To be outraged that obesity is being addressed whilst people are dying of anorexia a subject never mentioned by the government?

[milokaimilo]

My daughter has been struggling with anorexia for 4 years. We have travelled miles to find any kind of treatment for her. Not enough funding they say, not enough people suffering from it they say. The fact that 1 in 100 teenage girls will have some kind of eating disorder, the fact that 10 of those will die before anyone takes any notice. I've campaigned, shouted, cried in the face of the doctors who sit there patronising me and telling me I'm over reacting when my daughter weighs just 4 stone with a height of 163cms. Please sign the anorexia awareness register or contact BEAT or something to help raise awareness.

Today it's my daughter, tomorrow it might be yours. 4 years ago, my life was normal, now I don't have one and my daughter wouldn't be here if I was shy! :(

Sorry, to OP - will stick to the point.

I feel so much for you and your daughter. Your daughter especially. Obv, I don't know what stage she is at or how she reconciles this in her head but I'm going to guess that she hates being "anorexic" and wants to stop but the voices in her head don't allow this - no matter how absurd she may think the whole thing is i.e. 'I'm hungry...I just have to eat to make the pangs go away, but... I just can't'

I, for one, wish the media would stop blaming anorexia/bulimia on 'girls wanting to look like models in magazines'. I think more attention needs to be brought to the psychology behind it. More often than not it is to do with the victim/sufferer needing control.

Do you mind me asking how old she is?

To use your reasoning, Spenguin, anorexics 'are knowingly killing themselves' as well. They are choosing not to eat.

You may say 'they're not choosing to, their mental health won't allow them to eat', but you could argue the same about compulsive eaters.

I don't see why one unhealthy lifestyle should trump another.

I'm sure most obese people aren't obese because they're scoffing down vegetables, are they?

(If X was morbidly obese yet had a healtht diet and the problem lay in a thyroid gland, fair enough.)

That's where the difference (be it in intention] rests

OP, I'm sorry about yout daughter. It does worry me that cases like this only ever get heard when the parents are willing to be very vocal about it. Like you said, your daughter is only here because you've argued.

I think it's disgusting, and I agree with you that anorexia, like any other mental disorder, is very badly funded within the NHS.

The reason obesity is such a cash cow is that it's a very fashionable thing at the moment. Many trials recently have strongly indicated that BMI ect have a very strong relation with premature death. As far as I know, there are no such studies with anorexic people.

I would guess that the reason for this is that there are hundreds of thousands of overweight people who can be recruited into a trial, and it actually make statistical sense.

I actually agree with Spenguin, I don't think that images on magazines are the issue at all,. In my (inexperienced) opinion, anorexia in particular is more about a control issue, rather than a weight issue.

Sorry if that is patronising.. it's a long time, but I've been there before..

anyway

hth

YAB a little U.

Anorexia is a recognised medical condition - when I say recognised, I mean by Joe Public. Non-specific Eating Disorders such as compulsive overeating are genuine eating disorders however Joe Public (and mn it seems) views them as just "lazy fatties" and there is very little medical help available - and as you know yourself, all eating disorders require therapy.

It's mental health in general that us under funded, and not just in the UK.

I hope you can get your daughter the help she needs.

MIlo, I'm so sorry to read your post. How appalling to be told you're overreacting to your DD weighing only 4 stone. FFS

My sister (in her 30s') now has suffered with eating disorders since her early teens. Firstly it was anorexia and then bulimia. It is soul destroying for the whole family, you want to help but are completely powerless. I can remember feeling very angry with my sister for a while, mainly for what it was doing to our mum. Hope that doesn't seem insensitive. For me, it's always been very difficult to understand, yet obviously I accept that it isn't a choice but a very real illness.

I know a lot of money is being spent on tackling obesity, but I assume that's just because more people are obese than anorexic. My morbidly obese sister-in-law (who's not a fat bastard ) has been given rubbish help from the NHS. She has been offered a gastric band but she won't have the surgery because she is terrified of not being able to binge. I know that is probably inflammatory but my point is that she's dealing with a serious mental illness and her weight is just a side-effect of that.

I will pray for your DD. Btw, my sister isn't 'cured' but she hasn't been dangerously under-weight for at least 10 years now. There is hope.

So sorry to hear about your daughter. Have you been in touch with beat for support for you? If its any help I was anorexic as a teen and now live a totally normal life, and am a voluntary childrens counsellor. My friend who I met through teens support group who was bulimic is now a psychologist.

We ever ever thought we would get better, or better enough to be normal-ish. Takes a long time. I wish I could tell you the magic cure, I wish their was one. Do you want to talk about your dd? Has she had time as an in patient?

Milo - can you ask to see your local crisis team, maybe have them involved in your daughters continuing care when she is discharged? You can get referred by your doctor or ring th e local CAMHS office the numbers for which are normally available on line (that is if she is under 18, if she is older you will need the adult mental health team). We have a specialist eating disorder team based in our local community but it is very new and has just been set up and as far as I am aware this is something that is going to be rolled out in other areas.

As for the fat/thin debate, I think anorexia is a completely different kettle of fish to someone being obese, very few people get fat because they have a mental illness, most of them are fat because they eat too much and are too bloody lazy to exercise, some will claim ignorance, lack of ability to make decent meals but it is not rocket sciene and the information is out there how to get fit and lose weight.

IMO anorexia is a lot like OCD, i.e. obsession with weight, compelled not to eat, absolute fear and anxiety at the thought of losing control and getting fat. Maybe learning more about how people recover from OCD (which is more common and therefore probably better funded in terms of research etc) might provide some suggestions for how you could help your daughter. Just a suggestion.
I really hope things improve for you.

Anorexia is often not about being fat at all it is about not having the ability to deal with other aspects of your life.

Same as OCD, not about hand washing etc, about control and coping with with life, IYSWIM. As I say, just a suggestion. I think there are striking similarities between these two anxiety illnesses. The OCD literature and websites may provide something useful if the OP feels she's exhausted every avenue.

So sorry to hear about your daughter and glad to hear she is making some progress.

YANBU to be angry about the lack of funding but YABU to set anorexia against the obesity problem. Just because they both relate to unhealthy weights doesn't mean they should be set against each other in terms of funding. Anorexia is, as another poster said, about more than just weight and should be considered in the same category as any other health problem You could equally say why is anorexia underfunded when money is spent on cancer. To some extent, I think classing it as a "weight issue" might be part of the problem in terms of under-funding. It needs to be taken seriously as a mental health issue.

Spenguin - I freaked out not because I am unhappy with my body (why should I be?) but because as LittleRedDragon - the issue is the casual insult Fabbychic attached to body size.
The fat are insulted (I'm not bloody lazy actually) and the dangerously thin are ignored as the OP shows. What a great job our culture does of embracing and supporting difference.

I 'freaked out' because I thought the pejorative phrase was a bit unhelpful in a thread about the life threatening nature of an illness that generally brings a morbid fear of fatness with it.

Milo, so sorry for your daughter. If I were you I would find a GP who is better at dealing with mental health issues and who will support your family properly.

I'm sure you're well aware that anorexia is all about control and that you have to address the underlying problem before the weight issue can be resolved. And you have to be prepared for the odd relapse when something knocks her out of kilter.

One of the most enlightening moments I had was when my husband said "you claim it's about control but you aren't in control because your weight loss has made you ill".

Obesity is not 'being addressed' - yes we're a bit obsessed with it, but if it was actually addressed properly we wouldn't have hte problem we have.

I agree however that ED are also woefully under-studied and treated... as are most mental ilnesses that can't be "solved" by the pharmaceutical industry.

OP YABU but only because you're comparing the wrong things. The visible anti obesity funding is a public health message to encourage average people who do not have an eating disorder of any kind (neither anorexia obviously, but equally not any compulsive eaters or anything else which is causing the obesity)

The message is about making the average person try and eat a little healthier and take more exercise - and yes as fabbychick says because that will reduce the cost of treating anyone.

Telling the compulsive to eater to "eat more healthily and take some exercise" isn't going to help them at all, just like telling an anorexic to eat some more won't do anything. Both of those problems need to be treated through professionals not through public information messages.

As others have said all Mental Health funding is poor and difficult there's no special anti-anorexia issue. And it seems you have a real complaint against Bupa if their doctors genuinely didn't care about the symptoms simply because your insurance didn't cover it.

OP YANBU.

I've got something to add, and I might be talking shite and misunderstanding the illness but I'll say it anyway to see if anyone agrees.

I've always thought the "treatment" for anorexia is a terrible thing to do to someone in that situation (I'm talking about the admitting to hospital and "making" them eat a certain amount with the threat of tube feeding etc if they dont)

They are just being fed. Which may seem good because it is nutrition and it will make them put weight on when they jump on the scales - but what sort of weight? In my opinion, force-feeding and fattening-up can't cure eating disorders. Food is perceived as a punishment.

There must be a more positive treatment process, one that will encourage the patient to become more independent.

If the weight they are gaining is fat, imagine how terrifying this would be to someone for whom fat is the enemy. If only they could place more emphasis on body composition. They could help the girls achieve a super-lean but HEALTHY body by building up muscle and lean mass. A big part of the programme could actually be exercise in the form of weight training. A carefully selected diet with the correct amount of life building protein and energy giving carbohydrate to fuel their body sculpting programme. They would be constantly reassured that they are not getting fatter, but stronger and leaner, like athletes and ballet dancers. They could have rippling six packs and beautifully defined arms and not an ounce of fat on them (not literally - but could perhaps aim for the lower end of a healthy fat percentage for a woman of perhaps 15- 18% - which is incredibly hard for most of us to achieve, and is a very lean and defined look, periods would return, health and bone mass could be maintained at those levels). They could be empowered by this achievement.

They could weigh them daily using the kind of scales that tell you what is fat and what is muscle, and show them each day what muscle they have built, and reassure them that they have only gained small amounts of fat, showing them the improvement in their body composition in terms of lean vs fat. They could gain confidence as their new, strong, but still very lean bodies emerge. They could keep their need for control but direct that into having a perfect but HEALTHY body with the right education.

Am I talking out of my arse? If so, apologies. And for the OP, I'm not trying to undermine the treatment she is having, I am only talking about force feeding really, I have no idea what else goes on in these units.

Just to clarify, when I say a "terrible thing to do to someone", I'm not talking about them being admitted, I'm talking about whoever designed the programme I suppose, because parents of anorexics have very little choice it seems regarding their treatment.

From what the OP says it sounds hard enough to find help, let alone be choosey or choose from different approaches.

If only this were possible.

OP - I'm so sorry you are going through this and I really hope your daughter gets well and lives a brilliant life.

FWIW - obesity and anorexia are both Eating Disorders. They are all about control. With one you control your physical appearance, with the other you control your emotional state by medicating with food.
As such, they both count as mental health problems.
Both can result in death. Both can leave the sufferer scarred for life. Both are incredibly complex and difficult to treat.

Fabby You would not abuse an anorexic, why would you abuse an obese person?

Sorry TattyDevine but I think what you suggest could be very dangerous and would simply be replacing one body addiction with another! Anorexic's are often already addicted to exercise and have a very good knowledge of body composition. It is also often not about actual "fatness" but the number on the scale so no amount of reassurance that increase weight is down to muscle would help. I don't really agree with the force feeding but at some stage it does become needed to maintain life. People with anorexia aren't force feed unless their life is in danger and in in patient programmes they are encouraged to eat to restore a healthy weight and develop a better relationship with food.

Suggesting they could be taught to keep control by directing their goals and a perfect healthy body is not going to heal the mental issues as it is maintaining an unhealthy obsession with the need for control.

I suppose.

Obviously the ideal scenario would be to be able to reduce and ease off the control/obsession.

I can't help think in the meantime to replace it with one that gives you a healthy body instead of one that might kill you is preferable...

But if the numbers on the scale thing makes it unworkable then no improvement would be had and I do agree that force feeding is indeed necessary to maintain life in the meantime...

Thing is a lot of anorexic people already work out to excessive levels, its not just about not eating enough, so for many it would just be perpetuating the illness.

Anyway I digress from the OP, sorry.

I think eating disorders of all types are underfunded and often mistreated but we have to remember that obesity itself is often the result of an ED and can also result in death. Getting help for anorexia is so complicated because there simply isn't a cure all to be offered and it takes the individual to make most of the progress themselves.