to wonder if there are any Premiership footballers who have had pvt education?

[PrimarkShopperHere]

Is there anyone?

Is being a premiership footballer not a top job? Apparently all the top jobs go to privately educated people.

I honestly think the academies may disagree with you cantspel. Admittedly there were probably so few privately educated kids who attended them in the past they are starting from a very low point.

The thing is, parents who, in the past would never have contemplated wanting their sons to be footballers are now seeing it very differently. These parents are often the ones with the pushiness motivation and resources to make it happen.

I'm not saying I like it, but it's happening.

I dont think football is something you can learn. You might be able to improve your skill, learn now to tackle and header but you cant learn to read a ball.

I dont really care where a young footballer is educated. I just want to see the big clubs putting money into developing young english talent.

I wouldn't say that football was a "top job"! Apart from the fact that most of the top schools do more rugby than football, presumably they treat it more as recreational than being a possible future profession?

I get quite wibbly thinking about Graeme Le Saux, Words

DS2 has a talent which, where the hell it's come from I don't know. DS1 and every male member of the family would give his right arm for it. DS2 has been 'picked up' by an academy. The point is less about school and more about resources. We know people who worry about the cost of petrol or having problems with childcare for other children in the family and time off work which makes attending sessions at the academies difficult. It takes a lot of time and commitment and as with a lot of things these days, more and more the monied and motivated parents are getting in on the act.

Graeme le Saux. Didn't they chant 'You read the Guardian' at him whenever he played?

Not sure about any others though.

Some poeple look down on football and think it is just a bunch on thickos on sink estates kicking a ball about where it isn't.
Football is big business and if you are lucky enough to have a natural talent and lucky enugh to be picked up by a decent academy then there is nothing wrong with a child looking for a career in football.

jonicomelately i wish your lad luck and maybe one day i will be in the stands cheering him on ( so he beeter get signed for west ham or put on an England shirt:o)

I agree cantspel. People don't realise how competitive it is and how people like Steven Gerrard, when all of his mates went out socialising, put huge effort into his football.

As for DS2. He's very young at the moment so I'm not eyeing up a new posh house quite yet. I'll keep you posted

I don't think that.
I used to play and my brother was offered apprenticeships (as they were back then) at Leeds and derby.

But honestly, if one of my dcs were offered an academy place I would no doubt have to let them but would do so with a heavy heart.

I would not wish my son a footballers. It is a sport requiring immense talent and discipline. But it is also morally questionable, swilling in money and completely, ruthlessly exploitative. The crowds are better than 10 years ago but remian foul mouthed and aggressive. And the academies scoop up talent only to ruthlessly weed at 16 when many - including the son of my dhs colleague , get kicked out.

My next door neighbours was in an academy and now plays for a conference side. He is charming and talented. But I still would not wish it for my child. Not for all the wealth on offer.

Of course they have to weed out lesser players as not every child who shows promise at 7 or 8 will reach the grade by 16. Those who get weeded out but play for the love of the game will go on to play for conference teams and the like. If they were just in it as they expected to become prem footballers on £150k a week then i dont think they would ever have made the big time anyway as they wouldn't have to love of the game and dedication.

Not all fans are foul mouthed and aggressive, some might still be but to say all is an unfair comment.

It is ruthless. I hate the idea of children feeling they've been 'rejected' at such a tender age.

I don't like the huge amounts of money players are paid but a small part of me thinks fair play because these people have excelled in an unbelievably competitive world.

There are lots of immoral people connected to the game, attracted by the mega money. I disagree however that the game itself is immoral.

The boy I know who got rejected was told at 16. And the reason he was given was that he was too small. Of course that is valid but pretty hard for him as he could do nothing about it and it was hardly new information.

He did continue to play, continues to love the sport.

The sport is a business, of course they reject anyone who they feel won't make the grade. I am just explaining why I wouldn't want my child to do it.

Look, I have already said it was a game that i grew up with and loved. I still enjoy it. But the mealy mouthed defence of the way the game has deteriorated in recent years with mega money and young men cossetted and fetted with little attention to their self reliance and life skills is shocking. And the behaviour of huge sections of the crowds are similarly appalling. DD watches rugby with us and the two dcs go to Quins. They can sit in the crowd and hear nothing but the occasional smattering of profanity - and that is usually me. I was watching on tv with DD the other night and DD said 'what is that man doing' as a bloke spat and visibily swore at a player trying to take a throw in. The whole crowd were doing wanker signs. Not desperately child friendly.

the best chance of sorting that out would actually be to be honest about it. But foul mouthed cheating by the players and spitting abuse by the crowds is written off as passion or not that bad. and those excuses just let the culture continue.

People shrugging their shoulders don't do the game any favours

That's a pretty extreme view of things pagwatch.

When you look at the numbers of women, children and black and asian people who attend football these days compared with the seventies and eighties I think things are pretty OK. There is less football violence, zero tolerance when it comes to racist or homophobic remarks and all the major clubs do extensive work in the local community. Clubs such as Everton and Arsenal have excellent women's teams which the main clubs are very proud of.

There is a lot more to be done but it is not as bleak as perhaps you would have us believe.

I am not making you believe anything.

I am just giving my opinion.

I think it is much much better in terms of crowd violence thank a few decades ago. But I think foul mouthed descent on the pitch and out and out cheating - usually defended by managers - is worse. Probably because the players and the big premiership teams are too powerful.
I think that families are being encouraged to attend and that is hugely important and a great development. But those attending have to accept that their 8 year old will hear wanker chants and xxx manager is a pedophile songs.

But if you think it is rosy that's fine. You are involved and I am not (anymore).

I do wish your ds2 every good luck though. Nothing better than being really good at something you love

Football isn't played at many private schools, or didn't used to be anyway. Mine was all rugby/cricket/hockey.

DS1 is a very good rugby player so I know that world too. It's good game but people in Rugby Union can often be snobbish and elitist. I much prefer Rugby League. Far less pretentious.

I don't think the world of football is 'rosy' but neither do I think I'm sending DS2 in with the lions by letting him play football

NinkyNonker.
I dealt with that point in an earlier post.

Nah Rugby hasn't really been snotty since about the late 80s.
I do enjoy league though.

I don't think you are sending your son to the lions. I would never think that let alone say it. You know your son and you know the set up so you are best placed to make those decisions. I was just explaining why I would have reservations. But my sons are not the same as yours.

One reason why not many priavtely educated pupils enter football is of course that rugby is favoured.

Another is that if your DS is scooped up by an academy the committment is huge. By 13 he will be expected to play several evenings a week after school, and many priavte schools finish very late and it's not possible.

There will also be training and games for the academy which will clash with school events, possibly Saturday school.

Also, academies often want boys to school there and tbh the education outside isn't fab. So there are big decisions to be made.

If they weren't still snotty they'd have merged the codes years ago. The Union lot wouldn't dream of it though

I don't think I could stop either of my boys playing football, but especially DS2. As I said earlier I've no idea where the hell he gets it from. I do have massive reservations and think academies are deeply flawed. He's very young at the moment and it all goes over his head. If it ever became a problem I think I'd review the situation.

They won't merge the codes because the rules and style are too different. And league is doing pretty well on it's own.

And at the response to ' I love football but it is being dragged down because it won't stand up to morally dodgy behaviour' being rebuffed with 'yeah but rugby is elitist'

Making bad behaviour about class implies that the working classes are always intrinsically badly behaved. Which, as a working class girl, I rather object too.

pagwatch.

Firstly the codes could merge but the desire isn't there. They were once the same game with the same code. Union has in the past decade adopted more and more league 'traits' which incidentally is detested by certain sections of Union fraternity For some people little has changed in over a hundred years. The original split was an issue of class, money and arguments over changing styles of play. My view is the Soviet Union can fall, SA can kick out aparthied. Why the hell can't the game of rugby become one again

And I'm afraid, if you look at the power base of Rugby Union it IS elitist. The stronghold in the game is in public schools (that issue again) and the professions. League is unquestionally different in fanbase. I know because I grew up in a RL town.

I don't really get your last point. Apparantly I've injured your working-class sensibilities by somehow implying the wc are always badly behaved. I would never say that or even (intentionally) imply that. Why would I when that's also my background