to have demanded my money back?

[DiamondShoes]

DS (4), is off school this week due to an injury and is very sad about it. So I took him into town to look at shopfronts/choose decorations/get out of the house.

We went into a branch of a food/soup/coffee chain for something to eat. Ordered a hot pie to share, a cookie for DS and a bottle of juice. Paid extra to sit in.

Arranged our bags, coats etc and started forking up the pie. DS pipes up that he needs to go to the loo. He'd just been in the department store, but he's four. I have a look around and can't see one (not uncommon in town), so ask if he can use their staff toilet.

The member of staff says no, against policy. I say that it doesn't matter if its manky, DS is four and really needs to go to the loo. Staff member says no, against policy. I ask what he suggest we do, then, as we have just paid for our food, which is sitting on the table. He suggests we go to the bank next door(?! Banks have public loos?).

I ask if he is offering to watch our bags and keep our food warm and he says no, he's not.

So I say I want my money back. He gets the manager who reiterates the not policy bit and makes a massive massive production of refunding me (triple checks the reciept, counts out every....penny..., won't take back the change from a tenner they gave me two minutes ago and return the note).

But he does, and DS doesn't pee himself, we get our stuff and leave the food on the table and after a frantic scurry down the road we find a cafe which lets us use the loo.

At the time I was all blown up with righteous indignation but I have been thinking today what the staff member would say about it and how it could look to someone else, and wondering if I was being unreasonable?

YABU

They can't always let you use the staff toilet, because if they don't have someone available to escort you, you could slip into the stock room and nick whatever you fancy. Also, they are probably not insured to have non staff members in certain areas.

My Aunt runs a small independant shop, she is often the only person there, and if people use the toilet in her shop she either has to run the risk of someone stealing from out the back, or someone stealing from the till or the main shop. Her personal belongings are kept near the toilet. She also worries that something from one of the high up stock shelves could fall on someone. But then she worries that people will think she is mean and not want to come back if she says no. she can't win.

How ridiculous. When I was in B&Q with DD2, then toilet training, she saw the set-up fake bathrooms and tried to get on a toilet, then started to wee on the floor. We were shown all the way upstairs to the staff toilets by a very helpful member of staff, then left to sort ourselves out in our own time. I couldn't have been more grateful! Name and shame I say.

i think that you may have been a bit OTT

if there was a loo next door, i think a quick smile- a "Well be right back, keep an eye on our food! " would have done it really. it wouldnt have taken more than a few minutes and you could have continued in peace. i would have asked anyone near by to keep an eye on the food and taken the bags with me.

however, i have been known to have irrational outbursts myself and only afterwards see the alternative point of action

There is no legal requirement for cafes or restaurants to have a public toilet, although it may be a requirement of the local authority or the local Environmental Health may insist on one over a certain number of covers.

They were being arses, thouigh, and presumably the manager hadn't considered that the result of his go-slow with the refund could well have been a pool of urine on his floor.

I would have popped the cookie and juice in my bag, asked them to keep the pie back behind the counter (preferably in the heater), nipped down to Peter Jones and then come back to finish my lunch. You were unreasonable to ask him to look after your bags. I would certainly not choose to frequent any shop or cafe in central London that did allow its customers to leave luggage unattended.

i really dont think that cafes have to provide toilets. in the town where i live there is a really big coffee shop converted on the cheap. it is next door to a public loo so everyone just nips out and uses them. cant see how they would have got pp if it was compulsory

We were allowed to use the staff loo in Co-Op recently when DS announced very loudly that he needed a poo

You don;t have to have a loo, depending on the amount of covers you have (I knew my Hospitality Management degree would become useful one day!!!!!!) I seem to remember it was about 15 or more....though that was back in the mid-90s so might well have changed now.

Should have let him wee on the floor - that'd teach em :o