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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

To expect people not to back out once they've accepted a job offer and / or signed a contract

44 replies

brassick · 03/02/2011 13:42

I have just found out for the THIRD time in 6 months that someone who had accepted a job offer from me, signed a contract, met the team and confirmed a start date has decided to pull out.

First time, the woman's husband left her, and she didn't want more upheaval.

Second time, "personal reasons" were cited, but I think another job offer was accepted.

Third time, the lady was offered another job for more money in a more convenient location.

None of the times have any of these people told me directly - they all left it to the recruitment agency to pass on the bad news.

To me, if you have accepted a job offer and signed a contract then you are committed.

We are really desperate for this role to be filled. We are a good (small but growing) company, offering market rates and a decent package.

I am starting to doubt my ability to judge people...

OP posts:
FabbyChic · 03/02/2011 13:44

Where are you?

Sorry you are having so much bother recruiting someone. Why not bypass the agency and put an add in the paper asking for CVs?

You might fare better if you did not go through an agency.

MrsRichardHammond · 03/02/2011 13:45

Where are you? Can you send the job my OH's way please? he's desperate for work! :o

Seriously though that is disgusting that they are doing that BUT if i were you i'd be reassessing my terms and conditions to see if there is any reason why people may be inclined to back out - is the salary unreasonable for the work involved for example?

DELHI · 03/02/2011 13:46

also, it's in the agency's interest to place their client with whoever offers the highest pay, so may be that's a factor...

goldenticket · 03/02/2011 13:46

What about putting the ad on here? Also, could it be done as a job-share?

goldenticket · 03/02/2011 13:47

Agree that it's really annoying though and such a waste of time Angry

BeenBeta · 03/02/2011 13:48

I think you just have to offer more pay.

People usually take the job with the best take home pay after taxes and travel costs. You cant really blame them.

Is your firm in a really out of the way place or perhaps in an industry with quite harsh or unpleasant conditions compared to say an office job?

Icantbelieveitsnotbitter · 03/02/2011 13:50

It's just unfortunate that jobs are so highly sought after that you have to accept every offer made - even if you know you've got several more job interviews lined up !

Going through a recruitment agency is always difficult too - they send anyone even slightly suitable for the position - and anyone goes because otherwise they lose their jobseekers pittance ! At least with a direct newspaper advert you can get a better idea of what the job is about and know that people are applying because they fancy THE job rather than any job!

catsmother · 03/02/2011 13:55

I sympathise .... though have usually been on the other end of this, e.g. 2nd interviews, lots of gushing about how ideal you are, will ring you next week to confirm details - and then bloody nothing. Either way round, it's bloody rude and unprofessional not to contact someone and say sorry, thanks but no thanks. However, when it comes to accepting a job, I do have to say that it's a bit unreasonable to expect people to cut their nose off to spite their face if they were lucky enough to be offered a better job in the meantime. Most people looking for work will usually have several irons in the fire and sometimes the timing just ends up being bad. Doesn't excuse them not writing a polite note to you though.

stubborncow · 03/02/2011 13:57

I had to do this once - had accepted a job and sent back paperwork but then my DH got a job in another country so had to pull out. I felt bad but I did call them myself.

Also, DH was recently offered a job while still waiting to hear back from another couple of jobs. He accepted that one, intending to take it but aware that if the other jobs offered it to him and had a better deal, he'd have to pull outThe timing of it didn't allow him to just wait and see.

I agree it's not the best thing but people don't always have a choice in how these things work out.

stubborncow

Original poster
brassick · 03/02/2011 13:58

We are in South East Wales, close to Bristol (so bridge costs are sometimes an issue)

We are offering the market rate for the role - it's in financial services and is quite technical so there aren't many people around with the right experience and qualifications.

OP posts:
FabbyChic · 03/02/2011 13:59

I see you are in Newport, South Wales, oh well not a job for me then.

Unless you allow homeworkers!

MadamDeathstare · 03/02/2011 14:00

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

BeatrixRotter · 03/02/2011 14:01

I think it is normal though appreciate it is quite inconvenient and annoying for you. DP said the other day that in his office they don't consider people as really joining until they turn up on their first day no matter what may have been promised or signed.

MrsRichardHammond · 03/02/2011 14:03

Sounds like the ideal job for me - if i weren't hundreds of miles away :)

Problem with the finance sector though is that there are LOADS of jobs and not enough people to fill them so people can afford to be picky. Although it entirely depends on what level of experience you're seeking really!

Original poster
brassick · 03/02/2011 14:10

It's just so far away from my idea of what is professional.

For it to happen 3 times is just unbearable. The other people in the team are under such pressure.

So, is anyone, or does anyone know of an experienced paraplanner in S Wales / Bristol with Diploma level qualifications (or working towards)?

OP posts:
kittybuttoon · 03/02/2011 14:13

Ditch the agency who are sending you poor quality people.

Brush up on the interview process, too - ask people for examples of how they've demonstrated commitment to previous employers.

Also, ask at the end of the interview, 'If you were offered this job, would you be interested in accepting it?'

Listen to their answers very carefully - the candidates may have learned something during the conversation that put them right off (eg: pay, hours, working conditions,etc), which they won't mention to you at interview if not asked the question. If so, better they tell you then, rather than waste any more of your (mutual) time.

Original poster
brassick · 03/02/2011 14:17

Not the same agency every time.

We have a good interview process, and have recruited a lot of good people over the last year. It's just this one role where we are having problems.

Always ask at the end of the interview whether they are still interested.

This last woman met with me and the MD, then came back again to meet the team leader, then came in again to meet the rest of the people in the company. She was even going to come on our team day to the races, but it was cancelled due to frost.

I am starting to wonder what else we can do...

OP posts:
piedpiper4 · 03/02/2011 14:21

I pulled out on a job last year, having waited 8 weeks for the CRB check to come through.
I felt awful about doing it, but the closer I came to starting the more uncomfortable I felt. I could never get hold of my soon to be line manager, and this would have been crucial to the job. My gut instinct told me to say no.
Like I said, I felt awful letting them down, but also felt it was the right thing for me.

I hope you find someone soon tho'.

mackereltaitai · 03/02/2011 14:23

YANBU at all to be annoyed.

I have to say I hated going through agencies, I would rather trawl through the piles of CVs myself, but sometimes it's just not practical. I like to have at least 2 people in mind at the end of the interviews though, as I grew to expect that the first one (at least) would probably drop out. I also never bothered with any form of national advertising, as I have only once had someone actually relocate for a job, despite having had numerous people say that they will.

Even if the agency has been good for certain jobs, maybe this particular role needs a different approach.

I know you need someone asap, but what about taking on someone unqualified and training them? Would be quicker than going through this process 3 more times maybe?

NestaFiesta · 03/02/2011 14:23

On one hand YANBU- must be very frustrating and annoying and on the other hand YABU- people have to go where's best for them. its a dirty old world out there. You can't take a job that's not the best offer just to be polite.

Most job hunters are applying for more than one at a time and may accept Job A, only to find Job B is even closer and pays more. You can't really blame them.

Equally annoying is when an employer interviews you no less than 3 times at your expense and doesn't bother to tell you if you got the job or not. But that's another thread altogether!

Good luck with your recruiting. As other posters have said, try the direct route.

BeenBeta · 03/02/2011 14:27

I wonder too whether people are being given a pay rise by their exsting firm once they threaten to leave.

A lot of firms work this way now. They dont do annual pay rises - they just wait for people to threaten to leave, ask them what they are being offered and then match or slightly exceed it. This is especially prevalent in the finance/insurance industry.

Your location does not help, I suspect most people would prefer to work in Bristol.

MrsRichardHammond · 03/02/2011 14:28

Have you asked the agency outright what the problem is? After all they're losing income as a result too.

potplant · 03/02/2011 14:42

I had someone who started, did a full days training (which meant one of our senior staff spending a day out with her). Then handed her notice in at lunchtime on her first proper day of work as she had been offered something else. She didnt even work till the end of the day.

I understand your frustration but I think most people would do the same in a similar situation.

COCKadoodledooo · 03/02/2011 14:45

Is it possible to do the work remotely?

Puts hand up

NestaFiesta · 03/02/2011 16:01

Beembeta- Newport has almost 200,000 people and is only a 15 min train ride from cardiff so not everyone would prefer to work in Bristol. For one thing, a bridge TAG is near;y 1000 a year.