cold, or have to have their clothes mended.

I think it's too simplistic to say that. Some things were easier ; others were harder. And I certainly think expectations have gone up considerably - I look at 20 - somethings or even older teenagers today, and all of them run a mobile phone, Many of them run a car, most that I know have holidayed abroad at least once (sometimes every year) they eat out and go to the cinema regularly, travel etc etc

In contrast Many baby boomers may have got on the housing ladder more easily, but they often lived extremely frugally- eg not going abroad, barely ever eating out, not having the heating on(or not having heating full stop!)not owning Many clothes or eating fancy foods. The lifestyle many young people now live on a day to day basis is beyond anything the baby boomers could have imagined. So its swings and roundabouts.

I guess what irks me is the jeolousy/resentment towards the babyboomers (on not just this thread but others I've seen on here) towards a generation of people who had their own struggles and made their own sacrifices.

.....and the seeming sense of entitlement of many who seem to think that they are hard done by...when they don't know what real hardship is.

People are commenting that a lot of today's young people seem to be frittering their money on foreign holidays, fancy clothes, going out etc. True, but I think it's partly because they know they'll NEVER be able to afford to buy their own home however much they stay in and don't have any life in order to save some money. whatever they save will never be enough.

Given a choice between shelling out extortionate rent to live "independently" in some grotty bedsit on their own, or in a houseshare as if you are a student (even if you are approaching 30), or live in the parental home in a bit of comfort and have a bit of spare cash to "fritter" then I can't say I blame them for wanting to do the latter.

In some ways my mum had things harder because she was told I was normal when I had/have Aspergers Syndrome and probably had ADHD but neither condition was diagnosable then because no one had come up with the diagnosis- we were just considered naughty instead of helped. On the other hand she had my dad so she didn't have to manage on benefits and be so at risk from the Government nor was she counted as an unpaid carer. Being a unpaid carer and full time parent and having to live on benefits because my ex (the kids' dad) abused us (I had to become a single parent or the kids would go into care) means you're very at risk from this Government's changes to disability benefits and general benefit changes (especially as many disabled will lose all benefits because the assessment is wrong which means their carers will no longer count as carers and have to look for full time work they can't take because they are still carers but have to take or lose their benefits and starve and become homeless- disabled person, kids and all. My mum and dad have paid off their mortgage and the Government aren't going to take away the pensions from those already past the present retirement age so they will have an income- a carer who is of working age with no partner is not guarrenteed to have any money coming in at all.

!961. You're only 8 years older than me- I was born in 1969.

My last post was a reply to mateysmum.

one of the main differences with my generation was that we had low expectations. We didn't complain about other people having more, we went to work and saved to get what we wanted. We knew that meant going without and did it without (much) grumbling. We didn't expect to live long after getting our pensions because most people didn't draw a pension for years before they died.

Now there is an expectation that you can can have everything handed to you on a plate. There is far more opportunity now for people to change their way of life, thanks to those who would not accept being held back because they were poor, or female, or black. Life expectancy has increased partly because of the developments we made in public health and yes we are benefiting more from that than our children but our children's lives growing up are more comfortable than ours were, partly because we spend our money on them. I would like a few years of enjoyment as some stage in my life!

yanbu they bloody had it really easy compared to now

the bastards

"Everything was much harder to come by and material things were way more expensive in relation to earnings"

I think that's an important thing to remember. People talk about going without but it was when going without those things meant you could save a significant amount of money.

My mum likes to tell how they couldn't just go out and buy a sofa they had to save up as though if we'd not gone out and spent 150 quid in Ikea on a sofa, we'd soon have 25k for a deposit for a house.

I don't think you are being unreasonable OP.

My parents didn't have much money and they did work hard, but they have a much better house than either I or my siblings will ever own. And my brother is educated to a higher level than either of my parents. A lot of it is timing and house prices, but still..... the price of your home when you buy it is such a massive impact on your lifestyle.

My parents never felt obliged to save for braces for their children. As it turned out one their kids could have done with braces, but the way the world was in the late 70s, early 80s, saving for braces was not something that obsessed people. NOw, it is one more thing in this totally changed world we live in that I feel I will have no choice really but to save for.

ps, I would never put a sofa on credit. The only thing I would put on credit is something that is an investment into the future. ie, a mortgage, education or something health related or braces.

YANBU-I am 67-house paid for and all 5 dc/dsc now adults-all went to uni and came out with smallish loans to repay.However......they are now aged 37 to 42 and all are married,have careers,have their own dc and all are homeowners[albeit with mortgages].No one helped any of them with large sums of money.
Yes it was easier for us in some ways but it is not impossible for you.My dc all say they dont know what they will do about uni for dgc so all are saving towards it.

YANBU; my parents and their friends are far-lefty-liberals who sit and moan about how my generation of 20-30 somethings don't care as much as they did about The Ishoos and how Thatcher ruined everything for everyone (I do think they have a point here) and made us all capitalist pigs.

I have pointed out to them that they did exceptionally well throughout the capitalism of the 80s and 90s and are now sitting very pretty into their retirement. Seems a bit hypocritical to me!

That said, my parents have helped us out a bit with money and things like free childcare but I am still hugely jealous of their new cars and holidays as these are things that I can't see us ever being able to afford.

I do sometimes wonder how many people on here who have expensive homes already, can say if they were starting on the property ladder now, with no equity from a previous home could honestly say they could afford their home they live in right now right now based on salary alone?

I suspect a tiny amount.

DH & I are quite young and have our own property which I am grateful for everyday though.

lol everyone thinks the next generation

a. has it better
b. is ungrateful and
c. couldn't have put up with the stuff we did in our day.....

I'm 47 - so born in 1964 - not THAT long ago you know..... As a child life was pretty grotty -We never had a holiday, we didn't have a car and we lived in a house tied to my dad's employer - University was not universal, neither was home ownership.

Now, I'm studying for a maths degree - interest rates are so low my mortgage payment is peanuts, been to Florida twice in 4 years, have a newish car, buy what we want when we want - because we can afford to! Mortgage is the only debt we have.

BUT - I've worked damn hard to get here - shop work, kitchen work, pub work put me through college, then a civil service job for 15 years drudging up through the ranks to get me enough salary to be able to buy a house. Met hubby had kids, and saved 2 years of my salary to enable us to have me as a SAHM.

My kids are going to have it hard - but if they work hard, they have a better chance of getting to university and I imagine that will lead to a higher salary to begin with than I could ever have dreamt of. They will probably stay home for longer and rely on the hotel and bank of mum-and-dad whilst saving for a deposit for a house, if they bother at all with home ownership - swings and roundabouts...