To need brutal honesty?

[susall]

Sorry its long and rambling and please feel free to ignore it but it seems to be helping me to write it down.

Im a mum of 3, 9yo ds and 4 yo ds/dd twins and when eldest was born I dropped from full-time to part-time which was fine as I was kept quite busy and still had loads of work friends, my parents were looking after my dn so having ds1 made things easier as she had a playmate. When we tried for our second child we found out we were having twins. We realised that expecting my dad (mum was working full-time by now) to look after two small kids (plus the older ones) was going to be too much and I would have to work full-time again to just cover the child care costs for the two of them. We agreed that I would stay home with the kids and go back to work when they went to school.

Now 4 years down the line and they are at nursery and should be going to school after the summer but they have been deferred a year so my working plans have been put on hold as the kids are more important to us. We do need another wage and are struggling a lot at the moment but my dh works some strange hours which would mean leaning on my dad a lot and he is not in the greatest physical health (arthritis, 3 knee replacements, various other pain related issues) and it would not be fair on him.

Since the kids went back the nursery mum in question is very distant with me since the loud group from the afternoon moved to the mornings. My ds2 can be quite lively and I have my own was of dealing with him and have been working with the nursery to help calm him down as his first reaction is normally to hit. Bad yes, hes 4 and its a working progress, but he has got a lot better and I encourage him to walk away or talk to an adult now and his last bad day was just a day where he was into everything, he did not touch anybody.

This one child finds it funny to run up to him and scream in his face as he knows it scares him which I hate and have bit my toungue in the past and moved ds2 away rather than say anything. Yesterday the boy came running straight for him whilst I was putting on dd's coat and ds2 pushed him to stop him screaming in his face and the mother went crazy and shouted at ds2 to not push her son. Now it happened so quick and she was gone so fast that I did not get a chance to react, so what did I do? I started blubbing like a baby in front of a new mum who was really nice and taken aback that the other mum thought it was ok to do that to my child.

I brought it up with the nursery teacher and all I got was 'well I cant control what goes on in the corridor, what do you want me to do?'. All I was doing was explaining that I dont want the actions of one child to hamper the work the two of us had been putting into with his behaviour as I have witnessed other kids starting to do the same to ds2. Cue confussion and frustration that she did not get what I was talking about and well the blubbing starts again.

Is it not my place to tell my child off when he does wrong? The child did not hit the floor or even wobble but still I know ds2 should not have pushed him and I would have delt with it myself, we have rewards for good days at nursery and he would have/did lose it. I felt her agression was uncalled for and humiliating to me as it was a stripping of power over my own child.

Now I dont think it helps that I am in the middle of an identity crisis and do not know which way to turn. I have not felt this bad before as I was always someone out of the house and mum at home but these days I am just mum all the time and I struggle to recall who I was. I do know if it had been with ds1 I would have delt with it there and then not started blubbing to a stranger.

So please help, am I in the wrong getting upset about this?

Should I just ignore it and prepare a statement for if it ever happens again? (nursery teachers suggestion)

Is it wrong to shout at someone elses child?

What can I do to gain some identity without it affecting my family?

I would and have told other children off for pushing my kids so I totally understand where the mother was coming from. It's not right for her child to scream in his face...but kids do tend (annoyingly) to get in your face.

As for everything else, you sound as though absolutely everything is getting on top of you...and I feel for you. Perhaps it's time to make a list of what's bothering you in your life and make some changes? Even crossing off the problems that you can do nothing about at the moment can help

Thank you xxx

I dont think I would have minded her telling him off if it had been done in a less agressive way but it was too over the top for my liking.

I will look at the list thing and see if that helps, again thanks its just been a bad few months with cashflow issues and a car that keepe conking out so this was the cherry on the top for me.

I would approach the other mother and ask to have a private word with her. I would point out that while it was wrong for your son to push her child, he is doing it in response to her child screaming in his face. Tell her that she is never to speak to your child like that again or you will make formal complaints about her abusive behaviour to both the nursery and the police. This could result in her being prevented from entering the nursery to pick up her child as that behaviour is abusive.

I would make an appt to speak to the person in charge of the nursery and tell them that this is the nurseries problem as well and they are to put a stop to this child screaming in your sons face. Tell them that you want the other parents made aware of this, so they can have a quiet word at home if necessary.

Personally, I think it is okay to tell someone elses child off, only if the other parent is not present or not dealing with it themselves. This other mother didn't even give you a chance to do that, but her reaction might have been instinctive, to protect her child. She might not even be aware of her own childs behaviour.

I think if you do this, you will taking control back. You do need to be both calm and polite as ranting will get you nowhere.

This time will pass soon enough and once your DC are in full time education you will have time to get back into work, if that is what you want. In the meantime try to keep up with professional developments within your field, so that are ready when it's time to return.

blimey there's a lot in there.

About nursery, it would piss me off if someone told off my child before I'd had a chance to deal with it myself. But she probably just reacted without thinking. She doesn't know your son, presumably, and so she just saw her child getting pushed, and told the pushing kid off. her ds hadn't even started the screaming thing yet so to her it looked unprovoked. Let it go. If you saw your child being pushed when as far as you could tell, your dc was rushing up to hug them (or similar) then you'd be pissed off too.

The gaining identity thing is a different kettle of fish. I'm not sure that I've got an answer to that one. But you are definitely not alone there. I'm going a bit mental since having my second, no time to myself etc. I'm making much more effort to see friends when i can. I think that is the only way to feel like a person again. Also I get box sets of MY telly that I want to watch and make time in the evenings for that rather than watching whatever carp is on, so i can lose myself in Mad Men or something for an hour or two. It feel like I've made a conscious choice then about what I am doing with my time, since there is so little of it.

Could you explain to the other mum that your DS reacts badly to having another child scream in his face - as most people would! - and that maybe the two of you should try to keep them apart where possible, to try to avoid any more issues like this.
I agree though that it sounds like things are really getting on top of you and despite doing your best, it's becoming difficult. Speak to the nursery manager about the staff member's reaction too. Unhelpful in the extreme!

Me too mutz. It takes a village to raise a child. Anyone can tell my DD off if she's been naughty. OTOH, I decide what, if any, punishment there should be. That last sentance was directed at the Mum of one of her 'friends'

Karma Abusive behaviour? Formal complaint to the Police???

The OP said "the mother went crazy and shouted at ds2 to not push her son"

You don't think you're over reacting a tad?

I think the mother just reacted on the spur of the moment to watch she was seeing too. I have in the past waited for a mother's reaction...giving her a chance to tell her own child off. Other times, it's just naturally come out of my mouth..."No, that's not nice!" or "No, stop that!"

Sometimes it stops the child in their tracks to be told off by someone else.

'what' she was seeing...not 'watch' lol

mutznutz I would be extremely angry if an adult went crazy and shouted at my child. I don't behave like that with my DC and would go ballistic if anyone else did. We are talking about small children.What are they, 4 years old? The other mother would have been within her rights to tell the OPs child not to push or even have a word with the OP herself, but not shout and go crazy.

I wouldn't report to the police on this occasion, but I think the mother needs to be made aware that these are the potential consequences for this sort of behaviour. I know she reacted instinctively, but I think she needs telling that this is not on. If an adult did this to another adult at work, there would be consequences and if the teacher did this to pre schoolers would the parent accept it?

It totally depends on the OP's definition of crazy. A lot of people use the word lightly and will say someone went crazy because they shouted.

I wondered if the child, who usually screams in his face (and I assume nursery staff are discouraging this) had started to scream?
Or if your child panicked because he was expecting this, only it had not happened?

So what the other mother saw was very one-sided?

Does she scream in her child's face? I wonder this because you say she 'went crazy'.

YANBU to feel upset/irritated that she shouted at your ds and made a "normal" childs moment into a loud scene. Kids this age shout and push!

But, in her shoes, I would also have told your child not to push. I believe other adults should/can reprimand my dc (obviously not shouting/hitting etc) ...takes a village.

FWIW On the first occasion her dc shouted in your ds face YOU could have reprimanded him.... and still can if it happens again...

The other mum should have delt with her own childs behaviour rather than blaming your ds for the whole situation. I know children can run and shout (both of mine do) but they should be taught there is a time and place and appropriate communication methods. Screaming in peoples faces is NOT appropriate!

I would then have followed my normal discipline for the behaviour so ds knew his action was wrong.

I understand how confusing it is going from working, independent woman to at home mum. I struggled with my identity and self worth too. One day I caculated my cash worth & benefit to family ... very cheesy and realised my value at home nearly matched DH wage and the benefits of my choice were far greater for my children than my being at work. For some reason this made me confident and happy with my decision. ...I'm sure there were other factors... life is more complicated than a + - column

hmmmm...I would tell a child if they were acting inappropriately..not shouting but firmly stating what they were doing was not sensible or kind...I see nothing wrong with it..and I have no qualms about telling my own DCs if they were acting out..it's my responsibility as a parent to defend/protect my child and also to instruct them about proper behaviour with others..

I would speak to the other parent and appologise for your ds behaviour, explaining you are working on it. Then I would tell her why your ds reacted that way to her dc so she is aware of her dc "fault" in the situation and has the opportunity to deal with it too. I would lastly explain that her reaction (instinctive or not) was extreme for the offence, not appropriate and should never happen again.

I would speak to the nursery teacher again...or go higher if you prefer. Clearly explain the issue of other children shouting in ds face and that it needs to be stopped.

I also got interested in a hobby...arts and crafts (not just for kids) I have limited cash so being able to make gifts, cards etc gave me a sense of achievement and saved cash.

A firm telling off would have been fine in this instance and I do wish I had delt with the child screaming in ds2's face at the very start but back then it was just playful now it is done to cause a reaction of fear and others are following suit now.

It was an agressive, loud shout which I felt was not appropriate for dealing with a 4 yo in public especially when it was not aimed at her own child.

I will keep them close by from now on (not that they ran free ever) and have considered leaving the house later to cut down on the boring waiting time in the mornings where most problems happened in the past and will be sharp to pick them up so we are away before the crowd.

Again thank you for all the input as I have been feeling quite fragile lately and you get more honest advice from those that dont know you xxx

You need to calm down. If you overreact and rant like this, then (you wanted honesty) it cannot be helping your ds learn calm, rational behaviour.

Stop worrying about your "identity". You don't stop being "you" just because you are not currently in paid work. It sounds as though you have plenty of important things to get right at home at the moment and it won't be long until they are all at school and you can have a bit more time to yourself. You will feel better if you focus on doing something and not on how you are feeling.

In the incident which you describe, it sounds as though the other child behaved horribly and his mother reacted unpleasantly. I think it caught you off guard in a stressed moment and it made you cry. This has happened to everyone.
Do not worry about it.

I get the sense that ds2 is the root of quite a lot of the stress. I suggest that you make an appointment to see the teacher and very calmly work through the difficulty, how some of the other children are not helping and steps which might be taken to improve matters.

Take a deep breath, it will get better

bless you. the lack of support from the nursery worker probably made you feel totally unsupported. imo it was inappropriate for the parent of the other child to shout at your ds when you were present. she may be having an identity crisis too (just a thought..)
in the meantime, make a list of things you like and like to do (I know, when I was up to my ears in small kids and was given this task I stared at the blank sheet of paper for a good 10 minutes - I couldn't remember what I liked or what I liked to do). then with absolute precision, pursue what you can, make it a priority, a top priority. You are unravelling for various reasons, all understandable, and you can't wait until the kids are in school, you have to address this now re invest in yourself as a top priority - get dp involved. You are a vital pin in the family dynamic and if you go down then everybody does - you need to invest in yourself. doesn't have to cost anything either, often just a change in focus. I'd also have a talk to your GP to see if a low dose of anti-d's could get your through this rough patch. stress builds slowly and it takes a while to unravel it. anti-d's are wonderful, a miracle if used at the right time.