To wonder what class I am and why it should matter

[ForMashGetSmash]

I might come over as a fool here....but be gentle...because I really want to get decent input.

I grew up on a council estate in a very poor area...the local steelworks closed when I was about 8 and the majority of Dads were out of work...we were lucky in that my Dad got another job.

I had a wonderful childhood...big family, very close community...traditional type upbringing with chapel, school and corner shop all within a stones throw...you called the neighbours Auntie or Uncle whatever and could trust anyone in the street.

In the Summer the older kids would take the little ones off on excursions on the bus with a picnic...they just did it, they weren't told to...it was all very homely and close.

Now the area is a midden...a cesspit of drugs and teenage Mums with no support for them at all, there are a lot of offenders living there in halfway houses and it has had a big effect as it is a tiny community...

I now live in a nearby city in what I would have called a "posh" area...people don't speak...other parents are wary of one another and the kids aren't allowed out to play at all.

I feel sad and mourn the fact that my children won't experience the things I did...walking to school alone...playing out all day in the Summer...having a great big gang of kids who were sort of extended family...all we have is a nice house and polite neighbours. ..my older DC goes to a private school nearby and has lots of friends but it's all arranged playdates...she is happy...but why then do I keep thinking back on the past? Is it a case of rose tinted an all that?

I miss the seventies and being working class. I Still am working class...I'm just pretending to be something else...and that's why I feel trapped and miserable.

arfasleep...we do go to the park of course...but this is a big urban area...you very rarely see the same kids twice.

I agree with you on the working class if you work thing...we ALL work to some degree...landed gentry work at keeping up their country pile don't they? Managing it and so forth...does that make them working class? Nah.

I am a chav, it's nice.

Have one very amazing working class Mama and SF who is very MC.

Went to a comp and also Uni.As did DH.

Live in frobisher-esque A list part of town (DH googled our postode and laughed like fuck when discovering the type of people we were supposed to be), we call it Surbiton (or Stepford Street when all males are out putting stripes in their lawns at the same time every Sunday.)

I embrace benign parenting, ASDA (caramel) choux buns, "create your own" pizza and kebab/indian takeaways.

My DC's are feral and live in sportswear.

My home decor is well documented.

Life is good.

We all live in sportwear aswell. Genuine 3 stripe only though, none of that 2 stripe buisness

Sportswear = no ironing

3 stripes all the way here with occasional pikey when we bring it back cheap from outlet malls in Florida. In bulk.

Do you reckon we are the only ones on here who even get the number of stripes thing

My ds would not wear sportswear..hes more emogothchav

Middle class area where I had my first DC had a strong sense of community and was easy to meet and make friends.

Working class place we now live is very hard - alot of 'outsiders' we've met say the same - actually we since found out its reputation in the surrounding local area that they are all a bunch of inbreds who only speak to each other.

I have met people but god it is hard work - and most of the ones I get on with are the ones who've left and come back or not from here originally.

I've met and get on with two families down the road - but there is another one with DC is same class as one of mine I am currently smiling at - I didn't go to school with them so every attempt to talk to them been ignored so far.

God I want out its so depressing.

(taps finger on side of nose) shhhh.

DD is chavgoth in that she has neon purple hair, black eye make up, etc. But wears 3 stripe and fugg.

NonBlondeGirl It sounds like the place I grew up...others said it ws full of inbreds...it kind of was...and there was an attitude that you needed to be there for years before you were accepted.

I think it's because many families had been there for 100 years...the place was built for the steelworkers....so all my mates at school culd trace themselves back to their Great great grandads....all I can suggest is that you try to be uber friendly and helpful...a bit of pushing won't hurt.

....all I can suggest is that you try to be uber friendly and helpful...a bit of pushing won't hurt.

Been doing that for 3 years and counting - with some successes it is just a lot of effort all mine all the time. But thanks for the thought.

Unfortunately three years is also long enough for professional services in area to have adopted patronizing and dismissive attitude they have towards locals with us - (though some of these have come to regret that) but not long enough to be 'accepted' by locals.

Want out for the kids as much as us - we worry the low aspirations are catching like a plague.

Is there a reason you don't move?

well I grew up in a pretty posh area.

we lived outside on the street, used to go out in the morning and return around tea time (supper time though in my house). We used to go in and out of each others houses, doors unlocked, eat whereever. Kids still play out alot on the streets when I go home, people very friendly.

We moved to a big city in a traditional working class area and because of crime/traffic people let their kids out much less here, we do a little but they are only 5 and 3 so not really because I'm scared of the drivers around here.

Not just a class thing. Often an area thing.

Is there a reason you don't move?

Money and schooling.

House needs money and time we don't have immediately to be spent on it before it would sell.

Primary school - 2 DC in and happy so don't want to keep moving them about and they appear so far to be doing o.k. there. Want to avoid dire secondary school though.

Waiting for DH career to settle so know where in country he'll be working and trying to get me back in position to work and bring some money in so we can afford to buy into a better/different area.

So the plan is to move on while trying to make the best of we have now.

I'm usually less negative about the locals but some recent interactions with them have been so depressing.

I don't believe in class! I myself am from a "upper middle class background", and it doesn't mean shit! Its all make believe.

Who cares if you own your house, the bank owns your house, a landlord owns your house!

Its all stupid and mans jack!

You come into the world with nothing you go out with nothing!

I care about owing our own home - but that because we spent ten years being messed around by various landlords and not a class thing.

We didn't think renting and having DC in school went together well - two months notice they give goes by so fast and schools limit your locations.

Then there is the whole finding somewhere suitable to rent with DC, getting important repairs done with some landlords finding or strange people in your house for inspections, repairs ect.. which all seem worse with DC around.

I agree with thos eposters who say class is all about attitude.

I have all the trappings of being MC - uni educated, good job, DC in private school, house in the country, dogs, chickens, horses, yadda yadda...but I will never ever be middle class.

Having moved from a working class town to a middle class village though I can totally relate to what the OP says. People are less friendly, more weary, everyone looks busier, less inclined to help, less inclined to open up or meet up.

I have lost count of the number of people I have invited for lunch/bbqs coffees etc but have never had one single invite back, so now i accept it's just the way it is. In the last place I lived we had so many playdates/friends/invites we never stopped!

There is a big difference in attitudes imo.

Or maybe our face just doesn't fit!!!!!

Busier then. Too busy making money to socialise? Working class people work too though.

OP, sorry you haven't had more luck with your neighbours.

I live in a well-off area, my neighbours are all lovely, very friendly. The only reason we can't let our kids play out in the street together is traffic - pure and simple. We've all agreed if we could shut the ends of the roads off, we'd let the kids out in a heartbeat. It's nothing to do with paedophiles, video games or the the media. But when there's regular traffic and the occasional idiot going way over the speed limit, you just can't let young kids out. Older ones maybe. Some teenagers on our road try to play out but are having to move aside for cars every couple of minutes at least. We had a street party once and shut the street legally and the kids were all out playing, cycling, all ages mixing from morning until night, just like the OP remembers. It's TRAFFIC, folks, that has ruined a lot of community cohesion. ONS figures say average daily traffic use has increased by 150% between 1965 and 2008; 30% increase in car numbers in the last 10 years. Parents have to respond accordingly.