that it drives me nuts when childless friends call over to visit and end up disciplining my toddler in front of me!!!

[doradaisy]

Hi,
maybe I'n being totally crazy but i HATE when two certain friends/ex worker colleagues of mine call over to my house and start correcting and, to my mind, nagging my 3 and half year old. both work in teaching/education and consider themselves 'experts'!! i just find it very patronising, and it grates on my to listen to it. am in a vulnerable position prob as i also have 8 month old twins so don't have as much time to play with my toddler. she actually quite a good child, she's in a montessori and is no trouble but can be a bit hyper when people come to visit and is still very toddler in lots of ways, like this afternoon, so called friend was giving out to her when we were having lunch as my daughter wanted to eat the turkey slices out of the sandwich and friend said 'is that the way you eat a sandwich?"!! i also set up painting activity for my daughter and other friend gave out to her for not doing it 'properly' as my daughter wanted to use her fingers and paint all over plastic sheeting i had put out on her small table she was doing painting on.
i mean, do they expect children to sit in the corner and not move, to sit politely and not interrupt!!! or not make a mess, etc. or is my daughter a total dilenquent and am i not doing a good job with discipline!! it's like her naughtiness is highlighted by these two friends (who are not real close friends) or am i being too sensitive/unreasonable?? i've had an incredibly hard few months with the twins as my husbands work long our. i just find it SO annoying these 'armchair' parents who swoop in to my life with advice/nags and think they know it all. I feel like saying 'you try it!!!" and the funny things is for people who work in education, they have very little patience for my daughter and are not age appropriate. I mean a 3 and half year old will not sit down for an hour listening to adult chat and not open theri mouth!! ok, rant over with (for now!!) sure felt goo to get this off my chest.

What she's doing sounds perfectly normal to me!

I have a three and a half year old too, and am very of your twins! :) But no, YANBU. I would just say "oh, she's fine. Go ahead, sweetie," and leave it at that.

Their expectations are out of whack - clearly only used to older children. I don't blame you at all for feeling this way. Can you redirect them, like a naughty child - "oh don't worry about her sandwich, I can deal with that - tell me all about the latest film you saw / date you went on (?)/ book you read" sort of thing.

I have a crazy MIL who when visiting would go "RIGHT" and police the children while they were eating and have a fit if they weren't eating "before it got cold". I had to say "Now you go and talk to DP - and I will deal with the kids meal" with a big old smile.

you could hand them one of the twins and get them distracted that way?

Hope vaguely helpful

YANBU, but these two "friends" are getting to you at the moment, aren't they? So, maybe leave it a few months before you meet up again with them with your DCs in tow.

In the meantime, can you see them in the evenings, perhaps? They sound like they are damaging your confidence and that, in my experience, is a very tiring and draining experience. Who needs that?

Your dd sounds just fine btw.

It sounds to me like you're maybe taking it to heart a bit much. If these are the "worst" examples of what they do it doesn't sound too bad. In fact to me it's not disciplining her, it's gently guiding her towards the correct way of doing something. I know the things they are correcting are things you are not bothered by, but it's not going to hurt her to be told the "right" way. It's not a criticism of her or you, if they work in education they probably do it as a reflex! They aren't saying she's naughty and they aren't saying you are doing a bad job.

I think maybe your reaction is coloured by the fact you have a huge amount on your plate at the moment, and perhaps have that secret fear that we all get sometimes that maybe we are not doing such a great job. I bet you are though, go easy ion yourself... and I'm sure your friends would be upset to know they were upsetting you.

Yanbu! Teaching children and having children is different. If they do not have children at all they really have no clue!
I agree about having them over in evenings etc and also just wait for them to have kids and see the realise how hard it is...

Ps when they do this make some jokey yet slightly sarcastic remark how differently people see things once they have kids?!

Tell them ' Teacher hat off'
It's what my children say to me when they think I've confused where I am and what I'm doing.
They think they are being helpful, when in fact they are just being tactless.
Your DD sounds lovely to me.

Have they actually had their own children?

Agree with Dilbertina.

"to me it's not disciplining her, it's gently guiding her towards the correct way of doing something."

Gentle guidance is part of discipline - it's not all about rewards and punishments, that's just a small part. Semantics though.

I agree with distracting them from the issue e.g. say "Oh would you mind grabbing twin X for me?" or if that doesn't work then just straight up undermining them - "You can eat the sandwich any way you like, DD" or making a joke of it "It's a 3 year old way to make a sandwich!" - it does just sound as though their behaviour expectations are not age appropriate.

I wouldn't suggest undermining them if they had children of their own there BTW.

YABABU. It all sounds quite kindly meant. To honest though with a toddler and 8 month old twins I think it'd be a bit much to expect you to be completely reasonable :)

Dunno what not having children of their own has to do with it, mind. Not all parents are instinctively brilliant at child management, and not all child-free people are clueless blunderers.

Finally I think you need about five of these

I do not understand op like these. Surely if it bothers you, these are your friends and you are in your own home then you would mention it to them.

It does not have to be an argument or a big deal, just say " please don't correct her, she is only 3"

How could anyone be offended by that.

I know/am related to a lot of teachers. DD is only 16mo so I don't get too much of this, but one in particular can't seem to help herself. I usually just say "Oh don't worry, she's allowed to do that." then try to change the subject quickly.

I am expecting it to get worse as DD gets a bit older tho, so I am making a mental note of "Teacher hat off!" get the feeling it might get used a lot!

Oh, and YANBU :)

YANBU.
Neither are they.
Nothing on this earth is worse (and I speak as a mother, as well as a teacher) of going to see an adult friend, and having the entire visit dominated by their child, of whatever age.

Obviously they know you have 3 little ones, so if that's their feeling (like mine would be!) then they shouldn't come.

I'd NEVER invite teacher friends over - because they're always in role.

I don't see a problem, if you don't like it-don't invite them!
I don't think it hurts the DC, it is never a good thing to let them think that only mummy can correct them because it simply isn't true. I'm all for 'it takes a village......'

It doesn't sound like they did they did anything unreasonable to me, unless these were the only things they said to her while they were round, I mean if they come round and chat to her and interact with her then some guidance is likely to come up, it seems pretty natural.

If they think a 3 year old experimenting by putting the paint on the plastic is the wrong way to do it I really really hope they don't work in Early Years!

My MIL used to do this until I started to intervene and say things like "No it's ok darling, you can eat your sandwich in whatever order you like" or "You're enjoying exploring the different patterns the paint makes on the plastic too aren't you sweetheart". I then moved the conversation swiftly on so she didn't have an opportunity to comment further.

YANBU and hopefully if you challenge these so-called experts a couple of times they'll realise that you're perfectly capable of parenting your own child and it's their company you are seeking, not their teaching skills.

I agree - I remember when DD was around 2 and a friend came over. She drew her a picture, I asked what it was and she said 'cat!'. My friend said 'now, red's DD, that doesn't look very much like a cat does it? A cat has two ears and a tail...' and she then proceeded to draw a cat all over DD's picture! DD was not impressed...

I think when you work professionally with kids you have a "way" of talking to them that you just can't help sometimes. I catch myself doing it with ds when he's grating on my nerves but I work with secondary kids and he is only 17 months old e.g. I'll say something stupid like: "that wasn't a very sensible way of doing x, let's think of a different way we could do x"

I am infinitely worse with SIL's children when they play with my child and am very anal about whose "turn" it is (often to the detriment of ds, who must wonder why I spend so much time sticking up for his cousins' right to whatever's the latest object of desire). I can absoloutely imagine from this that my SIL might think I "judge" her because I will discipline her kids in the sense of saying something about whose turn it is to do x or telling them not to snatch, but I don't see it that way at all. I apply the same rules to ds and to my mind, I only "intervene" where I feel she is too far away to do something herself e.g. they are trying to gouge eachother's eyes out and I am right there and she is not! I would never have imagined it was being anything but helpful!

Professional "questioning" of children is very different e.g. "is that the way to make a sandwich?" isn't necessarily implying , it's just a way of talking to them about sandwiches.

Also, remember their experience of kids IS in educational settings where even nursery kids are expected to do things in certain ways e.g. when it comes to painting/eating etc. It's not reasonable of them to expect a young child to behave at home as they do at school, but on the other hand, how would they know that it wasn't? They can only act in accordance with their own experience. They probably think they're being helpful, you know - helping you avoid mess! I really, really doubt they judge your parenting - they just have a particular "style" of interaction with kids that is different to yours because they are acting as professionals and you are a mother. Don't worry about it for one second more and don't fall out with them about it - though maybe tell them that you're feeling a wee bit sensitive about things!

I don't think the friend with the sandwich comment necessarily meant any harm. It depends of course on her tone of voice, but to me, it just sounds like a general "oh you prefer to take it to pieces do you?" rather than a telling off. Might she just have been trying to think of something to say to the child?
I would, in all honesty, be pretty if I'd gone to visit a friend (presumably in my time off if I am, as you say, working in education myself) and she set up such a messy, hands on, needing to be supervised by an adult thing as painting though.
I'll repeat, I honestly don't think it's anything to do with them being teachers. (I worked in another area for years and still felt the same about children tbh) It's to do with an adult, going to visit another adult, but the time being monopolised by a child. Nothing wrong with that, and of course the child is going to want to be the centre of attention (until they are about 21 if you ask me ) but both parties, the child-having and the child-free need to give a little.

What dilbertina said. Your friends don't sound that bad to me, at least they are engaging with your daughter which is more than some visitors do!

I don't think YABU, but neither are they.

I have had the same with one friend in particular. He had always been rather overbearing with DD, but when I said anything at all, he would just say 'I'm not having that!!'
It came to a head for me when we were walking through the town one morning, I had a quick errand to do, and on the way back to the car, DD saw some pigeons strutting along and toddled after them saying 'Hello bird, Hello bird.'
I thought it was sweet that she was saying 'Hello bird' and was saying 'Awww, Hello bird' and was smiling but this particular friend decided to grab DD by the hood of her coat, swing her around quite forcefully and physically steered her in the direction we were walking in.
I sternly told friend 'It's fine, Can't you wait 2 minutes while she says Hello to the birds.'
Friend responded 'We dont have all day, she should do as she's told!' and refused to let go of DD's hood. After a few seconds, DD began to cry and was struggling to free herself and no matter how much I protested and asked him to leave DD alone, he ignored me. He scooped DD up and strode back to the car.
I have not spoken to this friend since. This was the latest in a long list of things this friend had done, and yes, he is a stay at home dad to a 7 year old DS, so not always childless people who do this.