to think – and say – this is incredible offensive?

[Mitzimaybe]

On a football forum where there's nothing much going on (it is the off season, after all) someone made a post saying "This site has about as much going for it as Adolf Hitler would have at a Bar Mitzvah." I responded with "Unbelievable. I've seen some idiotic and offensive posts from you over the years, but that crosses the line so far that I'm lost for words."

A few others have also told him its offensive but some have defended him, e.g. "Jesus, what [xxxxx] posted was not offensive! You lot must be a right laugh if you're offended by something as easy as that." The person who posted the remark claims to have done a straw poll and "A random sample of 27 people in the office and unanimously everyone agrees with me."

I am not Jewish, don't consider myself overly pc (e.g. I don't see anything wrong with Baa baa black sheep) but surely, any sane person can see it's incredibly offensive, can't they? Or is it just me? I don't even understand why there's any argument about it.

So what does a random sample of 27 mumsnetters think about it?

Those of you saying it's not offensive - shame on you. To make light of a genocide in any context is disgusting, dispicable and beyond the pale.

How is it making light of genocide? It is saying that a genocidal maniac would not be welcome at a gathering of those he persecuted. I don't understand how that is making light of genocide.

Why does Noddy have big ears?

Because he's a cunt.

But it's not saying genocide is a good thing. It's saying it's universally acknowledged that Hitler is bad. I agree it's making light - that's crass, but not appproving, that would be offensive. imo, anyway.

Well I suppose if you really break it down, it suggests that Hitler would not be popular at a Bar Mitzvah, based on the assumption that everyone knows what Hitler did to Jewish people.

You have to have that knowledge to get that joke, you have to find the concept of Hitler in a room full of the group of people he committed genocide on amusing, as an example of the ultimate unwelcome guest.

I don't think it's the same type of joke as 'is the Pope Catholic' that's just calls on a statement of obvious fact. The pope is Catholic.

The Hitler/Bar Mitzvah 'joke' is based on an artificially manufactured scenario and derives it supposed humour from the fact that Hitler murdered millions of Jews.

How about a joke involving a child murderer in a room with the parents of the child - less amusing? not amusing at all? crass? offensive?

Its actually rather hard to make light of genocide, don't you think? rather a weighty subject.

I don't need your shame though, thanks.

What winnybella said.

well eurochic, if you can't see it then I doubt I'm in a position to point it out. It wouldn't even enter my mind to make a flippant comment like that ever in any situation. The horror of what happened under that regime (and what still happens today under other regimes) is so hard for me to understand that it should never be reduced to some cartoon like story. What happened to those people was real and so horrific that there are no words to describe it - 'God forgot about us' I heard a survivor say of her experience of the death camp.

None of you would want to hear analogies if it involved people close to you who had been murdered. I defy you to say otherwise.

I don't know if it's making light of genocide, but can be a bit offensive to go around reminding people of genocide.

Suppose you take a long walk aound Golder's Green wearing a t-shirt emblazoned with the slogan "Hitler killed Jews".

Factually correct? Yes.
Offensive? Yes.
Unnecesary? Yes.

you could alternatively argue that things shold be kept alive in living memory, as part of everyday language so such things are never forgotten.

Oh come on MsTeak, there are appropriate ways of doing this. Pathetic, crass jokes are not appropriate and do not serve to remind people of what really happened - that is the problem.

You say you are not Jewish but are very offended. You say "surely any sane person can see it's incredibly offensive" as though there is one clear definition of sanity.

As discused on a different forum, what offends some people will not raise an eyebrow with others and a lot of humour is offensive to certain groups.

People tell jokes about the Cornish being inbred, are thick yokels, having six toes and so on, I don't get annoyed or jump up and down with indignation.

Are you upset on behalf of Jews you know personally, or is there some other reason why you have reacted so strongly?

As for your straw poll, I don't find it particularly amusing but on the other hand I am not offended either.

I didn't say it was a good idea, just that its an alternative argument. I just don't get the offense taken, it seems over the top to me.

I don't think there is ever a reason to make a joke which depends on mentioning someone's race or colour. Or something catastrophic in history. I agree that people are not all offended by the same things but would also argue that jokes about such things encourage prejudices and low-level thinking. I personally think that if even one person finds something offensive then it is. I also think that people hide behind stupid remarks which they try to pass off as jokes in an attempt to express their thinly veiled prejudices without reproach.

None of this sort of stuff is healthy or remotely funny.

The offense taken is definitely over the top.

To be honest, Jokes about Hitler are out of mein kampfort zone.

electra

There are around 60 million people in the UK. It is entirely posible that any joke or comment would be found objectionable by someone, so to say as you did: "I personally think that if even one person finds something offensive then it is." is stretching any definition of offensive beyond reason.

i love you still tethers

tethers

Not sure I'm the best person to ask as I find very little offensive, but, no this 'joke' is not offensive for the reasons several others have stated above as it stands.

But, I wouldn't be surprised if the original author in the football website intended it to be offensive....

I'm Jewish and I don't think it was offensive. It's not the funniest joke I've ever heard but it's not that offensive.

It doesn't read right at all.Is he trying to say that 'this site has as much fun in it as Hitler would have at a bar mitzvah' (still not reading right but at least makes sense)? That would be very laboured and not at all clear from his post.

Or he feels as welcome on the site as Hitler would at a Jewish party?

Either way he is obviously barely functioning and may never understand either humour on any level or why jokes about genocide are never as much of a giggle as you'd think. Leave him to his dull bleatings.The nobber.

nope not offended.

electra a good friend of mine's mother was in the death camps. He is Jewish. I can guarantee he would not be offended. There are Jewish people on this thread saying they are not offended. You are sounding terribly po-faced.

It was just an analogy. Not a very clever or well-expressed one, but I really don't think it is offensive. Is the 'Hitler has only got one ball song' (sung by many tommies) offensive to Jews because it mentions Hitler and could arguably remind people of the terrible things he did?