Minimum wage

[knittedbreast]

Is there anyone on here who dousnt agree that we should have a minimum wage? if so what are your reasons for it?

Oh yes, i forgot - good luck being able to plan for retirement on your income as above. there's no such thing as pension provision in there, there just isn't room.

Take advantage of the tax free ISAs? With what exactly? What spare cash is there, even if the will/effort is there?

And then the government have the cheek to complain that X percentage of workers aren't saving enough for retirement.

Beyond childcare, any student loans or previous debts, keeping your head above water on NMW right now, just how many of these people literally have enough cash left over at the end of the month to actually put some aside?

If there was a facebook style 'like' button on MN, frgaaah, I'd be hitting it right now for your posts, and yours SundayRose10. Spells it out in simple terms, hear bloody hear! I really really want to work, but until DD is in school there's no point whatsoever as I'd be earning £5.93 an hour and would be paying £8? an hour for childcare. The sums don't really work out there.

frgahhh, i actually consider the earnings you are talking about as quite good. there is enough to buy food and heating and rent. yes its miserable but its much more than many have to live on.

i was quite embarrassed the other day, i thought we were quite well off because i hadnt had to borrow money from my parents since my dp got his new job and felt rather well off even though we have almost nothing left over each month after rent and bills. that was until i was talking to a lady on couldnt get her head around how any one could manage off anything less than 40k a year as that was poverty. i dont think i need to say that our earnings are less than 40k...

i agree with the living wage, its someting the greens support quite strongly aswell. i never really realised just how depressing life/work situation could ever be. our family is pretty much trapped in circle we cant get out of, and more and more people are going to find themselves in it too

This is it knittedbreast, trapped totally.

Our parents generation (mine & DPs parents are just at retirement age) have been able to save, they were able to pay off their mortgages in their 50s, plough money into private pensions and know that they will be very comfortable financially throughout their retirement. However this generation (early 30s) is, well, fucked. Earning minimum wage means we can't save for a deposit on a house (we are both in a 'second relationship' having had to sell our houses upon splitting with our respective exes) so in 25 years time when our parents would have been mortgage-free we will still be facing the prospect of renting for the next 20/30 years. Our parents have state pensions each, plus both of our fathers have private pensions, my dad has several, so they can live very comfortably with no housing costs whereas we will have only the state pension (if there's anything still left in the pot in 30 odd years time). Recently MIL needed some tests but the nhs wait was so long they chose to pay for them privately. A luxury we will never have as we will still have rent to pay with a much lower income.

Both my parents & PIL are able to take 4 or 5 holidays a year. We'll be lucky to get one a year and we'll be scratching around for a £19 a night Travelodge (or the future equivalent). Also our parents are able to help us out financially, and I feel crap that 1. at 31 I should be old enough to stand on my own 2 feet and not still be relying on handouts from my parents and 2. I'm never going to be in the position to do the same for my children. If they're skint and need help with the rent, the only way I'll be able to help will be by not paying my own rent for that month. We're going to have to work well into our retirement whereas our fathers choose to do so as they'd be bored at home all day.

Our parents have got all of this on one wage. My mum hasn't worked since she had my brother 45 years ago, she didn't need to. They also didn't have handouts (HB top-ups, tax credits) that we have because, again they didn't need them. My dad earned enough as a van driver to keep a big house, and although we didn't have holidays (because my mum wouldn't stay away) we used to do a lot, go on lots of days out etc. Yet here we are, next generation, scratching around on minimum wage, in DPs case, and many others, with the responsibility on his head that a moments lapse in concentration could kill a heck of a lot of people, knowing that we have no future as we are totally unable to save for that.

26mins we are very similar to you. I am 25 and my dp is 27 we have both been to uni but just cannot afford to live really. Its so shit that we have no options. our rent is 800 a month for a tiny 2 bed house with damp that backs on to the motor way. I hate it. Im desperatly looking for another job because my part time sat and sun job takes me away from the children every weekend and he works over time every weekend so the children just dont see us together as a family. there is literally no work around here, well nothing i am qualified for anyway. i feel very sad actually, the council said there is a 9 yr wait for a council house and the areas they have them in are quite awful. id rather be this poor than live there (if you knew the areas you would understand).

i just dont know what to do anymore. :(

I get what you mean about the council estates. My parents have a caravan and we've always said that if our landlord served us our notice and we couldn't get a decent HA place we'd move into that before getting a council place. The only way we could work to keep chilcare costs down would be for me to be waitressing (I can earn £100 a night on tips, well I could 3 or 4 years ago, but I don't suppose people are tipping as much now as they were then), but then we would never be together. I would have to work all weekend and a few evenings in the week to get the best shifts to make it worthwhile, it's bloody hard work for minimum wage, and like you I'd rather we were together, even if it's just to take the DCs to the beach or the park than seperate all of the time.

You feel like you're stuck in a rut, DP lost his job a couple of years ago, but has managed to get a job back at the same company, although a different branch of it, now working more hours per week for £10,000 a year less . These companies have pretty much got you by the balls because they know you need to work and the job situation is such that you have to take what is offered. So now he's working his arse off for bugger all reward while the shareholders of the company are raking it in. We can't see a way out, we want our own business but with no way of saving to get the start up capital we don't see when or how that will happen. We're paying someone elses mortgage, which is made even harder as we have both had our own houses in the past. Oh it's so frustrating. Only the people in it can see it, those who sit in Whitehall making the rules cannot even begin to comprehend what it must be like to live on minimum wage. Perhaps they should try it some day .

knittedbreast, trapped, you've hit it in one

and whilst i know that poverty is relative (someone on NMW is quids in compared to a single 18 year old person who's just been let go but has no parental support e.g. my own cousin, who's so broke she's now having to move back to her parents in Glasgow despite having been in a secure flatshare in England for a year, working fulltime -she simply can't afford it)... it doesn't get around the fact that what 26minutes is still true:

in our parents generation, they were able to save a little, not spend extravagantly, and eventually pay off their own homes, support 1 person being off work for even a few years off work, on even modest incomes.

my best friend's dad was a postie - her mum has never worked - i don't remember her living in poverty - is that still true these days? i suspect not.

the rich are getting richer, and the poor are getting poorer. when was the last time in history there was such a thing as working poor if you had a fulltime job? i'm not sure if the term has been around much this CENTURY apart from in the last 10, 20 years. the gap between rich and poor is growing at a frightening pace.

people born in the 1940s, 50s, and 60s have truly had it all. in some cases, they have squandered it, but as a group they were very well looked after and had many of the opportunities and care that our generation - and even worse, the future generation - will only be able to DREAM about.