AIBU (sorry its another dog and toddler thread) or was this parent irresponsible

[ashamedandconfused]

Dog tied up outside large supermarket, minding its own businees, watching people going in and out of the door. not barking or whining or anything.

toddler aged about 3 approaching with father/male carer - not holding childs hand, and child is on side nearest to dog, on target to pass within inches of dogs face

most of us would have held our childs hand and made sure they were not close enough for the dog to reach them, or to stop THEM approaching the dog, right? but this bloke let his kid brandish a stick right in the dogs face! with a sort of sword fighting motion! fortunately the dog did not even bat an eyelid, in fact i am sure it rolled its eyes in disbelief, but me and another shopper exchanged a "look". the man just sniggered and said come on X

why let your child do that? the dog could easily have snapped sat the boy with the shock!

and then the dog would have got the blame when it was the child/parents fault!

"... how do you know that he didn't know the dog?"

I don't give a toss if the child or carer knew the dog! NO-ONE should wave a stick near a dog's face or allow a small child to approach a teathered, and thus cornered, dog in the way described in the OP.

Booy is completely correct. Not only is the parent/carer stupid but so is the owner of the dog. Grimma - it's a fact that dog theft is rife and rising. Studies show that it's worse in the South than any other part of the UK but other areas are catching up fast.

Dogs are stolen from outside shops and from owner's gardens regularly, I come across it very frequently in the course of what I do. They're not just stolen to keep or even to sell on, but as breeding machines and as bait for fighting dogs or to be used as fighters themselves. A lot of such dogs are stolen for the inevitable reward which will be offered by a distraught owner. Often the owner will get a call going like this,

"I bought a dog off a man in a pub but I've seen your posters and now think it's yours. I'm 100 miles from where you live but I'll drive him back to you. No, I don't know the seller's name or address.

I paid (insert ridiculous sum, more than the breed usually costs) for the dog, and my kids are really upset about having to give him back, so i'll need to recover what I spent out and my petrol money".

An arrangement is made to collect the dog, owner pays out hundreds and dog is handed over. In the majority of these cases the thieves come from one particular sector of society IME and that of other rescuers and those at DogLost.

I'm anxious to make people aware of this and to assure them that it's not an urban myth and that it CAN happen to you so PLEASE don't leave your dogs unattended.

The fact is that NO-ONE should leave a dog unattended outside a shop or even in their own garden these days, and certainbly no-one should be stupid or unkind enough to behave as the man and child in the OP did.

vall - are you talking regular family mongrels or just expensive/desirable/thoroughbreds?

am in the SEast and it has been on local radio lots this week about dog theft - perhaps it was you i heard?

ashamedandconfused, it can be any dog which goes missing, not just desirable breeds. Sure, the Newfoundland or Bulldog is worth more pounds to the buyer but the Labrador is more easy to sell on without drawing attention to himself.

And any dog, pedigree or mutt, is ok to be put in a fighting ring as bait, just as any breed or mutt may be used as a fighter... some will react and fight, some won't, regardless of breed.

Additionally any dog is a money spinner if he is well loved as his owners or their insurers will put up a handsome reward for his recovery.

Val - I didn't know that about thefts

Good point.

And PS, no it wasn't me you heard on the radio, they wouldn't dare touch a gobby moo an opinionated woman like me, would they?!

I would never leave my dog outside a shop, for his own safety. Too many undesirables around!

When we were living in Bristol, (about 5 years ago), a dog was stolen by teenagers from outside the local big supermarket. It was later found 'hung' in a tree in the park, the lovely boys having used it's own lead. I personally would have done the same thing to them......

(I am not teenager bashing here, I have two of my own....)

I'd do it to my OWN teenagers if they ever did such a wicked thing, IHateLivingHere.

This is a very typical example of a stolen dog story. Here the dog is a whippet cross, not valuable... but very desirable to those who would like to use her for lamping/coursing and the like.

Sadly, stories like these are very, very common.

Vallhala , that was also rife in Bristol. They stole dogs, kept them as 'pets' whilst in the area, then left them behind the day they moved on - with no regard as to where they left them!!

The lady at our kennels told me this because she had 3 springers in for rehoming, that had been left behind and were unchipped, so the original, (probably desperate) owners couldn't be found!

I would leave a dog tied up outside. But only literally for a few minutes e.g. quick dash into a paper shop. If there is a queue I will only go in if I can see my dog from where I am queuing.

I used to do this with an elderly labrador. It was extremely unlikely he was going to hurt anyone. He was slow just standing up because of arthritis.

I was worried about someone being horrible to him. I am as sure as you can be that he wouldn't have barked and would instead just have started whimpering.

It's heartbreaking, isn't it, IHateLivingHere, and it's got to the stage where rescues are being broken into as well. Recently Bath Cats and Dogs Home was targeted - someone/some people broke in and stole a couple of Lurchers. The same happened at a Dogs Trust kennels recently. :(

I'd never leave my dog tied up outside a shop...

She's a really pretty collie with bright blue eyes and people always comment on her and make offers to buy her..

Some one would take her.

Also children aren't controlled properly by their parents and strangers have often let their DC approach her with out asking first if it's ok..

It isn't.

Our kids have been told that they are not allowed to touch a dog we do not know unless they ask both us and the dog owner first. And we always hold their hands as DD likes to pretend she's an olympic sprinter. The stinker.

I never leave my dog outside a shop, I occasionally think it would be so convenient if I could, but it isn't worth the risk. Also he would bark/whine the whole time I was gone as he doesn't like being left in unfamiliar places, poor thing.

By the way, is it true that the dog would have to be put down if it snapped at a child in this sort of situation? It would hardly be the dog's fault - most dogs would rather walk away from a child tormenting them, but if they're tied up and unable to do that? I doubt most people would react very well if they were say handcuffed and tied to something, and someone came up and started threatening them with a stick?

It would come down to the courts, Ephiny, the willingness of the Police to see it as a DDA incident and not one which was provoked and needs no more than both owner and parent being warned and the reasonable-ness of the parent of the child.

If it were my child I would accept that I was in the wrong for allowing it to happen and that my child was a brat in the wrong for threatening a dog with a stick and request that charges were not pressed. However, anyone who is stupid enough to allow their child to behave like that is not so likely to take responsibility for the outcome I guess and so yes, the dog could be dead on foot of a Dangerous Dogs Act trial decision.

Idiot. Out of control child and dangerous parent act maybe?