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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

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Original poster

AIBU - to think my 12yo DD has been horribly exploited?

49 replies

RollonDueDate · 10/04/2011 10:48

Sorry to make my first post a rant but I am just so angry!

My DD signed up to do a paper round at the local corner shop. After waking up at 6.00 yesterday and told- we gave it to a boy (grrrr) she was told to return today (Sunday) at the same time.

After 2 hours she returned home sad and said they refused to pay her for completing the round today because it was a "demo day" and to come back next week. OH went politely with her to the shop to find out what the situation was and they sacked her!!

I was so angry I went to the shop myself ranting and raving about the rights of the workers and employment laws (mitigation: I am 8 months pregnant and it was early). Overall though I am just so angry about what this is suppossed to teach DD about the value of work and how you can be exploited if you are young, a girl or dare to complain - AIBU?

OP posts:

Meglet · 10/04/2011 12:45

As she's under 16 is there even a minimum wage for that age?

The international (200+ shops) high street chain I used to work for did 'demo' shifts for potential staff (regardless of age). Very bad practice IMO.

bullet234 · 10/04/2011 12:58

When I worked at a job centre, there was one window and door company that used to do this on a rolling aspect. They would ask for a trainee to come and do some telesales. Trainee was usually under the age of 20. At the end of two weeks, they would declare them not to be suitable and let them go. Then they would state that because the work had been done during training, they could not be paid. After the first two or three trainees had come back to the job centre complaining I lost any vestiges of professional detachment and told everyone who applied for the job exactly what the company was planning for them (strangely none of the trainees were told until the two weeks were up that it would be unpaid).

NoelEdmondshair · 10/04/2011 13:13

Get your DD to write a letter to the manager requesting payment for her work and stating that if it's not forthcoming within 30 days she will take them to the small claims court for the £4 plus expenses incurred through pursuing claim. This will teach your DD to stand up for herself if she's feeling exploited.

Rhinestone · 10/04/2011 13:30

This reply has been deleted

Message deleted by Mumsnet.

splashymcsplash · 10/04/2011 13:43

I believe under 16s are not allowed to work before 7am as well, so another law they are breaking.

Kandinsky · 10/04/2011 14:02

Sounds just the kind of story our local paper would love. Have you considered the affect of negative publicity on the shop of the photo of a 12 year old looking miserable outside the shop. I have always tried to instil a work ethic in my children and this is just pure exploitation which hardly helps your DD to see this.

Rhinestone · 10/04/2011 14:10

I will re-phrase my deleted message!

You should inform Trading Standards too. Plus if the shop owners do not have English as a first language then this might just be an innocent misunderstanding about employment law in this country and they will no doubt welcome some training.

asdx2 · 10/04/2011 14:14

I would advise you spread the word. When a new owner took over the local paper shop he started fining the kids for any mistakes, turning up late, not finishing quickly enough etc.
The lovely lad who delivered our papers had learning difficulties and appeared to be bearing the brunt of these sanctions and was eventually fired.
People were outraged and cancelled their deliveries and even though the lad was reinstated people didn't return and they stopped all deliveries.
The post office took over paper deliveries and the lad now works for them .

nectarina · 10/04/2011 14:14

It might seem annoying to go try to claim back four quid, but if you do it with dd you can show her how these things work and how to stand up for herself. In the long run you'll be teaching her very useful skills. Hopefully you can help her restore her confidence. Good luck!

Rhinestone · 10/04/2011 14:16

By the way MNHQ, if you deleted my message you may want to get on over to the 'stereotypes' thread.

GalaxyGuzzler · 10/04/2011 14:17

I would go to the shop and refuse to leave without your dd's pay, and inform every customer that comes in that the store is exploiting child labour. If they decide to call the police then you can pass on the info that they are employing underage children.

KatieMiddleton · 10/04/2011 14:27

Under 13s are not able to be employed. Exceptions are for sporting or entertainment jobs where a licence is required from the local authority.

Minimum way applies to anyone over 16 working in UK. Unpaid "demo" days are illegal and a claim for unlawful deduction of wages may be made via an employment tribunal (cheaper than county court).

In the OP's case I'd demanding the payment or you will be contacting the local authority about their illegal practices.

IloveJudgeJudy · 10/04/2011 15:16

I feel your pain. My DD was 13 and had stood in for my DS a couple of times then got her own round. The rounds all get £16 for 7 days. Anyway, when she came back after one week she was crying and eventually told me that he had only paid her £12.

I went straight round there and complained. I already had it in my mind what I would do, how I would escalate my complaint. He tried to argue with me at first, but then had to go to a couple of tills to get my DD's money. I think he was trying to do this with all the new paper rounds. I reckon the company was paying £16, but he was trying to pay them £12 and pocket the difference. I have also had trouble when they didn't want to pay the correct amount as my DD didn't pick up her money one week. I went straight around there for that, too.

I think you have to stand up for your DD and insist that they pay her for her work. I wouldn't mention that she should be 13 or that they should have given her a form. I would make a scene in the shop if they don't give it to you then I would got the trading standards or somewhere else. I would not let this lie.

Unfortunately, 12 yos are not allowed to do a paper round. They have to be 13 and a form has to be filled to go to the local council. The form includes the name of the school, too. the DC should be given a safety leaflet, too, giving the weight that they can carry at certain ages, too. Papers are getting heavier and heavier and sometimes DC have to split the round in half and go back for the second half. it's hard work but it's the only work they can do.

tomhardyismydh · 10/04/2011 15:26

from another perspective yabu to think its ok to allow a 12yr old to go out on the street and onto poeples property at 6am. especialy with such little knowledge about the specifics of the arrangement.

SkinittingFluffyBunnyBonnets · 10/04/2011 15:29

TESCO are you listening to what thefirstmersdevere said???? I shop in Tesco....I wil be finding more about this practice and if it is as bad as it looks I wont be going there again!

bellavita · 10/04/2011 15:36

I am sure you have to be 14 and have permission from school?

CheerfulYank · 10/04/2011 15:49

Poor thing! No YANBU and I would raise seven kinds of hell.

agedknees · 10/04/2011 15:49

I had to do 2 unpaid 'demo' days when I started nurse banking at a NHS hospital.

Wish I had known it was illegal because I had to pay car parking for an eight hour shift x 2.

bronze · 10/04/2011 15:56

i would give her the £4 myself and then grass the place up for emplying someone underage

agedknees · 10/04/2011 16:01

Yes, name and shame.

beesimo · 10/04/2011 16:12

A local lad had a weeks unpaid trial at a hotel down south worked very hard did very well asked to stay another 3 weeks without pay refused to work unpaid, so told to get his bags and go. Found out off waitress he was one of many that had happened to.

Strangely enough the very next week whole place had to shut costing them a packet as the main sewage drains had been blocked by some fool putting a sack of potatoes down into them.

All the toilets and drains backed up and flooded the ground floor it was a awful shame

MsScarlett · 10/04/2011 18:02

Perhaps they thinkthey can get away with it as they didn't pay her so in essence did not employ her? Which makes it in fact slavery!

SugarPasteFrog · 10/04/2011 18:18

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

Original poster

RollonDueDate · 10/04/2011 20:51

Just to follow up from my original post:

DD was really heartened by the comments on here - so thanks mumsnet for your rallying support!

Not sure if I can name the shop/area on here but we live in a pretty quiet leafy London suburb and she well knows the area so we are not quite as neglectful as tom hardy implies .

On return to the shop she was given £2 for her services (TBH I think this makes me even angrier!) and I was informed that she will not be continuing as she was "not up to it" even though she was asked back right up until she asked to be paid.

DD says that she has seen another 12yo girl on their round so I am definitely taking this further with Kingston LA as I suspect this is a ruse for free labour.

Horrified to learn how widespread the "demo day" con is - I suppose the only bright side is that she has learned the value of contracts

OP posts:

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