DS2's teacher is striking, but not DS1's

[MarioandLuigi]

AIBU to keep them both off?

(I know I probably am, but thought I would ask anyway :o)

MrsGuyOfGisbourne - what other 'professionals' are having their pensions damaged such as we are?

To the poster whose post has been deleted; do you really want your DC taught by a robot who doesn't question things and act upon their beliefs?

Unless I am mistaken; it was not public sector workers who caused the financial ruin of the country but we are the ones being held accountable. The teachers pension fund is in the black and not using public sector funds which could be used elsewhere. I pay a large percentage of my salary into the fund on the basis of the pension I was promised when I joined the profession. I am now being asked to pay more, work for longer and receive less.......

all this proposal is going to do is cost a fortune in sickness pay as many 60+ teachers will have to go on long term sickness as they are not capable of controlling 16 year old shits students all day everyday whilst marking coursework, planning lessons, filling in countless forms etc.

i would send my son in, i'm glad my ds is off on the strike so i can spend some time with just him.

ds teacher has a home work pack for next thursday to complete

Other professions DO strike - you just don't see the whole of a professional association for, say, accountants going on strike. When the civil service unions strike, there will be all manner of professional people on strike, just under the banner of their public sector unions, not their professional associations.

SO...protest then. But why strike? Pointless, futile and self-serving. You will lose the respect of parents and others who can see that its all about YOU. Enjoy your day off, tho'.

Absolutely Euphemia. Well said.

Mrs - do you have DC in a state school? Why do you hold so little esteem for the bloody hard work that teachers do?

"You will lose the respect of parents and others who can see that its all about YOU. "

If they think that then I don't want or need their "respect."

I have a child in a state school and I respect the hard work, of those who ARE working just as I respet the hard work of the very much harder working men who empty our bins.. But if SOME teachers (not all) are having a tantrum and making a futile gesture about something that is inevitable for ALL of us who are living longer - and they can't or won't do the maths - they lose respect.

I suppose the difference between the men who empty your bins and teachers is that they are unllikely to have a student loan to pay off, have a post graduate qualification or work 60+ hours a week.

Perhaps if you compared the salary and conditions with other PROFESSIONALS - like solicitors, accountants, doctors - then you would understand the frustration teachers feel. The relatively low pay used to be compensated by the decent pension teachers got...if this is removed why would anyone bright enough to teach not decide to go for a better paid professional role. How sad for the nation's children that would be.

Soo Mrs G- we work less hard than the bin-men???
I so want to say something very rude, but I won't sink to your level.

"Iif you got your selfish way on your own Pension - which you won't as it is futile gesture - simple maths - it would be those vulnerble paying for your better pension".

Mrsguy, I think that actually, you might find, that once a whole lot of teachers all opt out of the unaffordable proposed pension scheme [and other public sector workers], then yes a whole lot more of you [people who are not teachers or public sector workers and they themselves] will have to pay a whole lot more-simple maths really [oh, and looking at the bigger picture]. I also think, you may find, that teachers pay into their pensions already and they pay tax just like everyone else in order to contribute to society. Hope that helps.

God, I missed the working harder bit..I think, Mrs, that you know very few teachers or binmen. Both physically and mentally I would say teaching is more taxing than emptying bins.

I had this last time round. DS1 went in, DS2 didn't. A useful lesson in "life's bit fair" I thought. Neither of mine is affected this time.

Not fair

Damn you autocorrect

It's a lose, lose situation with the pensions proposals on so many different levels.

For starters, take bits of the economic argument, which seems the biggest problem for most people, and which in itself is manyfold:

There is the future of this country and having low paid teachers/public sector-the knock on effect is common sense, eg:do you want good teachers or not? Who will want a demanding, low paid job with 27k [at least] worth of university debt?

There is the simple fact that if teachers [and other public sector workers]have less cash, then there is less spending from a whole lot of people. Again, the knock on effect is common sense-do you want spending growth or not? Who's going to be buying?

Next, what will we do when people opt out of their pension schemes because they cannot afford the extra amounts being demanded? The knock on effect for their old age is obvious; they will rely on state benefits instead, thereby costing us more or the same. How will the country afford [that is you] to pay out pensions to those who did not opt out if there are not enough people paying in? Again, the knock on effect is obvious.

So is this a really good time to make people pay extra into their pensions? Really? When they face pay freezes and at the same time face costs rising everywhere?

My profession isn't allowed to strike, would be struck off for life. I think there is a very high chance that teachers earn more than me (8K pa). My pension is buggered too. Thing is no amount of striking is going to magic money up from anywhere.

I am considering suicide for when I become unfit to work due to old age. My recent pension statement suggested £9pcm. I am being serious.

MrsGuyofGisbourne - love your rationale that the strike is futile. So you only do something if you know you're going to win?

And by the way, the teachers who strike aren't having a day off; they're losing pay to make a point.

I can think of lots of examples of people in the private sector who have to do 3 day weeks until the economy pick up. Having worked with teachers I do know they work very hard, However I don't think £1,200 take home pay after (tax,pension and student debt) is bad for someone just of college. I think striking for something that will happen to you 30 years in future is rubbish.Work in the private sector or get a private pension quite frankly. I had years of being told "if you don't like being a TA then be a teacher" whenever we complained about pay and conditions.I listened. If you don't like the pay and conditions of being a teacher then do something else.

"Fine to strike, but teachers like to be considered 'professionals' - are there any other professions that strike..?"

are there any other professionals with a degree and higher degree that get paid as little as teachers? Pay me a lawyer or accountant salary and I'll happily sort out my own private pension!

Mine, if I was full time I would be paid £22-24K. If I am correct that would be between level 3 and 4 on the main teachers pay scale so higher than some individual teachers but not astronomically so.

Mine too. A biomedical scientist requires a degree now and has done for some years - the entry pay for a trainee biomedical scientist used to be laughable (after 10 years in the service I was still only on a basic of £16kpa, less than the average graduate entry pay in other professions). It was revised about 10 years ago to bring it more into line with other public sector pay structures but is probably equivalent now to what xstitch is saying. And although we aren't NOT allowed to strike exactly, we are bound to keep a skeleton staff running hospital labs. So a strike becomes ineffectual because the lab work is still mostly done - the urgent stuff, anyway. Routine/non-urgent tests would not be done.

People have inflated ideas of what lawyers and accountants earn because they choose only to look at the high fliers. My DH pays lawyers with 20 years experience about 45k. My accountant friend earns £38k. I earned £36k as a 15 yr qualified legal aid solicitor. These DO compare to teachers' salaries and they aren't rare. But no one wants to hear it.