In thinking if you earn over £100,000 a year, you should not be allowed to stay in council house accomodation?

[Hammy02]

RMT union boss Bob Crow earns this and yet still lives in a council house. Surely he is using a property that should be housing someone that actually cannot afford to privately rent and needs subsidised property?

but how much did they shovel away to avoid/evade? a whole lot more id imagine.

abs i dont think she meant people who work over the counter in your local branch more like bankers, not clerks

Do you honestly think that the individuals who caused the crisis are still working? They're loooooooooong gone.

I did - and it was taxed at 40%. So did DP - but you don't think someone should be rewarded for doing their job well and putting in over 70 hours a week, because they work in a particular industry? Do you have any idea what actually goes on investment banks? What they do?

And do you think it's a good idea to accept mortgages from people who can't pay? The company that processed (and approved) most of the mortgage applications for sub prime mortgages, is not based in London and not staffed by "top level" bankers. It's in the north east and is staffed by people who couldn't be arsed to do their job properly (e.g. giving a £500k mortgage to the cleaner of a golf club).

Interest rates are based on LIBOR and also the Bank of England Base rate, which is currently 0.5% and has been held there for ages. That is not set by the banks - it's set by the government.

Rhubarb - Liking that revolution idea. Don't occupy any city squares just yet or we'll get taken over by a General, which is never good news.
Dp & I 'own' this decrepid hovel bijou cottage; it's 'worth' about 3 times what we paid for it. We only bought it because we had no real choice. Should we be made to move on to free up some cheap housing for 'the needy'? Or does that only apply to sponging council tenants (like we were before)?

and the banking has no influence over gov does it? no that would be an absurd idea.

I dont think mortgages to those who cant pay are a good idea at all. why one earth should a 2 bed terrance cost 250k to buy? crock of shit

the individuals are still working in banking, at least some of them are. those who lost their jobs are probebly working for the bank of england now or the imf, or giving consulatations on world banking changes. or worse, maybe they are teaching!!

greed greed greed

I think that nurses, midwives, teachers, firemen and other vital service providers should get bonuses too. I'm afraid your 70 hour working week sob story won't cut any bones with me when nurses and doctors are doing 90 hour weeks and getting paid pittance, with cuts because of the recession threatening their jobs even more.

Bankers must be really quite thick because they used to beg people to have two, three, four credit cards and borrow to the limit knowing full well that these people didn't have the income to pay back. And now they won't give mortgages to people on decent incomes who have good credit histories and who can pay back. I'm shit at maths but even I can work out that the system is wrong.

And don't even get me started on the tax haven the City of London enjoys.

alice there is always choice, just some options you wont favour.

I completely agree with Rhu!

well, if you want to get good pay, don't bloody well go and become a nurse or fireman and then complain about it. It's the reality of life. Some jobs are paid well, but are incredibly dull or stressful. Others aren't paid well, but are a vocation.

The system is unfair; it is. It is terribly unfair. There's feck all I can do about it. Or any other city worker. My mother's a teacher, is paid barely anything and her pay has been frozen for the foreseeable future. So, when I was making career choices I said "sod that2, worked hard and specifically chose to go into a career that pays well.

do you think also that people should think a bit before getting themselves hideously into debt? And maybe learn to live within their means? I have a friend who is ridiculously rubbish with money; she knows this, and yet she went off and got a credit card, maxed it out, used it to get cash out and had to enter into a payment scheme within six months. Is it the banks fault that she's such a moron? Are people not responsible for their own actions?

What do you mean by bankers? Do you mean traders? High street bank tellers? M&A analysts? Business managers? Do you mena support staff? Credit risk analysts? Market risk analysts? Compliance? Corporate legal? Secretaries?

On Bob Crow - if he bought a big house he'd get slagged off for that too, because all socialists should find dignity in sweated labour and poverty. He is a union leader; he does what it says on the tin, unlike most of them. RMT members (who used their belts as tourniquets after the 7/7 bombs) have a reasonable work life because of people like Bob Crow. Would you prefer them to be knackered, stressed out and underpaid when your life depends on them doing a competent job? Just asking...

knitted, there really isn't a choice. If you are working and therefore not really eligible for a council house (ok, you can go on the list but don't hold your breath for the next 20 years), have a family, can't muster together a deposit for a house then private renting is the only option. Landlords know that and have profited from it.

Oh ok Abs, lets all become bankers then shall we? Because where would you be without nurses, midwives, teachers, firemen? I suppose you think we should all go private? But when you call 999 in an emergency it is the tax-payers service you are relying on for help.

If only I had the sense to go into a well-paid job as you have done! Oh how silly I have been!

Yes, people should be responsible for their debt, but then again the bloody banks shouldn't be calling people up on the phone and encouraging them to take out loans or get credit cards they don't need, which the banks were doing at the height of it all.

Oh but it's not their fault at all is it? It's all our own fault and like naughty children we are being punished by the banks for our own failings.

I would tell you to sod off but that would be rude.

'well, if you want to get good pay, don't bloody well go and become a nurse or fireman and then complain about it. It's the reality of life. Some jobs are paid well, but are incredibly dull or stressful. Others aren't paid well, but are a vocation. '

Yeah, screw all those people. To the wall with them! They're morons for expecting enough pay to have a decent, secure shelter for their children. They should live off the joy of their vocation, they don't need a decent abode for that, the fools! We should all be far cleverer and strike a line through any of those sorts of jobs in pursuit of the golden pound.

I have a mate who was made bankrupt by her creditors. Classic story - divorce from abusive man, unable to pay both rent and mortgage, made redundant (by a bank, no less!).

The day after her insolvency was discharged, she had offers through the letter slot from major high street banks for credit cards and loans.

No, she didn't take them, but it's a two-way street.

Hmm Me and my exp got a dodgy Northern Rock 100% mortgage 10 years ago. I bought my mams house which was ex council. She lived there for 24 years and bought it for 16,000 on RTB. I bought it with my dodgy mortgage for 81,000 Market value was 120,000 lived there 3 years and had it repoed as i couldnt afford it. A property developer bought it at auction for 71,000 and rents it out for 600pcm. I know all this as i live in the next street in a council house which i rent for £360pcm. Exactlly the same house. Just thought i would share this story in case anyones interested

@ expat. See Abs, the one thing I have learned about MN is that the more defensive you get the more you tend to dig a hole for yourself.

I'm off to pick up my kids now from their state school full of wonderful, dedicated but underpaid teachers who do a far more important job and a service to this country than some bored bank clerk who has the time to argue the toss on mumsnet.

"buy to let should not be allowed"

Really? How on earth would that work?

As the old bumper sticker goes: If you can read this, thank a teacher.

In defence of landlords.........

I had to be one as I needed to move for work and couldn't pay off negative equity.. By the time I paid the mortgage, letting agent, insurance and all incidental bills (boiler repair etc), then covered periods when flat was empty, I just about got through, certainly wasn't swilling champagne on the proceeds.

Also wrt housing benefit claimants, i was warned not to let to anyone claiming HB as if they were claiming fraudulently I would be legally responsible for repaying it.

Needless to say I sold it as soon as I could afford to.

There must be some sharks out there but there are also accidental landlords.

Personally I wouldnt live "council" housing if I earnt that kind of money.

DH bought his mother's HA house with her, we have since extended it to allow for us all to live here comfortably as we couldnt afford to buy ANOTHER house when we married. Although its given us a decent house for a reasonable price I wouldnt have EVER chosen to buy it myself, I certainly would have chosen to live further from mil but thats a whole other topic

The pensioners here have occasionally bought round petitions asking us to sign when the HA were trying to encourage them to move into smaller accommodation and much as I dont really relish the thought of sharing the road with some of the families who live in the other HA road...they are FAMILY houses and should not be under occupied when families have to live in B & Bs (so I have refused to sign...popular here!!)

I have a friend who calls the H.A. to do jobs all the time that she is quite capable of doing herself as its "their job" in the next breath she tells me she has no plans to move out of the large house when the kids go as its "my home"

I think its the overall trend in society to know your "rights" and what you are "entitled to" without having any moral conscience toward anyone else once you have achieve that goal.

True man of the working people is that Bob Crowe

He doesn't need a council house, he shouldn't be allowed a council house on that kind of salary.

He is also a racist twunt as well as being a greedy bastard.

I hate him and I agree with the sentiment that if you earn six figures, you should not be allowed a council house.

Are there many that fit this bill then?

Agree in a way with 100K but problem is if the barrier is lower, say 50K; if you kick out all better earners you remove incentives to do better and will have less of a mixed estate which is seen as a good thing to improve the social mix of estates.

For example, if two people are both nurses and earn £50K between them; one person would just give up their job to fall under the threshold. Others may give up their job rather than lose their home.

Also, high earners are paying alot of tax, may have a second family to pay for or may be in debt. There may be health issues which would make buying a house risky.

Some may say, why should those on benefits with no intention to work (I am not saying everyone on benefits is like this but a minority) get a house while those who work hard have to give their up because they worked their way up to better wages. It removes incentives.

luberich - of course I know we all have bills to pay, it was in repsonse to your statement "Why do council tenants think they are immune from the usual stresses and strains of life?" I pointed it out.

And now it looks like I shouldnt have worked hard, supported myself college to get the qualifications to go to University to get what I feel is a decent job, nursing to earn to support me and my family, yes its rewarding but its not a vocation - they dont pay the bills.

My house isnt perfect, its made of wood which looks deeply unnattractive but its my home, of which Ive done many home improvements to. But yes if I could I would buy a house, simply because then I could choose where to live in my town or elsewhere. Its nonsense to say that I should give up my house, move into private rent because someone here thinks I can afford it - when I cant. All that would happen is that I would have to give up my job to enable me to claim housing benfit to pay the rent, instead of me having a job and paying my local council full rent and council tax as I do presently. I would however be off like a shot if I earned £100,000.

The question posed was 'if you're earning over £100k pa you shouldn't be in council housing'

I totally agree with this view. Social Housing - should be exactly that. It should offer accommodation to meet the needs of the size of the household and should change accordingly. It should be allocated and retained only on the basis of income. £100k is too high a threshold and should I feel be reduced to reflect regional variations.

However, I have read comments about 'entitlement' and subtext of 'working the system' an attribute that is becoming endemic in our society. Regretably I have witnessed this attitude amongst the young adults I have worked with to get them into education, work and accommodation. Most would rather in their view the 'easy' option of a council place, rather than getting in the real world, working hard and making their own way.

Furthermore, bashing the banks which seems to be a popular sport does not help. The reason this country is in such a mess is through the poor management of Blair & Brown, another mess left by Labour. Again someone else is left to pick up the pieces in this case Cameron & Clegg - Big Society is about taking responsibilty - responsibility for self and others it does not mean allowing freeloading from people who can and should pay their own way.

Have I wandered into the Dail Mail comments page?

Don't think so. But here's the link for you :) www.dailymail.co.uk/debate/columnists/columnist-1002343/Daily-Mail-Comment.html