To think that virtually all children can be taught to sing

[reallytired]

A mother at my son's school has a dd who is two years old and another child who is nine. She is almost proud that either her children can sing in tune. She is very negative about the singing ablity of her two year old. I feel sad as I think the little girl doesn't stand a chance of learning how to sing. Its sad that her tempts at singing get such a negative response.

My son is good at singing and even gets paid to sing at weddings at the age of nine. (smug emoticon) He couldn't sing at two years old. He had no speech due to glue ear.

Learning to sing WELL was a skill he learnt, just like no two year old can ride a bike, swim, read or a whole host of skills we expect of older children.

I think that music helps a child in whole host of ways. It has improved my son's concentration, confidence and teamwork. I feel its sad that many parents nuture their children's musucal abliies.

" feel its sad that many parents nuture their children's musucal abliies."

Whoops I meant that I feel its sad that many parents do not value music or try to nuture their children's singing or musical ablitites.

I think some have more of a natural ability to sing and therefore learn more easily. I am a poor singer and have tried to improve (including some help from music teacher at school) but with little result. I expect if I'd had proper lessons as a child I would have been better but don't think it would have been easy. I can play an instrument so not totally unmusical either.

Of course 2 years is too early to judge (an write off) a child's ability though.

Some children are tone deaf. I don't know if they can be taught to sing as they just can't hear it.

I think there are many more parents who think their DCs can sing, dance, do whatever, and they should be in front of an audience at all times, preferably with a camera trained on them. Maybe that's what it is to be a parent, blind to little defects.

I agree that 2yo too late to write somebody off... however

I am somewhat tone deaf. I was very tone deaf as a child. I had to work for many years (decades) to overcome that.

It's very annoying I go onto music websites and you have to have a very thick skin when dealing with the arrogant naturals, those who have picked up an instrument easily and have utter contempt for people who don't play/learn so well or so easily. Plenty of people are friendly, mind, but for lots of people music comes so easily, they seem to think people like me are just being lazy. Which ironically I'm anything but, I've had to work so hard to learn to play or sing as badly as I do. I could not have done it with the first 16 years of my life.

I think natural musicallity has to do do with brain+ear shape, studies have shown?

While I think nurturing music is a great thing, I have also come to think (a big step from one coming from a musical family) that music is only one great and valuable thing that can be nurtured in children. My family felt we got it right because we all had music lessons and lots of singing at home- dh otoh thinks we missed out because we weren't taught to draw and paint, which is another invaluable way of learning to appreciate the beauty of the world around you. And a sporting family would not doubt feel that our sporting abilities, which are also important, were not properly nurtured.

fwiw my elder brother still can't sing, despite all the hours put in singing with him and teaching him to play instruments. I otoh sing quite well- not because I had better opportunities, but because I take after the musical side of my family.

Eek, I meant too early, not too late!!

I think many people have prejudices and pre-conceptions about music, and their own ability or lack of it. It's quite possible this mother feels bad about her own level of musical ability, perhaps because of other people's comments to her in the past.

For example, there was a post on here once from a parent concerned about the cost of his/her son's musical instrument for music lessons (fair enough), because "it's going to be a waste of money- he can't sing, so how could he play a musical instrument". (I must emphasise the poster in that case was a reasonable person, and was willing to discuss and reassess the subject further.)

Please do not write off a child at the age of two! I have 3 children, all of whom are very musical. The young two could both sing in tune at the age of two, but my older DD couldn't "hold a tune" until she was nearly four. Despite this she nagged for a violin of her own (she used to watch me practising) and I started to give her "lessons" at the age of four. She learnt quickly, and, by the time she was five she had learned the names of all the notes and to read them on the stave. It then became apparent, on commencing aural training in preparation for her ABRSM grade 1 exam, that she had perfect pitch! Which means, for those who are not particularly musical, that she could sing any note named, without recourse to a piano, pitch pipe etc and could name any note played or sung with her eyes closed!

Two is too early to assess ability in pretty much anything.

Most people can learn to sing vaguely in tune, but not everyone. Even so, those people almost certainly have other abilities worth encouraging.

Surely it depends what the child is interested in?
Lots of things improve a child's concentration, confidence and teamwork.
I don't get the music obsession really. Unless of course child is naturally fascinated by it.
I am very unmusical, cant sing, never played an instrument yet have been successful in life.
Odd.
Of course being mean to a two year old about anything she's trying to do is mean. Would be the same if the mum was talking about sport/drawing/talking etc.

I'm not tone deaf, and my voice has quite nice tone and timbre, apparently. However I am very, very bad at singing. Why? I have no sense of timing (I can't tell when you're supposed to start singing), and I can't hold a tune - if I try and sing in harmony with someone I just wander off my note and go and sit on theirs. Then my voice will just follow theirs like a stalker.

I doesn't bother me at all. Music is lovely but it's not the be all and end all. I think if you give children opportunities that's enough, and they can find their own way to what they love and are good at.

Far too early to tell if your DCs are good singers at the age of 2.

My two boys have beautiful voices (smug) but they did not get it from me. I am tone deaf and have never, even as a child, been able to carry a tune.

I have my own talents - nobody can be good at everything.

I wouldnt sack a kids ability off at any age, whilst they are still keen to engage, but i honestky cant think of anything less important

tis just for fun surely?

Sorry

I think most people can be taught to sing fairly well but not everyone would have a voice that others would pay to listen to!

Beyond silly to write a child off at two...

I just bought U-Sing for the Wii so my DDs singing talents are definitely being nurtured, along with my own

Is she negative about it when the 2 year old is around and can overhear her or is she perhaps just realistic?

I don't know honestly know anything about it so couldn't say if everyone can learn to sing or sing so that it is pleasant to listen to, I have no idea. Not every speaking voice is particularly attractive either though.

Dd used to sing in a lovely girls' choir and I had the impression they sounded fantastic in the group but not necessarily alone. I am not sure how that worked. I found it a shame when she chose to stop but maybe singing is not her world. There was one (just one mind you) girl in their age group who sang so that my hair would stand up all up and down my arms and neck. I don't think you can learn that. AFAIK they were all doing the same training but this little girl had something the others didn't have. Maybe she was being specially trained in addition to the choir, I don't know but I think it was probably just a natural gift.

Maybe this 9 year old is that type of a natural singer with a certain quality to her voice and by comparison the 2 year old maybe can learn to sing in tune but lacks that extra something? As I said though, have personally no idea about singing

"Then my voice will just follow theirs like a stalker"

Must be frustrating though. I have an ear for music and could pick out tunes on a toy piano aged three. I had lessons and I found that most instruments and theory all came naturally BUT I can not sing to save my life. I can hold a tune and harmonise but my voice has no range and just isn't nice to hear

Lots of children really can't sing though. Remember when you were at school there were "growlers"? They were brilliant to stand next to as you'd have a proper smile on your face but the monotone really put you off. I often wonder if those children can be taught. I'd like to think so - I'd feel so sorry for the ones who would be turning the piano music for the teacher year after year.

My son can sing to a respectible standard because he sings for about six hours a week. I think the difference between him and a top choister is that a top choir will practice for about 16 hours a week.

I think that children should only sing at this intensity IF they want to. There is a big difference between a child choosing not to sing and being told incorrectly that singing to a decent level is beyond them. I believe that children can be taught to sing reasonably.

I felt sad that a two year old was told that she could not sing. It hardly encouraging or confidence building or even kind.

At two the brain is still going through massive development so there's no way you can say a child that age is never going to be able to sing. TBH her words will be a self-fulfilling prophesy so her DD will grow up believing she can't sing, which means she won't try so won't be able to. It's that same with all sorts of things. Maths, reading, writing, sports, drawing....

There really is very little in a child's development that is fixed by genetics. Almost all of it is down to education and environment so any child who is encouraged and trained to sing will be able to.

Me and my DP are pretty musical, we have loads of instruments in our home but none of our kids have an interest at the moment. It amazes me at times 'cos when I was a kid if I'd have lived in a house with guitars, keyboards, ukuleles, mandolins, violins, clarinets, recorders...and with parents who knew how to play 'em I'd have been like a pig in shit!

However, I can not 'sing' by any standard, but I find it very enjoyable and relaxing. I couldn't imagine telling any of my kids that they couldn't sing, or reporting to other people, that they were rubbish at it. Or not singing even though I am shite at it

I was taught to sing, choir, hymn practice at school - can's sing a note. did enjoy the singing lessons though.

I had severe glue ear and was essentially deaf from 2-4. I taught myself to lip-read so it wasn't picked up on for ages. I can't carry a tune in a bucket: I'm so tuneless (and loud) that I can't even manage a passable 'Happy Birthday'. I also have a very poor sense of rhythm. There is no way that I will ever be a good singer.

Most children can learn to sing.
It's also about encouragement and getting the rigth pitch and training.

there are physical impairments which can make it hard/impossible to sing, but if there is none, then it shouldn't be hard.

There is actually a genetic basis to music, people who are tone deaf are generally tone deaf and will never carry a tune. However it does not preclude appreciating music or gaining pleasure from having a go at singing.

The former HT at my kids primary school set up a school choir for anyone to join. She used to talk about being told (as a child) that she couldn't sing and being excluded from music and how she was determined that shouldn't happen to a child in her school.

I remember someone laughing at my singing when I was a kid, and it really stung.

Singing is a sheer elemental pleasure, like laughing, eating or a good conversation and we should all be encouraged to enjoy it whether or not we can carry a tune.