Tax credits and data protection!! Surely there should be exceptions!

[BlueRuby]

About 6 months ago my cousin had a stroke. Physically she has made a really good recovery but her speech is still affected. I and other members of the family can understand her but strangers sometimes struggle.

She needed to speak to the tax credits today and asked me to speak on her behalf. Even though she was there and was giving me permission to be her spokes person they wouldn't speak to me. The lady was adamant that cousin came on the phone even though I explained the situation. In the end my cousin had to face the humiliation of trying to make herself understood, the lady couldn't understand her so the said she couldn't talk to her because she'd failled the security questions. And of course she wouldn't speak to me either AHHHHH

I would complain. Normally there is some way around it.

That must have been horribly frustrating and upsetting for your cousin. Presumably she now has to write to them? If so, I'd raise this in the letter, saying they should train their staff to respond appropriately to clients with speech difficulties. Tax credits helpline must have some procedures for ensuring they do not treat people less favourably as a result of disability, or they would be in breach of the DDA.

I would ask them if they would accept a letter from your cousin giving you permission to deal with her tax credits - they should surely be able to put a note on the account stating this.

Secondly I would complain that the adviser, although not being able to speak to you today, did not find out other ways that this could be dealt with.

I think you will need to write to them.

I must admit that when we had similar problems with MIL and water company who wouldnt let dh speak on her behalf, i/SIL would answer the security questions then pass phone over to dh

I know its dishonest but it was the only thing that worked we sent letter ins etc. and nothing else ever worked

I have worked in this situation and there are ways round it if you can be bothered t make the effort. Your cousin can send a letter in issuing you as a third party they can talk to, and they should postpone any issues till then.

We have written a letter and got it posted straight away. I think I'm more frustrated because I wasn't asking them to give me Amy information. We just needed to tell them that her working hours have decreased.

I have this problem with my ds and his mobile phone account, he cant speak to them and im not allowed to speak on his behalf. It is maddening!!!

I really sympathise. I don't have major issues like you've described but I find talking to tax office staff extremely patronising and frustrating. They seem to think that because I get tax credits - a whole £33 a month - I am stupid. I am not, just chose to give up a very good job to bring up my family.

I have come off the phone in tears after one conversation with them.

Definitely complain.

You get your cousin to write all the information down that you need, you get someone else to ring and pretend they are her in your cousins presence so she knows, and you deal with it that way.

Or you phone and say you are her.

I used to deal with the Tax Credits office regularly as part of my job and they were dreadful jobsworths. I dealt with lots of agencies including social services and tax credits were the most unhelpful.

I had one case where I needed to inform them that 5 children were no longer living with the claimant. Other agencies accepted my information but tax credits refused to talk to me and would only take the information from the claimant. As a compulsive liar who stood to lose hundreds of pounds, the claimant hardly had any incentive to talk to tax credits. Idiots.

OP - they aren't even bound by data protection because you're not asking for information! You're providing them with info. Make a complaint and send a copy addressed to their data protection officer.

Gallic that's what I thought!

Fabby, that is really naughty but absolutely brilliant! If I put the phone on speaker my cousin will be able to hear everything they say too!

It might be worth your cousin giving you a power of attorney - this is a document giving you legal authority to deal with her financial affairs on her behalf. It doesn't mean you are obliged to take over her finances to the exclusion of your cousin, but would mean that you had legal authority to speak on her behalf. A lawyer should be able to prepare one quite cheaply though your cousin would need to instruct the lawyer not you. An ordinary or "general" power of attorney is a simple document and shouldn't cost much (though a "lasting power of attorney" - which would continue to be effective if she ever lost mental capacity is much more complex and expensive)

After the child benefit data loss incident, that was all over the press, HMRC brought in lots of data security policies. When someone calls in, you have to ask lots of questions and can only speak to the person concerned or a third party with written authority. Managers quality check you all the time to make sure you only speak to authorised people. Having said that, if you just wanted them to put some info on the file, they might have been able to do that? Or they could have asked you to write in so they could put something on file that they can talk to you.

I don't work for HMRC, but I do have to work with similar constraints under the data protection act

Whilst it would have been helpful if they'd explained a bit better.
Unless your cousin has given her express permission, be that in writing or verbally, it is against the law to discuss the persons details. Its the individual not the company who are prosecuted too, so it's not just being a jobsworth.

I think your best bet is to get your cousin to send out a standad letter giving you power of attourney and you can then deal with these things easily

Thing is, MrsMoo, Blue's cousin was right there and did give her permission. Only the tax credits woman couldn't understand her. Because Blue's cousin has had a stroke, which is why she asked Blue to help make the call in the first place...

Tax credits MUST have systems in place to comply with the Disability Discrimination Act. It is unlawful for them to treat Blue's cousin unfairly as a result of her disability. Only that is exactly what happened. Blue's cousin is unable to make herself easily understood as a result of her disability, yet the TC person forced Blue's cousin to follow a process designed for people who do not have speech difficulties and left her without the service to which she is entitled.

The tax credits woman should have acknowledged there was an issue and explained what procedures they have available for clients with disabilities.

I have to put my son on the phone, he confirms various things, then they will talk to me to sort things out.

If you want to do it for her she must either write to them, or you must become her Appointee.

I remember doing this when I rang Virgin about something when I lived with exP and the bill was is in his name but I set up all the security questions because could never be arsed sorting things like that out.

I rang first and they said they couldn't talk to me so I put the phone down and rang again, getting someone else. When they mentioned I had to be the account holder and not his wife I acted appalled and said I was insulted he thought I sounded like a woman.

I ring up for my mum, who's 80, all the time and most places will let me speak on her behalf once she has answered the security questions (that I have written down for her to read out!).

Hi, at the risk of being shunned by the whole of Mumsnet I work for the dreaded tax credits. Data protection is a massive priority (especially with the amount of identity theft which goes on these days). If the person is there and can answer all the security questions they can ask for someone to speak on their behalf, but if they cannot answer the questions clearly (which sadly seems to be the case here) the advisor was correct in not discussing a persons tax credits information with any third party. The person can write in giving consent for someone else to act on their behalf or they could go with a representative to an enquiry centre. This does seem like unnecessary red tape but these precautions are vital in protecting all of our personal information.

(and we're not all dreadful jobsworths, just people trying to do a difficult job as best we can)

Hi read back my post .... I meant if the agent on the phone could be bothered to make the effort btw not you and your cousin.

Also if it is a case of giving them details if they are asking you to answer security quesstions they have found the file, be authoritative and say I am calling to give you this information you do not have to speak to me but I expect this information to be noted and recorded. Also say you are noting time of call and agents name then as calls are recorded you can prove you gave them the info needed. All the other posters are correct dp is not needed to pass on info.