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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

was ibu to have said something to the vet?

28 replies

bubbub · 09/03/2011 22:11

was going to collect dd1 from preschool with dd2 who has a dogdar of 20 paces, she is dog mad! screaming dogdogdog before ive even had a glimps of a tail.
we stopped outside the vets waiting for another mum to finish at the shop when a guy comes out the vets with a huge husky dog on a metal chain lead, dd goes into meltdown, dogdogdog!
yes i say, lovely dog.
the dog walks calmly about half a foot ahead of the man, who screams at it, then whips it with a metal chain on the face!
im stunned and dd goes silent.
guy proceeds to walk, then whacks the gog in the face with the chain (a hefty chain) again, this time i really didnt get what the dog had done wrong. dog whimpered. dd starts to cry.
so i popped into the vets and said, im sorry i know this is none of my buisness but the guy with the husky that just left just hit the dog in the face twice with a metal chain, and i felt i had to say something, it wasnt a light tap and it worried me, she said really condesendingly, yeah, i saw, he is just controlling the dog, its perfectly normal" and laughed.
so i appologised and went (didnt have time to say anything eles as had to get dd1)
i dont know what i expected but is this really normal behaviour condoned by vets?! is that what it takes to tain a dog? i dont have one so i dont know.
i just worried that if thats how he treats it in public, what does he do behind closed doors, but also thats the kind of behaviour that would make a normaly docile dog turn into an agressive dog? was i unreasonable to say anything? or were they unreasonable for kind of laughing at me?

OP posts:
Original poster
bubbub · 09/03/2011 22:13

sorry for my appalling spelling and grammar.

OP posts:
hellymelly · 09/03/2011 22:15

That is horrible! and really shocking that the vet wasn't bothered by it.Good that you at least tried to do something.I once saw a dog being hit by a man dragging it about and shouting at it,but he clearly had a mental health problem and looked extremely frightening.I wasn't sure what to do,on a towpath,no-one else about,and the thought of that poor dog haunts me 10 years later.Sad

squeakytoy · 09/03/2011 22:15

I assume you didnt talk to the vet, but the receptionist? She is talking utter fucking bollocks.

I would ring again and ask to speak to the actual vet.

strandedpolarbear · 09/03/2011 22:16

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

curlycarla · 09/03/2011 22:17

i would agree with squeaky toy! don't know what the vet can do about it but you will feel better knowing that you at least tried!

Original poster
bubbub · 09/03/2011 22:17

the worrying thing is that, yah the woman i spoke to was the receptionist but the vet was stood leaning against the wall facing her, as they were having a chat when i walked in. she was listening to it all, and joined in the laughter at the end.

OP posts:
neverforgethowmuchiloveyou · 09/03/2011 22:19

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

Original poster
bubbub · 09/03/2011 22:19

if i was on my own i would have said something, my dh hates it cos i always speak first think later, but he wasnt a pleasant looking guy and dd2 was with me, and already upset, i couldnt take the risk. plus i live in swindon. awful lot of nutcases round ere

OP posts:
Original poster
bubbub · 09/03/2011 22:22

i think i will call them because, i know excactly the dof breed, and the excact time he was at the vets so im sure if they made enquiries they could find out who he was.
i only wonder if the vets would be forthcoming with any info.
and i wonder if they knew him, like a friend of even a hubby, seems strange how quick she was to defend his actions.

OP posts:
Mare11bp · 09/03/2011 22:23

Ring the RSPCA. Can't imagine the vet wants to report one of their customers in these hard times which probably explains their attitude. The vets will have to cooperate with the RSPCA.

YANBU

Original poster
bubbub · 09/03/2011 22:23

or even a hubby god i need to do a typing course!

OP posts:
edam · 09/03/2011 22:23

that's a good idea from neverforget about going to the RSPCA. I can't understand why the vet thought this was acceptable but definitely worth cross-checking with the RSPCA, who will be able to make enquiries.

OKComputer · 09/03/2011 22:24

That's awful. :(

Good on you for speaking up. It's so difficult to know what to do, and I think you did the most sensible thing, for what it's worth. Short of filming him on your phone, it's an impossible situation.

Your poor DD having to see that too.

Vallhala · 09/03/2011 22:25

What the fuck? Angry

I'd have wrapped the chain around his head! Angry He'd have lost his dog there and then, that's for sure.

I can only suggest that if the practice is one of a group of vets you contact their head office and ask them to both train (preferably sack) their staff and to identify the dog-owner. I'd also be inclined to report the vet's attitude to the BVA although the chances are they will do sweet FA.

Not that identifying him will help much as they won't tell you who he is and without that there is nothing you can do... :(

Poor, poor dog. :(

Underachieving · 09/03/2011 22:26

YANBU, I don't have a clue what the woman at the vets thought was normal about hitting a dog in the face with a chain. If you can't control an animal without violence in my oppinion you can't control it at all and you shouldn't have it. Sadly I don't think the vet can or will do much about it, but you were DNBU to have tried.

squeakytoy · 09/03/2011 22:30

I was wondering too if the dog beater was a friend or relative of the twunt you spoke to.

I really would not be happy with the reaction you got from them, and would definately take it further.

You do not hit a dog in the face with anything, ever.

Vallhala · 09/03/2011 22:34

Another idea is to ring the Dog Warden local to the vet (you can tell I have little faith in the RSPCA, hence I've not bothered to suggest them!).

I'm absolutely horrified that it should have happened, to say nothing of the vet's attitude, though nothing regarding animal cruelty surprises me any more.

If I were in your shoes I would name and shame the vet's practice here and now.

squeakytoy · 09/03/2011 22:38

I also wouldnt telephone,I would email. I would really not let this rest. I absolutely detest cruelty to animals.

hephaestus · 09/03/2011 22:43

i know excactly the dof breed

I have nothing useful to add to what has already been said (by Valhalla particularly) but just wanted to point out that if it was a 'huge' dog it is very unlikely to be a husky (they are a lot smaller than people imagine) and most probably a malamute or even an akita instead. Just thought this needed saying in case it helps with identifying the dog to any kind of authority.

manticlimactic · 09/03/2011 22:51

I was just about to post the same hephaestus

Sounds like a malamute - the 'in' breed at the moment.

Joolyjoolyjoo · 09/03/2011 22:55

That sounds horrible, and I'm surprised at the vet condoning it.

problem for vets is, we are bound (to some extent) by client confidentiality, so the vet probably wouldn't want to discuss it with you. The only get-out clause we have re confidentiality is if we suspect or witness abuse. The problem is the vet can't really report to the RSPCA based on 2nd hand information, but YOU are well within your rights to report to the RSPCA.

the problem THEN is that the RSPCA can only judge on the condition of the dog. If the dog seems to be well-looked after and is being taken to the vets and has no wounds or injuries to prove that what you saw actually happened, they can't actually make a case- it would be your word against his.

fifi25 · 09/03/2011 22:56

My mams Husky was huge, if that helps. I would ask to speak to practice manager on the phone.

Joolyjoolyjoo · 09/03/2011 23:13

I would honestly say there is no point in trying to involve the vets. They have no more powers than anyone else when it comes to cruelty charges. If it came to court, they could be obliged to give evidence regarding the client, but they are unlikely to be able to add anything other than that the dog is regularly vaccinated, in good body condition, receives treatment etc.

The proper channel would be the RSPCA (SSPCA in SCotland), but unless the dog has marks/ wounds scars, it is very unlikely they would be able to do much either.

No, the vet shouldn't have seemed like she was laughing at you, but there is really nothing that she can do. We get loads of people coming to us to complain that their neighbour's cat is neglected because it is often out at night/ in the snow, even a woman who came in demanding that we do something about a lonely calf she saw in field- we can't do anything! And sometimes, unfortunately, we do take people's concerns with a pinch of salt- that woman might have a grudge against her neighbour, the calf may have been isolated due to illness etc. We can't really go around commenting on things that are brought to us second hand, especially if it contradicts client confidentiality.

edam · 09/03/2011 23:18

jooly, point is the vet knows who the owner is. So if the OP reports this to the RSPCA, they can contact the vet and get the owner's address. Even if no action is taken (and we don't know that until it's reported) then at least the owner will be aware that this treatment is not acceptable and that people WILL complain. And if there are any further incidents (God forbid) that initial complaint will be on record.

Joolyjoolyjoo · 09/03/2011 23:29

Well, the vet might be able to give the address to the RSPCA, but not without consulting with the VDS (veterinary defence society) first. If the vet voluntarily gives out this info, she could be struck off if the there is no case to answer and the client complains to the Royal college. I don't make the rules...

Thing is, the OP saw one snapshot of this man and his dog. The vet might know that the guy is a very concientious and loving owner- maybe he is a regular client. OK, his "training" techniques don't sound great, but it's possible (and I'm just playing devil's advocate here) that the guy rattled the chain in the dog's direction to distract it, and to the OP it seemed he hit the dog. She says the dog "whimpered", but it could be argued (again, being devil's advocate!) that had he really whacked the dog, as she describes the dog would have yelped (ever accidentally stood on a dog's tail/ paw?)

If the RSPCA decidede to follow the case up, then they could contact the vet- computer records will be able to realistically ID the guy, even if the vet has forgotten the incident. If the request came from the RSPCA, it would likely mean that they had found evidence of cruelty, and then the vet would legally be able to release his details. But until then, the vet has to stay out of it. That's just the way it works. Vets treat patients, RSCPA investigate cruelty cases. Sometimes we work together, but it sounds like the vet has reason to believe this man is not (from her pov) mistreating the dog (possibly based on a long relationship with both client and dog)

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