to have refused my 24 yr old son a lift- sorry bit long.

[purplepeony]

after he swore at me?

Not having a good day. DH is in bed with flu as of last night- feeling awful. he drove 300 miles round trip to bring DD home from uni.
I am fighting it off.

Was awake at 5.30am, then I went to Waitrose to collect turkey etc & shop at 8am.

left it in car as I am not supposed to lift heavy weights after a gynae op. and got shop to take to car for me.
Son comes home around 2pm and for the last 3 hours i asked him roughly once an hour if he would kindly bring in turkey for me.

He had also asked for a lift out tonight- I agreed but had already refused same for DD - I just don't feel up to it- we live in a rural village - all dark single track roads. (She is being picked up by friend)

anyway, I said I would take DS as he wanted to go by 4.30. I asked again for him to bring turkey in PLEASE. he said it could stay there all night and be fine- but said he would get it "in a minute" - this was 3 hrs after first asking. I got a bit mad and said please do it now- sick of waitng as I needed to clear fridge and see what would fit once turkey was in.

he told me to piss off. I said no lift.
I said I would take him if he apologised.

He has made his own way there now- he will collect his car tomorrow as he has a lift home. as he left I said he could have had alift if he had apologised. But his parting shot was I was a horrible person and totally unreasonable for shouting at him " for no reason" and can't I see I'm in the wrong?

I am fed up.

I've read the OP again more carefully, and now see that he doesn't live with you. I which case change the locks and send him a list of rules for guests in case you decide to have him over again for a second chance in the future.

I think serious words are definitely going to have to be said to him, preferably with the rest of the family around.

I would normally advocate immediacy for this kind of incident, but not sure whether the morning of Christmas Day is the appropriate time.

I hope to goodness that your husband, when he gets up tomorrow will support you in telling your son that his behaviour is not even appropriate for someone 10 years younger than he is, and that if he wishes to continue to live with you into 2011, he really needs to change his attitude.

I hate to say it, but I hope the person/people that he ever decides to live with in a romantic relationship is strong enough to resist his emotional blackmail and manipulation of emotions. Does he have a partner?

Goblinchild - I've re read and I'm not sure I agree with you, I took "Son comes home around 2pm" to mean it is the home they all share....
I'm sure Purple will clarify.

If he doesn't live there, then what is he doing demanding lifts? He is an adult. I don't turn up at my dad's house for Xmas then expect him to give me a lift to the nearest pub. Even IF I went out under those circumstances, and that is a big IF, I would drive myself or expect to get a taxi! Cheeky fecker. I would forget to cook him any lunch.

He is leaving- he has just found a job a month ago that pays enough for him to move out-we live nr London so it's expensive.
he tells me he hates me, has no respect and that when he leaves home he wants nothing to do with me.

I do not tolerate his behaviour- far from it. I scream, shout and tell him to GO. I wanted to throw him out a while back by DH wouldn't.

DH does tell him he is out of order but obviously not in a way that he isn't afraid to keep talking to me like this. it may be the end of me and DH- though of course he wasn't party to this episode today.

amazingly, he is charm personified at work and has a very good higher degree and is very bright. he just hates me. Goes back a long way.very difficult child- a few thing such as ADHD and dyspraxia etc- but hard to live with.

This has just ruined what I hoped would be a calm Xmas for once.

Shouldn't ruin anything at all.
It's all dealt with now. You said what you were going to do, you did it. Enjoy your evening, the fuss is over, back to calm.
Really, accept that nothing more needs to be done if he is on his way out of your house shortly. He might be a bit less of a twerp once he's running his own household, it all sounds like a power struggle to me.

Hec- I hear all you say. I know that. But my DH would never kick him out. I have threatened to turf him out and wanted to but DH never would. and really hand on heart it would be hard to put a son out on the streets.

I think what I see as wrong is that DH would talk to him and say his behaviour was unacceptable blah blah blah..but there would never be consequences for him- DH would still give him lifts so he didn't have to drive ( and could have a drink) or he loans him his car ( nicer and safer than his ancient run about) whereas i think all that should have stopped until his behaviour changed.

sorry- this is turning out to be longer than I anticipated.

I am just sad that I have such a bad relationship with my son as i do love him.

I have a 24 year old son. I can't imagine him ever doing that now, at 15 maybe. Mine has lived away from home since he was 17, I think that makes a difference. I do think you have a right to be treated with a lot more respect than that. Poor you. Hope you have a peaceful, happy Christmas somehow.

It's awful. It must break your heart. I can't imagine how I would feel if that was me and one of my sons.

But you have to stop him. Not just because treating you like this is totally unacceptable, but because my god, how do you think he is going to treat his wife / partner? He displays classic abuser traits. That's really worrying.

The fact that your husband doesn't see this is also worrying.

You can love your son and still expect him to treat you in a civil fashion, rather than accepting him behaving like a spoiled teen (Not that you spoil him)
Your DH is helping create a poor learning environment for your son, so I'd be having words with him too.

Purple... so for you. I've come across you a lot on other threads and you always sound reasonable and sensible. We are a similar age with similar aged DC too. Except my DD is the eldest.

FWIW my son has never ever spoken to me or his dad like this, be him age 4, 14 or 24. (have had the odd nasty moment with DD though). He needs to move out asap. Me and DD have never got on better since she moved out and realised how much love and care she had when at home.

Chin up lovey... have a fab xmas despite him.

OP - am I right in thinking that you had another thread about your DS a few weeks back? And that this goes way back to his early childhood when you were really struggling?

Yes.

It's gone on for a very long time.

One minute he is charming and wants to chat- the next he is in a foul mood and takes it out on me.

he was away at uni for 4 years. when he came home in the hols then he was much better. Now he has been home for 2 years some of that time- for a few weeks- unemployed, or with temping jobs and i think he was verging on being depressed. he was certainly very angry and used me as a metaphorical punch bag.

He is in denial over his behaviour. any time I try to discuss it he turns it round , saying I have been horrible to him all his life.

don't know where we go next. People who know me well and know him- like his god mother- say leave it until he has left home.

It IS a power thing- I admit I wear the trousers in the house and he resents it. He tries to turn DH against me too.

Not having a go at you, and it doesn't excuse his current behaviour; but the relationship went sour when you were an adult and he was a child. He may be an adult now, but his childhood issues have never been resolved yet, have they? My sympathies regardless.

TNS thanks for the support.
I am grateful for all your support everyone. I do not accept his behaviour- if I did, then I would not be posting. I am very very angry and sad for much of the time.

I am going to leave this now because i am fighting off flu and if I keep reading i ill just get more emotional and maybe the bug will bite! I need to switch off and keep positive.

Thanks everyone.

You have been horrible to him all his life. You said so on the other thread.

"I continue to remind him of his bad behaviour from aged 2- 18. His response is that he was a child and couldn't be responsible. That is where we disagree.

I continue to harbour resentment over how he was, and maybe this colours my day to day reactions to him."

And much more of the same.

You had some very good advice on that thread, but didn't seem at all interested in following any part of it that involved looking honestly at your own behaviour. It doesn't surprise me at all that you've smiled sweetly and exited this thread the moment someone raises your role in his behaviour.

This sounds like I'm having a go: actually I'm profoundly sad for you, your DS and DH. It was brave of you to start that thread; but it has haunted me ever since for the insight it gave into the thinking of a toxic parent.

you are most certainly having a go.

I have PMd you.

It takes 2 to have a relationship - good or bad.

Yes, I played my part, but I don't think even now that a child is a "child" when they are mid to late teens.

If it were you- could you erase every memory of what your child had done when they repeat the same behaviour day after day for over 20 years? I doubt it.

I admitted on that other thread that I had made mistakes- my DH and I had counselling, and help through our GP, seeing and talking to experts. No one at any point then said it was "my fault". They actuelly said we had to be even "firmer" with DS.

anyway, i am not reading any more. If you want to beat me then don't bother.

This swearing at you and the general abuse are all not only unacceptable, but sound like clear evidence that he's angry with you. Sounds obvious, I know.

The rude and disrespectful treatment will continue until the root of the problem is addressed, and Christmas isn't the time to try and iron it out.

I don't think you should accept this treatment. If it were me, I wouldn't let him in the house until he had agreed to behave appropriately. In exchange, you could agree to sit down and really talk to him about what's behind all of this. At 24, this is staggeringly inappropriate. (Might take outside help to really resolve anything? Sounds serious for both of you..)

Anyway, I really hope you can find a way to get through this weekend. There is a lot of pressure on everyone at this time of year to be perfect, have a perfect home/dinner/relationship with everyone. It's very rarely actually like that for almost anyone. I'm usually OK at Christmas, but I don't like the fact that some people feel under so much pressure.

Good luck, and don't put your health or self-respect at risk is my (sage) advice. xx

pp I have admired you many times on mumsnet .You seem a strong sensible person who is not afraid to stand up and say what you think in the face of a tide of (flawed IMO ) received " wisdom".

My thoughts were far from considering you a toxic parent. In fact I thought is Mumsnet ready for a toxic Children section? Because that is what's needed here

Your son sounds like a nasty piece of work however he may yet grow out of it.