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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

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Original poster

to NOT expect my 3.5 year old to...

50 replies

madhousewife · 10/05/2011 20:37

...wipe her own bottom?
She's coming home from nursery the odd day with dirty knickers. DH has asked them to check her after using the loo and they've agreed but given him the 'look' at the same time.
Are we right in thinking she's still a bit young to be able to manage this bit of personal hygiene on her own?

OP posts:

SoFluffyImGonnaDie · 10/05/2011 20:54

I was very paranoid that my ds was the only one unable to wipe his own bum. I had a conversation with one of the teaching assistants who asked "don't you think it's about time he wiped his own bottom? You can't wipe it forever!"

Don't get me wrong I was trying everything to make him do it and I certainly didn't want to be wiping it but her saying that sent me a little crazy. I informed her that he was my son and if I want to wipe his backside when he is 15 then I will thanks, please don't let him sit in his own faeces all day please

Original poster

madhousewife · 10/05/2011 20:56

maydaychild - have we sent our dcs to the same nursery??? not that my nursery has refused but I'm in SE london too!

harecare - I'm back at work so this is her nursery/daycare provider.

Sofluffy - my heart breaks for your DS, poor little guy!

Thanks for all the positive advice (even if you think iabu!!)

OP posts:

Original poster

madhousewife · 10/05/2011 20:58

I'm talking a day nursery.
Now I'm wondering if DD is lactose intolerant...

OP posts:

SoFluffyImGonnaDie · 10/05/2011 21:01

Sorry that was me confusing the story with my 6 year old. He was 3.5 at the time so same as OP

Preggersplayspop · 10/05/2011 21:04

My ds wipes his bum but doesn't always get it all, so I check and wipe after him to make sure he is clean. He is nearly 4. Pretty sure nursery must do the same as he never comes home with a dirty pair of pants which he would do if they didn't check. So, yanbu. Good idea to get her trying herself but at that age they are unlikely to do a perfect job so it's sensible to check.

Preggersplayspop · 10/05/2011 21:05

Mind you, ours is a private day nursery so ratios are pretty high. With more children I guess it could be more of an issue for them logistically.

theghostofposhlymanor · 10/05/2011 21:05

Oh come on you lot - there are some 3.5 years olds barely potty trained, going off some of the threads on here.

DD has been potty trained since she was 2 but has only just got the hang of wiping her own bum properly and she's 4 next month. Attempts were pretty hit and miss up to recently, and if she was struggling she would ask her nursery teacher to help. She's in a day nursery though, not a school one, and the staff-child ratios are quite high.

TheFlyingOnion · 10/05/2011 21:05

I informed her that he was my son and if I want to wipe his backside when he is 15 then I will thanks, please don't let him sit in his own faeces all day please

fluffy thats fair enough (if a little weird) that you are happy to wipe for your kid until whatever age, but it is totally unreasonable of you to expect others to wipe your child for you when he is old enough to be doing it himself! You cannot be there to help him all the time, you you should teach him to help himself imho.

A teaching assistant is there to assist learning, not wipe lazy arsed kids' bums all day ffs.

DesolationAngel · 10/05/2011 21:07

Nurserys attached to Schools are led by teachers and the ratio for 3 year olds is 1:13. So if one adult is off attendng to a child that leaves 1 adult with upto 25 children. Definatley not enough staff to keep track of every childs trip to the loo.
That said it is the staffs duty of care to look after your child and they can not refuse to help a soiled child, however major or minor the incident maybe, but they have to be aware of it. Is your DC telling them or asking for help?

onebigchocolatemess · 10/05/2011 21:10

isn't this just a classic case of every child being different, some developing at different rates and the ability and dexterity to wipe their own bottom being one of these skills?!

YANBU, its just one of those things. Whatever needs to be done to get the pre-school/ nursery to assist (letter or permission etc) then do it.

Its no biggy, it will obviously come in time. My son is 3.2yrs and can't do it yet, and he gets help at playschool as and when needed.

Original poster

madhousewife · 10/05/2011 21:11

desolation - I don't know if she's asking for help. The ratio is less than 1:13, and to be honest, I'm not complaining about the nursery. I really am just wondering if my 3.5 DD should be able to clean herself properly. I'm starting to think that her poos might be a little on the abnormal side...

OP posts:

thegingerone · 10/05/2011 21:11

my DS is four and we made a deal before his birthday in Jan that he would start wiping his own bottom in prep for school in Sept (He's very head strong so all major toilet related actions need to be pre planned-Same with potty training when he turned three!) He tries but comes home with messy pants from nursery sometimes. We spoke to our nursery and because he's very mature he goes to the loo on his own so there isn't anyone to check his bum. We send in toddler wipes and it's better. He askes us to "check" his bum when at home. All kids are capable of diff things at diff times. We've decided ds needs to learn before school but I'm sure he won't get it right everytime. (DS1 7 sometimes get skid marks)

I think that at a day nursery or similiar care care set up, carers should help kids with whatever sort of stuff you as a parent would help with (As long as you ask/warn them and it's a reasonalbe request!) However I expect (rightly or wrongly) that at school there isn't really anyone about to help in the same way.

As we all know kids move from not being able to doing something to doing it quite dramatically at this age. Bum however need a lot of practice in the ginger household!!

SoFluffyImGonnaDie · 10/05/2011 21:12

flyingonion I do not have any intention of wiping his bum when he is 15, it was her telling me how to parent that I objected to particularly when there were other children not properly toilet trained at all.
I do however not appreciate him being called lazy because he couldn't wipe his bum properly at 3.5, he is very messy and always tried just didn't do a good job of it. I showed him all the time how to do it himself and he is generally very independent.

PomBearEnvy · 10/05/2011 21:13

Some children can put their shoes on independently at this age, some can't. Some children can cut their own food up at this age, some can't. Some children can zip up their coats at this age some can't.

Would you be happy for your child to go out without her shoes one?
Would you be happy if your child came home hungry because she couldn't feed herself?
Would you be happy if your child got soaking wet because she didn't zip her own coat?
Answer No! But you would ensure you teach your child these skills, and expect they will receive any help and encouragement needed.

If your child can't wipe her own bum at 3.5 then you need to start teaching her to do this by herself. The nursery staff aren't being unreasonable for not wiping her, they would be unreasonable if unwilling to encourage and supervise though.

DesolationAngel · 10/05/2011 21:16

I would agree with onebigchocolatemess. All kids are different and develop at different rates, I don't think it's odd that at 3.5yrs she needs a bit of help. I have worked with this age range for 10+ years and think it's quite normal.

TheSecondComing · 10/05/2011 21:17

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

BabyDubsEverywhere · 10/05/2011 21:22

Theres onlhy 12 kids in my DS nursery school class, a TA floats between them and reception...she couldnt leave the class to attend arses, could you imagine what the other 11 hell bat 3 year olds cold get up to in that time! It was on a tick sheet of things expected when they start, including completley dressing undressing for pe and being able to put on coats, hat and shoes (so send velcro rather than laces etc) Seems sensible tbh, i just assumed it was a standard thing for schools (this being my first)

Franup · 10/05/2011 21:24

YANBU

I think they should be helped. Both dds were capable wipers at 4.5yo but needed some help before. ds 3.3 needs help if at all sloppy.

Unfortunately no help in the preschool they attend(ed) and noticed quite a few kids became uncomfortable using toilet there for poos and then carried this attitude into school, and got into the whole 'holding' game which is not great.

springpiece · 10/05/2011 21:25

DD always used to ask a teacher to go with her when she needed a poo to help her wipe and the teacher would always tell her that she needs to try and learn to do it without help. A few weeks ago a teacher took me to one side to tell me that dd had tried to wipe her own bum but had come out of the toilet with poo all over her hands (after washing) and basically everywhere inc her socks. They have told her now that she should ask a teacher to go with her. Not sure if that's a good or a bad thing as she does it herself at home.

Mishy1234 · 10/05/2011 21:27

YANBU. It seems that one minute they are in nappies and being cleaned etc and then suddenly they are expected to be doing it themselves! There has to be some common sense regarding this and the staff should be encouraging the children to do it, but checking they have finished the job properly.

zukiecat · 10/05/2011 21:28

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

naturalbaby · 10/05/2011 21:35

what if the op's child was a late potty trainer and still in nappies - staff would have to go change the nappy and clean her up in that cause so how can they expect her to be fully independent and not check if she can manage now she's out of nappies?

my 3yr old has been potty trained for over 6months, better teach him to wipe his bum as i'm a lazy, neglectful mum going by some of these comments.

TheFlyingOnion · 10/05/2011 21:37

@ fluffy - that was poorly worded and I wasn't suggesting your 3.5 yr old was being lazy.

Of course it all depends on the age of the child. I would imagine its fairly normal for a 3.5 yr old to need some help, and if you worked with this age group you would expect to do it as part of your job. I worked in a special school, and the first nappy I ever changed in my life was on a 11 yr old... but I expect a year 1 teacher or teaching assistant would not be prepared to regularly help clean up a child.

MayDayChild · 10/05/2011 21:50

Been away with apprentice! Oooh
Anyway... SE London.
NW Kent
Small chain of nursery
"Talks a lot"
I reported to ofsted who did a spot check because leaving kids in dirty underwear is bad. Very bad.
Please speak to them as I have had heartache over UTI.
Oh and the lactose thing? Apparently it is very commonly passed from father to daughter. So does that also apply?!? I banned DH from eating cereal years ago!!!!

harecare · 10/05/2011 22:25

If she's there all day then she ought to be helped.
By the way, if DD didn't wipe at all she would probably still only get skid marks a couple of days a week. Firm and regular! Perhaps it is worth checking her diet if they're always loose?

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