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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

to think if they won't pay after a certain time, he shouldn't work!

60 replies

upahill · 05/05/2011 09:10

My DS has a part time job. He is nearly 15 and it is a packing job two nights a week.

He works 6pm until 10.00pm. I'm happy for him to do this but last two or shifts he has been coming in at 10.25pm. We live 1 minute from the place of work.

I said to him last night why are you late and he said that it was really busy. Fair enough. I said so are they paying you extra and he said that they weren't as they can't pay him after 10.00pm.

I then said ' so basically, they want you to work for nothing. How come? You are not a voluntary worker and over two nights you have worked for nearly an hour for free. Don't you think that is taking advantage of you?'
He said he has to stop there until all the packing is finished.

My point was then, if you are working as hard as you can and doing everything that is expected (and there are no complaints from the work place, they say he is doing alright) then they are either giving him too much or they should pay him the extra or he should go in later on the next shift.

As teenagers do he was getting a bit touchy and defensive at what he percieved as critisism.

I have said you have to learn to speak up for your self in the work place with out coming across as bolshy otherwise you will be put upon for ever!

What do people think and was I being UR to say this? Also what do you think should happen next?

OP posts:
LadyBeagleEyes · 05/05/2011 11:51

My son (15) worked all last summer in our local shop cafe.
The owner (who I know) went very strictly by the book, if she hadn't I would have mentioned it.
It's all very well teaching a good work ethic but I do think he's being exploited.
The rules are there for a reason.

peachyuk · 05/05/2011 11:59

first i'm sure that he is too young to be working that late
the company should have extra insurance to cover young workers
what breaks is he getting i think that if he works more then 4 hrs he should get 30mins tho he can opt out

plus if they don't allow him to leave when his shift has finished then that is classed as forced labour. if the company wants to get funny remind them that he gets paid by the hour and not by how much he does

Hammy02 · 05/05/2011 12:11

That seems like an awfully long day for someone of an adult age let alone a child.

Original poster
upahill · 05/05/2011 12:32

Thanks for the replies. I have a lot to think about.

1st I didn't realise that he couldn't work them hours!! (yikes!) so that will be revised

2 I do admire his loyalty. Not only about this situation but he went in to help a few times because his supervisor ( A lovely, homely women who works really hard and doesn't take much time off herself) was short staffed and he didn't want her to be stuck. All my lad says is there is a job to be done and his job is to do it.

3 I accept that working over happens sometimes - I do it myself to help my team out and they help me out so I do understand that side of things.

4 I was glad that he works hard because since he had his 14 birthday last summer he spent every weekend knocking at shops/buisness and so on looking for work. It is all he wants to do is work. Especially when he leaves school. On Saturday mornings he gets up to go to work with his dad. -His own accord of course, I'm happy for him to stop in bed and rest for a while but he always says remember to get me up!

5 I'm not going to say anything to the company. The lad is 6ft 2 and 14 years old and mens large in clothes. He doesn't want mum fighting his battles.

6 Funny enough since he has started work his predicted grades have gone up from a 'D' to 'B's' ( Go figure Confused )

OP posts:
FabbyChic · 05/05/2011 12:37

Your son is legally only allowed to work two hours on weekdays, he is being exploited.

See here

www.direct.gov.uk/en/YoungPeople/Workandcareers/Yourrightsandresponsibilitiesatwork/DG_066272

FabbyChic · 05/05/2011 12:37

He cannot legally work after 7pm!

FabbyChic · 05/05/2011 12:38

14 year olds
There are a lot of rules that control working hours of children, but the basic ones are:

during term time, you can only work for two hours on weekdays and Sundays
during term time, you can only work for five hours on Saturdays
during a school holiday, you can work for up to five hours on a week day or a Saturday
during a school holiday, you can't work for more than two hours on a Sunday
you cannot work before 7.00 am or after 7.00 pm on any day
ajourneyofgiraffes · 05/05/2011 12:40

Firstly be very proud that he is your son!
Then advise him to track over a month how much overtime he has done. He should take these figures to the owner so that he/she can see how much overtime is being done in a month. He shouldn't just show the figures but have some sort of a suggestion of how the situation can be improved (more staff, earlier start, less work, etc).

nijinsky · 05/05/2011 13:01

I agree they probably shouldn't be doing it, but what a great attitude your son has in that he's not a clock watcher. To get anywhere in most professions, he is going to have to put in what is technically unpaid work, and I would be careful if I were you not to instill the wrong attitude in him. Its not as if its even an hour of extra work and at 25 mins it cannot be raising a welfare concern that he isn't getting enough sleep.

PicaK · 05/05/2011 14:00

I admire your son actually. So many young kids just don't have any get up and go about them

I do have to ask tho, if there are any pretty girls also working a bit late.....

elphabadefiesgravity · 05/05/2011 14:09

Thats not legal. Children of school age are only allowed to work between the hours of 7am and 7pm.

FabbyChic · 05/05/2011 14:37

And only for two hours, he will not be covered by the employers insurance as they are breaking the law.

elphabadefiesgravity · 05/05/2011 14:40

Its only 2 hours on a Sunday I think.

howdoyoueatyours · 05/05/2011 14:54

I think the people who are congratulating this lad on not being a clock watcher are missing the point - he isn't given the choice.
I know that I have always worked a lot more than my contracted hours in every job I've done as I always arrive early and stay til the job is done but if I'd have had an employer who basically told me I HAD to work 30 mins free overtime on top I would have made it my business to be out of the door the second my shift finished.
I can't believe anyone thinks this is OK or that it should be allowed to continue. OP is your son supposed to be on the minimum wage because if he is and he's working extra for no pay then he won't be getting the minimum wage so that would be another way in which they are breaking the law (and fraudulently covering it up by amending his finishing time).

SardineQueen · 05/05/2011 15:18

In general I believe that give and take in employment is important and that a bit of overtime here and there (or even lots if you're on a salary commensurate and knew what you were letting yourself in for) is all par for the course.

In this case though I echo what tyler said so eloquently upthread: 30 mins on a 4 hours shift is taking the pee.

Then there is the whole legality side.

Original poster
upahill · 05/05/2011 18:04

UPDATE!
Once again thank you for the replies.
I'm going to chat with DH tonight about the job due to legal side of things.
The latest is that DS went for his wages and they have put extra in for him (more than the 2 x 25mins that he has done!)

It's a shame we are going to have to reconsider him working when it has made him thrive, improved his grades at school, I know where he is- what I mean by that is that he is not just hanging round with mates IYSWIM, he is saving every penny he earns, giving him a work ethinc and instilling a sense of loyalty eg he had to choose between a gig and going to work and because it was short notice he chose work not to let people down. He comes home knackered but happy and still gets up for school no problem.

He'll have to see if he can get a Saturday job.

And no there are no pretty girls there as someone suggested, just him, two lads and the older lady!! Grin

OP posts:
Hullygully · 05/05/2011 18:05

Don't reconsider, just explain to them that he really must finsih at 10 because of school

Original poster
upahill · 05/05/2011 18:10

Hully I meant the whole job. IF he shouldn't be working after 7.00 it will have to stop.

The company need someone in for those hours and if he is breaking the law it will have to finish and give the job to some one else.

OP posts:
FabbyChic · 05/05/2011 18:13

He cannot work after 7pm Hully it is illegal. He is not insured to work past 7pm.

Uphill, can they change his hours so he only works to 7pm?

Saturday jobs in supermarkets only go to those over 16. It is a shame you cannot do something about his hours.

FabbyChic · 05/05/2011 18:13

upahill your son is not breaking the law, the company is.

Hullygully · 05/05/2011 18:40

oh. Bum.

Hullygully · 05/05/2011 18:40

I'd pron break the law a bit, meself, if it is all as good as it sounds...

Original poster
upahill · 05/05/2011 18:51

(bloody wish he was there straight from school until bedtime tonight! I'm sick of him and DS2 bickering!!!) Grin

OP posts:
elphabadefiesgravity · 05/05/2011 20:51

It is silly in a way.

I run drama classes. A girl who used to attend the classes on a Friday night which ended at 7.30pm applied for a job helping in the little ones class and making the tea. But she could only stay til 7.00pm until the last Friday in June of Year 11.

But she could be there until as late as we wanted attending the class!

Eversoft · 05/05/2011 21:28

TBH, I cant belive you let your 15 year old son work till 10 at night, surly he should be in bed at that time not working, would it not be better for him to get a paper round or something??????

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