Free school meals

[mutznutz]

I was just thinking. With so many Government and Council cutbacks, isn't it about time they stopped providing free school meals that cost untold millions of pounds to provide?

I mean we're already given child benefit to help with the cost of our children. Also, as long as you're feeding your child properly at home, what's wrong with providing a fairly inexpensive packed lunch if you can't afford to buy them a hot one? (not that they are particularly 'hot' nowdays)

Plus, if parents cant afford to feed their children when they go to school...how do they manage at weekends and during the 13wks holidays they get per year?

Then there are the parents who earn just above the threshold and cannot afford school meals...their kids would have a packed lunch so why not everyone?

Won't be vouchers or cash for much longer anyway, chip and pin cards are next.

ok - so chip and pin -

but what about the "how much" and "what about the change when they've spent less than the government thinks they should spend"??

What about those families who due to say - severe food allergies need to spend more on food to get the stuff that won't kill their child - will they get a bigger allowance

What about everyone else that gets child benefit? Shouldn't we be making sure they're spending THAT on the child (and not the bills, fags, rent) etc - maybe child benefit should be paid in vouchers too??

They could split it 50/50 - 1/2 food vouchers 1/2 clothing vouchers.

and there would be nothing stoppping the addict who wants their next fix selling their chip and pin card - with details to use it - onto someone else.

Bitching, just to go back to a point you made last night, in my skim read I had noticed many on here explaining why FSMs are vital to them, but don't feel I need to comment on that. You and other like you have done a good job of demonstrating just how hard you work, and the sacrifices you make, to balance the money in an attempt to do the best by your children. Therefore, you are in the best position to make suggestions on where the government would be better leaving or re-assigning the money so that families like you can still access it.

I kept my comment purely to the 'feckless' parents who don't bother, because their children are the ones who worry me most. They don't have a parent on here speaking up for them, justifying why they need FSMs. They don't have a parent juggling things at home to ensure they eat properly. If they lose the FSMs, they just lose them - nothing will take their place. Having taught ADHD children whose parents would regularly steal their Ritolin to get high, I know there are no limits to how far some parents will let their own children fall through the cracks. Until those children are protected my support for FSMs is directed at them, because I know children like yours have a mother championing their cause for them, so I'll shout for the children who don't have you in their corner.

Bitching-What about everyone else that gets child benefit? Shouldn't we be making sure they're spending THAT on the child (and not the bills, fags, rent) etc - maybe child benefit should be paid in vouchers too??

There's more to bringing up children than feeding and clothing them. So what if Child Benefit is spent towards the rent, the child lives there. My child benefit goes into our bank and I've no idea what it actually gets spent on, it's just part of the pot of money that we need as a family.

I think you have lots of interesting points......but not all parents are like you. You clearly want the best for your children but some people are selfish and will always put their own needs above their children. No amount of money will change that.

Durham - I know that was my point about the idea of the FSM's being taken out of the child benefit - or other benefits - being paid in vouchers.

I know not all parents are like me but most are (actually most are better than me ) - however those parents that are selfish won't look after their children any better just because they have the FSM taken out of their benefits, or given vouchers for benefits instead of money - they'll find a way to sell/transfer/swap so they can get what they want.

It will be the majority of parents - and their children as a knock on effect who do their best for their child who will suffer if money is deducted before it reaches them, or if they get their benefits in vouchers.

I am probably rambling incoherently now actually - I need sleeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeep (sod the bloody food I can get by on not a lot of that but god when my sleep goes AWOL I turn into a rambling, grumpy wreck )

FSM's without cash or vouchers involved is the best way to ensure that the benefit is delivered directly to those who need it.

why not just take all benefits away, I mean why should the poor have them, if the more well off don't

I work within the homeless sector with a lot of people who have substance misuse issues. They have children and some of them can barley look after themselves let alone their children. Social services don't always get notified of this and you have children being bought up in horriffic circumstances. Personally, I would never begrudge a child in need a hot meal.

Well said MrsVidic!

another thing - if it was only those that claimed FSM's who had the money deducted from their child benefit - then those children who need it most (the children such as MrsVidic describes) wouldn't get it. What person who only has their own interests at heart is going to go and ask for money to be taken off their benefits??

I would be for a reduction overall in Child benefit - Free school meals for every child - sourced locally and of a good standard.

Good for social inclusion also, I think if they were of a high standard would have long term savings in the health services.

I teach in a primary school. Small country town.

Kids often come in without breakfast. Often in dirty clothes. Parents would rather spend their money on fags, beer, tattoos and phone credit. If they didn't have FSM then they would hardly have anything to eat.

School is where they are safe, are treated consistently, cared for and are kept warm and fed.

FSM are essential for them.

Couldn't have put it better Gotabookaboutit.

You've summed up this thread neatly - like it!!

Agreee with Gotabook and agree with Alouiseg. If CB was withdrawn as a cash benefit, all children eligible for a good quality locally sourced homecooked meal, and any remaining CB payable by loading up a chip and pin card that can only be used to pay for certain items (nappies, formula, fresh food items, children's clothing etc) there would be no stigma as everyone would in recepit of CB would be receiving it and spending it in the same way. That way, people who don't really need it won't be saving it up as cash, and feckless parents won't be wasting it on fags and vodka while their children are malnourished.

I am not the least bit of people whose children are forced to eat crappy school dinners every day. My children have the luxury of a nutritious lunch. I is a luxury they most certainly don't appreciate, but they are absolutey better off without the crap that is the Sodhexo Joules school dinner. Maybe some people get quality school dinners. Lucky them.

"We're a healthy eating school"... my arse. (that's what the news letter claims)

Think you're missing the point mutznutz - child benefit is paid to help parents with costs of clothing, feeding etc and is less than £20 a week. Believe it or not it doesn't go very far!!!

Free school meals are actually beneficial to schools as they get extra funding when there are children entitled to them.

You are really just showing your ignorance of what it means to be raising children on a low income/benefits and your rationale is naive in the extreme, not to mention condescending and offensive.

Fellatio - so you wan to dictate to me how much I should spend on clothes and food and what type?? I'm not allowed to have a couple of pizzas to throw in the oven for when I'm ill/knackered? And what when my rent is due to go out before the housing benefit comes in and i have to use the child benefit for that - or to pay my gas bill.

Or when I go to the market - you going to sort out a chip and pin machine for the man on the market so I can buy my fruit and veg from him? Or will I be forced to only buy at "approved retailers" (ie those that have a chip and pin machine).

Why do I save cash?? - so that I don't have to use credit to take my children away for a break or treat them once in a while break, or to buy them new toys. I'm also saving (verry verry VERrrrry) slowly towards a deposit for a house - highly unlikely to ever happen - but even if I don't ever get a house once I'm working if I have a pot of money in the bank at least I know I'll be ok for a bit if I then subsequently lose my job.

I thought we were supposed to be encouraged to try and save a little for our future?? Or is that only for rich people to do - and if you're poor you're not allowed to shove £5 a week away for a "rainy day"?

And children's clothing - what about when they're a bit older and are into adult clothes/sizes?? DS1 is now only 1 1/2 sizes away from adult size shoes.........so in a years time (when he's 11) and I've got to pay for adult shoes for him then that's just tough.

And besides - as has been pointed out - those who didn't want to provide for their children's needs would flog the chip and pin card and spend it on the crap anyhow.

I believe people should be free to lead the lives they wish - with the consequences for themselves and their family.

Therefore, they should be free to spend benefits as they see fit...not have their choices restricted in the form of vouchers and the like.

That said, I also believe FSMs should be withdrawn and a small increase be made in CB to partly compensate people for this.

It comes back to whether we live according to our means or expect others to pick up the tab. CB should only be paid to those who have fallen on hard times. If you have a child whilst already on benefits, you should not receive CB for said child.

Simples.

Baroque it needn't be chip and pin, there could be an option of paper vouchers or chip and pin. The point is, is everyone received it this way there would be no stigma - no-one can tell whether you are on benefits or not, in the wider context. And yes, I do want to dictate what child benefit is spent on. It was supposed to contribute towards essentials for children - food, school shoes, nappies etc. When I'm PM you can eat pizza and smoke and go away for the weekend if you like - just not on the strength of your CB! That's not to say you can't do any of those things without it - you just distribute your spending differently. If you are sensible and prioritise properly it should make no difference to anything you choose to do. But it will stop feckless people spending CB on luxuries while their children go without the basics.

So are my rent and gas bills not essentials for my children then?? Because quite frankly despite the hours I spend pouring over my banks statements I can't make it so that the child benefit money is always left in the account just to pay for the grocery shopping. I've tried - but you know what - there just isn't that flexibility when people want monthly paid on a monthly basis and you get your money into you account either every 2 weeks, or every 4 weeks. The only reason I can keep my organ money aside just for my naughty treats is because it's paid monthly.

Everything else ends up in one big blending pot.

Or are you going to come and cook for me when I'm ill or when I don't get back home from my organ/church stuff until after dinner time and the DS's are starving?

and you still haven't told me what you'd do about those that shop on the market for cheaper fruit and veg? As lovely as they are they don't take Healthy Start vouchers - because they're simply not set up to do so.

Or about when your oldest child hits 11/12/13 and needs adult sizes for clothes/shoes

Personally speaking - give me a job paying £20k after tax, pay for my childcare (only need after school for 2 of them - and perhaps holidays for the oldest) and I'd quite happily not claim CB, or TC - and still afford to feed my boys 3 meals a day, go on holiday, save and still smoke.

I appreciate that other people would need more to live on comfortably with 3 children

Although - I've just had a moment - my post arrived and I've only got about 6 weeks left to pay on a social fund loan that I had to take out to enable me to move nearly 2yrs ago. Whoop whoop - I think I may be able to stop claiming FSM's (although I still won't be eating 3 meals a day myself )

(though I still hate the idea of being dictated as to exactly what my child benefit gets spent on when apart from my smoking and my boots everything I buy is for my children's benefit)

Riven, I am astonished too. I can't believe how gullible and selfish people are who want to futz about with this relatively cheap stuff, completely hoodwinked by all this ideological belt tightening tory rhetoric. FFS.

I am infuriated by the idly speculative tone of the OP - "just thinking" - oh ffs. What a luxurious thought for you.

I have to hide this thread now

I really think people who come out with this sort of guff need to sit and do some basic sums to see whether it make sense or not before they start messing about - even in theory - with their neighbours' livings.

Relax, OP is not a politician and no-one is scrapping FSM's. In fact qualifying for them is being used as a bench mark for means testing, rightly or wrongly. It looks like any extra benefits and help for the term of this government will only be available to unemployed families.