Child Protection over Friends Only Facebook Pics

[HarrietSchulenberg]

At the nursery Christmas play parents were asked not to put photos on the internet in order to respect the privacy of other parents and children. I take internet security VERY seriously due to my paid work and that of my H, which requires absolute confidentiality. I am also a School Governor.

I put some pictures of my son on Facebook. My photos and profile are accessible only to my Friends, which comprise of a very small group of personal friends and family. The photos did not contain any reference to the school, the children (other than my son's first name), year group or other identifiable information. I never tag photos.

I received a phone call from the Child Protection officer from the School today. My photos had come to their attention and I was formally reminded of the need for internet security.

Through a process of elimination of my Facebook Friends (wasn't hard) I have worked out who is responsible. I am very hurt and surprised that this person has put me in this position, seeing as her own internet security is, at best, lax.

Have I been very stupid, or AIBU to think that I have not breached any child protection measures? I could just have well have printed the pics and shown them round at the school gates.

I think the OP was wrong to publish pics on the internet of other people's children without permission.

But, I also think it is wrong for schools to ban taking of photos / publishing of photos on the internet for all parents for the sake of one child who may be affected. It is a draconian approach which is unnecessary.

A couple of approaches my children's schools / preschools etc have used are...

*No pics during the actual performance, but at the end photos can be taken. For children for whom child protection is an issue, or parents do not want their child's picture to be put on facebook etc, then they are removed before the photographs are taken, and group photographs are taken of children whose parents are happy that there are free access (The justification for this is that whilst they may request pics are not put on facebook etc, they cannot control what parents and other people do etc. EG, the OP may have emailed the pic across to her mother, who may then have put it up on facebook). Once the pic has been taken, there is no control over what happens, the school cannot guarantee that it is not put on any websites etc, so if you're not happy for your child's pics to be on these places, then their pic is not taken.

A second approach which also works is that parents are not allowed to publish pics on facebook, but the preschool takes pics and publishes a load of lovely ones, which the parents can link to on their accounts. That way, the preschool controls who has their pic up, and only parents who agree to it will find their children's pictures on there.

I understand that children (particularly those in care etc), need protecting, but I also think that too many schools have gone too far in just doing complete bans, not allowing anything on facebook etc, which is unnecessary if the school just thought a little more creatively about how they managed the situation.

I would also like to add, further to my last post and in response to niceguy2 - and in particular, your statement that adoptive families having the ?freedom of choice? to not have our children?s photographs taken is at the expense of everyone else?s freedom. I have to tell you, it?s pretty naïve. Adoptive parents don?t make many choices out of preference or on a whim. The choices are made for us because of risks to our children?s safety. We don?t have the luxury of simply taking a few snaps and not worrying. I don?t think other people?s children should suffer as a result of the ?choices? we are forced to take - but I don?t equate being denied the opportunity to publish photos on the internet, with suffering

My 2 DC are not in the school play this year, we are taking them away for the day to visit their Dad a day earlier because of the photo issue and our inability to control the use of images of the children.
We have fostered from within the family, there have been serious threats made against the DC by unsavoury elements in their mothers life. The eldest is aware and is okish with the choice but not so her younger brother. We are always aware that they maybe found through pictures and as in the past parents have refused to help us protect the children by abiding by the School rules [Scouts seem to have no issues yet] we have to remove them from the situation.
A friend who does put her DC photo's on FB uses paint to put a stamp on the DC face so they are not of printable quality if someone tries to copy/use them, We were shocked by how many young people did not know how she did it, we are showing our age by knowing how to do it.
I really want to go back to the write a letter,put a stamp on it and send it by snail mail. I an really not that old

I like those compromises Oldjolyon I will be suggesting them to our school
I am waiting for the day the Children have camera phones and the pictures end up where we do not want them due to lack of knowledge

Oh please LisasCat. If anyone has the mentality of being "special" or being better than anyone else, it's yourself. With your attitude of why you had to "ban all parents". Well done you are so powerful. Your ego must be so satisfied. I cower in your presence. Personally I'd rather you used a bit of common sense but I see it's often lacking nowadays so you are far from alone.

Have you actually evaluated the risk? Do you even know what the risk is? Did you actually place any weight upon how all the other parents would feel or on their rights too? Or did you just ban everything because you know better?

May I suggest that the parent's attitude which you read as "i'm better/more special" is actually a parent who heaven forbid wants a photo to remember a special event? I know! I know! How controversial eh? Let's stick them in prison quick for daring to want that. Won't they please think of the children!?!?!

Sterry, I'm glad you can see what I am saying. There must be a balance. Just because a tiny minority of people have particular circumstances, we shouldn't prevent the majority from lawful enjoyment of life's simple pleasures.

The peanut analogy was mine and I feel sad for the schoolkids who go to the school which actually changed their entire policy to suit one child. Where's a roll eye smiley when you need one?

Sorry Sterry, just seen your later post.

I didn't say anyone was suffering and perhaps my point wasn't clear.

The point I was trying to highlight is that if you ban parents from taking photos in case they share them just so that your child can be in a play then your freedom has come at the cost of someone else's.

I also don't mind a sensible compromise and like I keep saying, I am sympathetic to those who do have extenuating circumstances but I do take exception to the whole "We know best, we'll ban everyone" mentality.

It's like the polar opposite of the Daily Mail "hang em all" mentality. I don't want to live in either of those worlds. I just want to see a sensible balance.

Surely it's only common sense/politeness not to put photos of other people's children on Facebook or similar?

I did say I didn?t want a ban - I don?t expect the world to stop turning for me and my son. I just expect that where a request (or ban) exists not to publish photographs, then we should be able to assume that photographs won?t be published -
If this is not the case, then it is only right that parents (particularly of vulnerable children) are informed, so that they can take the necessary steps. It is about child protection, after all, not about freedom of choice

That?s how I feel, Bramshott too -

Niceguy2 - which is beginning to look like rather a misnomer, by the way.

"Oh please LisasCat. If anyone has the mentality of being "special" or being better than anyone else, it's yourself. With your attitude of why you had to "ban all parents". Well done you are so powerful. Your ego must be so satisfied. I cower in your presence. Personally I'd rather you used a bit of common sense but I see it's often lacking nowadays so you are far from alone.

Have you actually evaluated the risk? Do you even know what the risk is?"

Do you know the risks, Niceguy2? Have you even read canyou's post above yours of Tue 14-Dec-10 10:30:51? Several people on this thread have outlined very real risks to chiildren.

Feenie I should say we removed the DC from the situation so that the other parents would not feel victimised but I will be seeing can we do what Oldjolyon suggests next time as it seems to be a fair solution for everyone

I love Mumsnet it gives practical solutions when I get lost in the mess of emotions

This isnt about taking photos of children is it? It wasnt a problem a very short time ago. Its because those photos can be shared so quickly and so widely - thats the problem here.

niceguy really - would you like a picture of your child to appear on my DS's birth mother's website? I doubt she would bother to crop or photoshop any pictures she got her hands on. So as well my DS the chances are several other kids would be featured.

Lovely, picture it if you will. A young woman, topless, pouting with finger in her mouth. Proudly annoucing Mother of Two and still hot as F**K. With the logo MILF in bold letters. Next to this a photo of my son plus several school mates.

Horrible. Ok, not putting the other kids in danger. But ergh, would you really want it?

I dont think photos should be banned. It would annoy me no end if I was told I couldnt take pictures, I dont object to being told I should not share them on facebook.

I am sure there are loads of people who do not wish their children's pictures on the internet for lots of reasons. Its not all about adoption and peados.

HarrietSchulenberg Sat 11-Dec-10 02:07:46

At the nursery Christmas play parents were asked not to put photos on the internet in order to respect the privacy of other parents and children. I take internet security VERY seriously due to my paid work and that of my H, which requires absolute confidentiality. I am also a School Governor.

the original post ... the school hasn't banned pictures simply asked parents not to put them on the internet.

We usually provide the opportunity for parents to take photographs of their own child in costume and also to photograph a "tableaux" of all the children at the end. That way any children who need to be "removed" for any reason can be taken out of the picture.

If other children were in the picture then you should not have put them on FB at all. You should have used photos showing only your child or cropped the other photos so the the other children were not visible.

I would be concerned if our school governor was breaking the school rules.

I have no problems with having my DD on FB, with some security settings or not named if public access. But I would never put on photos of other children without their individual parent's permission.

NiceGuy 2

Why is "blurring out the background not a reasonable solution?"

maryz - I agree with everything you have said too. Was lurking yesterday but could not trust myself to respond without swearing. So just contented myself with playing "DailyMail Phrase bingo"

"Why is "blurring out the background not a reasonable solution?"

Because as a semi professional photographer I'm not about to ruin my carefully composed shot to satisfy the paranoia of a minority.

You really aren't listening are you?

LookToWindward obviously your carefully composed semi professional photograph is much more important than a child's safety

And you appear not to give a shit about other people's children either. This isn't about paedophile hunting (as you would know if you had bothered to read the eloquent replies above). But hey, who cares as long as you don't ruin your carefully composed shot

"LookToWindward obviously your carefully composed semi professional photograph is much more important than a child's safety "

No one has demonstrated that by publishing my shots I'm realistically endangering anyone. I've seen two - maybe three extreme cases that are so far from everyday reality that they may as well be asking that we ban cameras altogether.

I have several beautiful albums of my kids when they were growing up, including school plays, days out to the beach and so on (and yes they are available on line).

They give huge pleasure to me and my family and will be hopefully be continued if my passion for photography is passed on to my grandkids.

I see no need to deprive myself and my family of that due to an example that's so unlikely it may as well not exist.