People of colour/minorities cannot be racist?

[sundayrose10]

Do you agree with this statement? I was on a different forum where they discussed black people cannot be racist. Many said blacks/minorities could NOT be racist but there were an equal number also arguing that it was impossible. The reason they gave for the impossibility was that whites have the political and economic power to supress minorities.

Do you agree with that statement or disagree?

I know some people have a problem with the term 'people of colour' but I use it to include anyone who is not white. If it is relevant, I am black myself.

[NotJustKangaskhan]

MrSpoc You and I obviously see today's society very differently. I see lip service to intergration and inclusion, but I certainly don't see this desperate action that you are talking about and I certainly don't see those in power doing anything more than clinging to what they see as theirs. The most I see is 'we'll play nice if you assimilate, but really you don't belong here'.

Anyone can be hateful and racially prejudice. I see racism though as specific societal force which favours Whites over other racial groups. The force that when a member of a racial minority does something wrong has people and the media ask if all members have those tendencies which would never be asked of White person doing similar. The force that has white women who get abducted and murdered far more attention than women from minority groups. The force that allowed the Chinese cockle pickers to needlessly die and the media focuses on whether or not they had a right to be here. That is racism, institutional racism, and is a very different to racial prejudice as it is a societal function rather than just individuals and groups not liking each other.

[MrSpoc]

I think it is a very dangerous line to spout at collagues that the majority power cannot be a victim to racism. This will then just bread contempt, hatred and will just keep going round in circles. Where does it stop.

Everyone needs to jusy accept everyone else regardless.

[JoanofArgos]

There are lots of anecdotal incidences on here of sister's friend's friend remembering a Chinese person calling her a ghost or whatever - but I don't think it has the same weight as the centuries of actual oppression of races.

[chicletteeth]

Of course they can be racist!

[DuelingFanjo]

Anyone can be racist but not all people are racist.

[MrSpoc]

Indeed we do NotJustKangaskhan.

Can i ask what race you are?

Alot of stuff in the media is people actually reporting it to the media (how else do they find out). So if a report of a murder comes out it has been leeked to the press (normally by family). So if for an example an Asian person was killed they may be less lickly to go to the papers due to thier culture / reliogion or social cercumstances). this is not the white power paying lip service.

Is it the white power playing lip service when they ban white male applications to join thier police or fire siervice because they do not have enough minority groups working for them?

Or what about all the race laws that have come out? lip service. No they are taken very seriously and even punished more severily because of it.

[MrSpoc]

JoanofArgos i have experiance alot of racism first hand. Trust me everyone is capable of it. It is not just whites against the world, infact the UK is the most tolerant and intergrated society in the world.

[SoupDragon]

"Racial tension isn't the same as racism.... maybe the problem is that there's a word we lack, which makes clear the difference between prejudice/bigotry/hatred, and the kind of racism which is powerful, and able to discriminate"

But in, say, Africa, the blacks would be the majority. Are people really arguing that there would be no racism because the majority isn't White?

[JoanofArgos]

Um, I'm not too sure about the idea that the media only report what people come and tell them! (hello, is that Kelvin McKenzie? My husband has been in a murder, would you write a story about it? ps am white.) Neither am I sure what the issues of 'cuture/reliogion/social cercumstances' are which would inhibit an Asian family from reporting murder - either to the police or the media.

I don't think the white power have actually banned white male applications for anything? Are you thinking about quotas here? Still don't think applicants face any sort of 'ban'.

What are the race laws that have come out?

[MrSpoc]

I think that is exactly what people are trying to say SoupDragon which is very racist in it self.

[MollysChamber]

NotJust

I don't disagree with you.

However after the Kriss Donald murder there was something of an outcry as to the lack of publicity around the case - in particular by the BBC - given that the victim was a 15 year child who had been subjected to a horrifyingly brutal murder. It was suggested by some that this was because Kriss Donald was a white boy who had been attacked by Asian men.

At around the same time Strathclyde police dropped an initiative to tackle the problem of Asian gangs in the area, for fear of causing offence to ethnic minorities.

Again I accept your point of you completely but at times the majority pussy-footing around for fear of offending the minority can be very damaging too.

[JoanofArgos]

I don't know about racism in Africa, though the obvious example which springs to mind would be apartheid....

[MollysChamber]

point of view

[MrSpoc]

JoanofArgos - there was something round where I live where and Asian women fell inlove with the wrong Asian Man. He family killed her and put her in a suit case and hid her body. Of course due to thier religious belives. I doubt they would of leaked it to the press.

Also I have received applications for both the fire service & police force who have both said that they have exceeded there quota for White Males in thier service so are only looking to recruit minorities. This is racist is it not. I also applied to Cheshire Fire Service who actually said they have too many males and are only looking to recruit females. Is this not also sexist.

And stop being pedantic. you know full well that there are loads of race laws that have come out. insighting racial hatred (something along them lines). Racial Discrimination. Plus many more.

[JoanofArgos]

1. How do you know this thing about the suitcase? Did your brother's mate's cousin tell you? The point I'm making is not that the press report stories which the people involved tell them about - it's usually a bit more complicated than that, surely?
   

2. No, it's not. It's a long-overdue attempt to make some effort to redress the fact that ethnic minorities are under-represented.

3. Inciting racial hatred is, as far as I'm aware, a law that is primarily there to be wheeled in against radical Muslim clerics!

(ps, your job hunt might go a bit better if you checked your spelling, you know!).

[CoteDAzur]

Minorities can definitely be racist. I have met quite a few Jewish people who believe their race is superior to the rest of humanity, more beautiful/handsome, smarter ("Look how many Nobel prize winners are Jewish"), and genetically purer ("Such few genetic defects despite being inbred for generations").

[MrSpoc]

JoanofArgos - I thought you knew nothing about racism in Africa? How conveiniant that you are aware of Apartheid.

Bit off topic but I would recomend that film Invictus (it is based on Apartheid) and what Nelson Mandela went through when he was in power.

[JoanofArgos]

I think most people have heard of apartheid though! Be a bit hard not to have, surely?

I just don't have any anecdotes about life in Africa on a day to day level, I'm afraid.

[wannaBe]

"but racism from a minority group has a completley different context and significance from mainstream or institutionalised racism - clearly it does not
have the same potential for massive destructiveness" apartheid anyone?

Growing up in South Africa I can assure you that it was the minority that held all the power.

[MrSpoc]

Have i hit a nerve there JoanofArgo.

Just ot let you know it is very childish to pick up on peoples spellings when you are loosing an argument. (says more about you then me).

You seem to have a very big chip on your shoulder.

Point 2 is racist - How can you make a minority race join something that they do not want to do. It should be down to ability to do the job and nothing else. Do you not agree with this?

Point 3 is not for radical muslim clerics - (chip on shoulder) - infact the goverment has been handling this type of situation very lightly and if it were anyone else they would of been looked up for a long time.

My friend got into a pissed up fight outside a pub with an Asian man. (nothing serious) and there was nothing mentioned about race at the time (just a miss understanding). My mate got 5 years in prison for racial abuse.

Also I am a succesful director of a recruitment company but thank you for your concern.

[JoanofArgos]

Hit a nerve? In what way? Because I wilfully insist on having heard of apartheid but being unable to give any examples of white people in Africa being called a honky or some such?

I do agree with some level of positive discrimination, yes, because how else do we redress the imbalance in society.

I'm not going to take your mate's drunken brawl and your interpretation of its relevance/veracity into account in any wider discussion about race, if it's all the same to you. I'm not sure it proves anything.

Sorry, what is the chip on my shoulder? Do you think that I am a muslim cleric or something?

[tryingtoleave]

The genocide in Rwanda is a good example of racism in Africa.

[MrSpoc]

Its not positive discrimination though is it?

All it will do is bread contempt & hatred. Everyone should just be treated equal, no trying to redress the wrongs of our race from years ago. I did not do it so why should i be punished?

My point on 3 was that it was not put inplace for Muslim clerics? it was you who said that. I used a very valid experiance to show you that the law is used to combat racial tensions.

[MrSpoc]

Also the genicide of turks in Northern Iraq. Also the Shite Muslims against the Sunny Muslims.

[tryingtoleave]

The gang rapes of white girls in Sydney by boys of Lebanese descent were arguably racist.