stopping the tv license?

[skybluepearl]

Not quite AIBU but wanted to post here due to high traffic.

We don't watch that much TV and have a limited number of channels due to living in a hilly area. On the whole TV seems quite seems rubbish these days. I do really enjoy sitting down to watch a film and the odd interesting programme though. The kids have a maximum of one hours screen time each day -they choose between wii/computer/TV.

I'd really like to rejig things. Maybe stop paying the TV licence/stop watching TV and join love films? Have thought about maybe watching i-player on TV through the Wii - but am not sure if we still have to pay our TV licence for this?

How are things set up in your house if you don't watch normal telly? How did you find making the change?

networkguy are you certain about the ability of investigators to detect TV viewing?

Years ago I collared a TV licensing prosecutor at court and asked him if they really had the means to detect TV signals in the way in which they have sometimes claimed. Needless to say I didn't get an answer but he did tell me that as far as he was aware the only proscutions that had ever occurred were where investigators had been invited into the property and the TV had been viewed as working or admissions had been made.

'certain' - no, but know enough about electronics to know you can detect local oscillator, and with various frequencies in the appropriate spectrum it would not be difficult to rig up a frequency counter with the offset of the local oscillator.

Since analogue signals have been on fixed frequencies for years, and would all be available to any detector operator, it would be possible to determine which TV station was most likely to be being received (or recorded). Of course, proximity is key here, because in an average street there may be two semis, each with a TV and VCR either side of a wall, near one another.

For that reason, a set of rose bushes outside your front windows would perhaps hamper the TV man sufficiently for him to be unable to be close enough to know if VCR or TV was on in your home, as he could be getting signals from next house.

Next step would be the doorstep "Can I come in?" and followed up with the threat "If not, I will have to get a warrant and have a police officer in attendance." - I think the suggestion of a tea-time visit from the Police might be enough to make most people admit/allow entry.

Thanks networkguy.

I would love to hear if anyone had direct experience of the matter.

Certainly my experience of their approach re gaining access is that they are manipulative and dishonest and I can imagine they scare an awful lot of people with their approach.

nancydrew I've done the exams for an amateur radio licence, and part of the course described the theory and practice of locating signals like this - you can definitely do it.

You can locate them but you cannot document them nor give a precise location, hence when my cousin asked for the proof to be shown in court it was thrown out.
People just admit liability when faced with somebody in uniform, the same as if we all went to court over parking tickets the whole system would grind to a halt.

We went without a tv for a year. I wrote to the TV licensing department telling them we did not use our TV. They acknowledged the letter and stopped sending any warning ones, but asked us to resume paying if we ever stated using the TV again.

You can watch iplayer, just as long as you are not watching live TV.

Go for it.

Oh I know you can do it.

What I am interested in is if the TV licensing authority actually use anything that detects signals because I strongly suspect Mama is correct that people simply make admissions when faced with someone in authority.

We cancelled our TV licence over a year ago. Contacted the licensing people who said that as long as we de-tuned the TV that was fine. So we did.
We use LoveFilm and watch DVDs probably twice a week. I watch a bit of rubbish on iplayer when I feel like it to relax. The rest of the time we talk to each other, read, surf the web (too much probably). Don't miss the TV licence - it was a waste of money for us as we were turning it on perhaps twice a year. And I hate watching adverts, having my viewing dominated by the scheduling rather than choosing when we want to watch something. So go for it.

Why would anyone not want to pay for a TV Licence?

The licence fee is what makes the quality of our TV and radio head and shoulders above 99% of other countries' output.

Fox News is "free".

Italian TV is "free".

The BBC is not perfect but but it's an absolute national treasure that we should be proud of; let's not chip away at it pointlessly.

You don't have to have a TV Licence if you have a TV. We didn't have the TV Licence for 4 years when living in the UK and had a TV for DVDs and games.

Got inspected every year, they always sent the same man, poor guy. It turned into a running joke.

In our first flat in the UK we had the TV licence and the TV was shit, really really purile crap. So we decided we were not paying for it anymore. Simply let them know and didn't plug the TV into the aeriel/tune it.

Not read all the posts but here are the rules

Who needs a television licence

You need a TV Licence to use any television-receiving equipment to watch or record TV programmes as they are being shown on TV. These include programmes on the BBC, ITV, Channel 4, Channel 5, cable and satellite television. Television-receiving equipment includes:

* TV sets
* set-top boxes
* DVD recorders
* video recorders
* computers and laptops
* mobile phones or other battery-operated devices
* games consoles.

You don't need a television licence if a TV set cannot receive TV programmes and is used only:

* for close circuit monitoring
* for watching pre-recorded videos or DVDs
* as a computer monitor ? see under heading You don't use your television set or other device to watch or record broadcast programmes.

You don't need a TV licence if you only ever watch catch-up services, like BBC i-Player, that let you watch programmes after they have been broadcast.

A television licence allows the person named on it and any member of their household to use one or more television sets or video or DVD recorders at the address covered by the licence. If you are covered by a licence at your home address you are also covered to use a battery-powered device, such as a laptop or mobile phone, to watch live TV when you are away from home.

If you only have a black and white television, you only require a black and white television licence. If you have a colour television, a DVD recorder or video recorder, you will require a colour television licence. This will apply even if the DVD or video recorder is used with a black and white television set.

I believe they do not have vans any more it is assumed that you have a TV, if you buy a new TV you get asked for your name and address

nancydrew a few years ago through work I met the powers that be involved in TV licensing. I asked about the detector vans and they literally fell about laughing.

I was told that prosecutions were (at that time) based on television sales (ie notification by the shop selling the television to the licensing authority) followed by a cross-check to see if the purchaser had a licence, followed potentially by a visit and the hope that they would be invited in if suspicious. The "detectives" were on commission in relation to their detection rate (the salary was rubbish, I know as I saw their contracts).

I could tell you more but I'd have to kill you . So I suspect the answer is that while technically possible it isn't a technical detection that leads to prosecution.

tv i player should be fine to watch without a license. and even if it isnt i wouldnt resent you watching with no license

just read the above message. it seems that if you buy a tv and give the wrong address you are fine.

off to cancel mine so i cant watch catch up instead

Is there any reason that someone couldn't ring the TV Licensing people and ask about all these points? I'd rather get confirmation from them about what is and isn't exempt, than rely on a chat thread on the Internet.

not sure if anyone posted this earlier, but here are the official rules

iplayerhelp.external.bbc.co.uk/help/playing_tv_progs/tvlicence

network guy, thanks for your personal message, why not pop it on here?

either way, i really don't want bbc radio programmes sponsored for obvious reasons related to the possibilities of product related editorial pressure, thin-end-of-the-wedgeness and general cheap-and-tackyness.

i agree, the beeb advertises itself far to often in the form of trailers, promos etc, but it makes up for this by its preposterous insistence of pointing out other sources of, for example, news even when those other sources are direct competitors, so that you end up with links to skynews on the bbc's website. do you think rupert points out the benefits of the bbc's coverage on his outlets?

i don't want even the tiniest fraction of my licence fee used to promote his empire, thank you very much.

well, i did say the bbc wasn't perfect.

So how do they prove anyone was watching TV?

I love paying for a TV licence - I think it's great value for money. As long as they don't make Sky compulsory!

I love paying for a TV licence

If you love it so much can you pay mine too, double the fun for you ;-)

Erm, I don't think that quite works, do you? :)

As I listen to Radio 1-4 and watch BBC 1-4 and iplayer I find it really good value. Yes the BBC isn't perfect and I do regularly have a go at them, but they are the best broadcaster in the world, bar none and we should be really proud of the institution.

I don't think the BBC is that good tbh. For too long now they've traded on their reputation and no longer have the goods to back it up. I don't like the way they are so free with our money,and the way they appear not to have to account for it the way a private business would. I don't like the relentless trailers for their own programmes. Yes, they do make some good programmes, but then so do channel 4 and other channels.

I know sport is expensive, but if you want to watch cricket for example, then you need Sky Sports. I don't see why I should pay for both when I can't remember the last time I actually watched anything on the BBC. I don't listen to BBC radio and if there was an opt out system, I would elect to not receive BBC services. I don't see why I should be forced to pay for a non essential 'service', when much of what I watch is on Sky, which I am paying for separately.

I think the BBC should have to compete and prove their worth and if the consumer doesn't want it they should not be compelled to have it.

We got rid of license a few years ago and it's brill. Would totally recommend it in terms of regulating what and when you watch. it's one thing watching wife swap just cos it's on, but another thing to actually choose it out of all the things available over the last month, so we end up watching mostly good stuff and less trash - though I still do trash when dh is out! Also great for regulating what dcs watch AND for completely limiting exposure to advertising and marketing. Didn't really think about this until we actually did it, but it's a massive advantage that dcs don't see adverts for junk food or other toys and nag us about it.

You can still own a tv without a license. The tv licensing people will confirm this. You can use your tv to watch dvds or i player catch-up. But you can't watch anything broadcast live online (e.g. 24 hour news, major sporting events, telethons)

.... and nor can you record it if it was broadcast live, either (just for completeness, imgonnaliveforever).

"I don't like the relentless trailers for their own programmes."

Something which I found quite annoying (and was commented on [on Feedback, I think] was the 'breaking news' they would put into say 'Today' on R4 first thing in the morning, about some (albeit newsworthy) story they were covering in depth on Panorama, or perhaps to a lesser extent on some other programme that might be in only one region.

I have heard mention of "and if you don't get xxxxxxxxxxxxxx then you will be able to view the programme via iPlayer during the rest of the week"

A secondary aspect which annoys me, is that from their own programme, Mousemat, on BBC R Wales, only about 50% of homes in Wales have a computer, let alone fast enough connections to watch video on iPlayer (and not everything can be downloaded) so it seems like a slap in the face to be told you can get it, when it is mostly people in England who can view it at their leisure... Not a solely BBC problem, it comes partly down to BT too, of course, but it is the somewhat South-Eastern 'assumption' that what they can do in London and Home Counties is similar in the rest of the UK, while income levels and infrastructure might be significantly lower.

I don't see why I should be forced to pay for a non essential 'service', when much of what I watch is on Sky, which I am paying for separately.

I agree there should be some opt out system. Sky and the commercial channels have their own income. The license is to pay for BBC programmes, so why should you pay if you don't use it.