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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

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Original poster

to think we're all going to pay for stuff we don't access, so suck it up (a bit)?

31 replies

Diamondback · 12/10/2010 19:51

Sorry, long title, but I am getting so narked with all the divisive rows over university fees/Child Benefit/benefits in general with people taking sides and making broad DailyMaily generalisations.

So, is it fair that people who don't go to uni contribute to people who do? Well, yes, because people who never have children still contribute to WTC and CB, SureStart, etc. People who never claim benefits will support those who do. People whose parents died early will still pay for loads of other people's parents' care homes and nursing care, without ever knowing if they'll need these services themselves. People without disabilities support those who do.

Sure, there's tweaks to be made and the odd, rare, ligger to be weeded out, but the whole point of the welfare state is so that we're not a Big Society of Cunts, leaving the weak and the poor to be picked apart and trapped in poverty.

Hmph.

OP posts:

southeastastra · 12/10/2010 19:52

i think if your being faced with possibly losing your job on top on all that yes yabu

ABitBatty · 12/10/2010 19:53

Agreed

WilfShelf · 12/10/2010 19:54

I absolutely and completely agree with you. Of course.

I just wish the rich weren't so free to squirrel their money away so it becomes untaxable.

ABitBatty · 12/10/2010 19:54

I mean I agree with all the OP says YANBU!

HalfTermHero · 12/10/2010 19:55

JUST lISTEN TO YOUSELF, OP - WHAT A SENSE OF ENTITLEMENT YOU HAVE!

Nah, just joking. Yanbu. But try and tell that to Dave and his big bunch of society cunts.

southeastastra · 12/10/2010 19:55

don't worry i didn't think you were agreeing with me

eventide · 12/10/2010 19:59

YANBU. Can't stand the benefit bashing threads on here. Everyone trying to tot up who's paying what and who gets more.
And I am not claiming and have never claimed benefits other than CB. People should just focus on their own lives. If anyone wants to have such an 'easy' time on benefits they could but most people don't - they would rather work and sneer at people who don't.

Original poster

Diamondback · 12/10/2010 20:20

southeastastra - why would you assume that I'm not being faced with losing my job? I was actually made redundant in July and most of my ex-workmates are still under the big swinging axe. Surely if you're in danger of being imminently unemployed, that's all the more reason you shouldn't begrudge the existence of benefits - you might have to claim them soon (I do hope you don't though - it's never nice).

And yes, WilfShelf, I'm kind of a hypocrite because the one group that really do piss me off is people who earn loads and then dodge tax - if all the tax that should be paid, was paid, the govt's tax income would literally double overnight - so the real drain on society is tax avoiders...

And Bono should be shot, for telling us all that our taxes should be spent on alleviating world poverty, while moving all his own tax affairs to the Netherlands so he can 'non-dom' it up in Ireland - pay for some fucking hospitals in your own country, you tightfisted cunt!

Aaaaaah! I feel better now. I'm off to knit some hemp knickers and hug a hoodie

OP posts:

undercovamutha · 12/10/2010 20:23

OP - totally agree with you.

YakkinTosh · 12/10/2010 20:42

I didn't go to Uni, my DC might not go to Uni, but one way and another we need the people in society who have been to Uni, and we benefit from that.

I wouldn't risk crossing a bridge designed by someone who left school after GCSE, and I wouldn't be chuffed if I was represented in court, fighting for my innocence by a lawyer who left the education system after AS levels! I choose what shows to go and see based on the knowledgable reviews of Literature graduates, and their comments help me get more out of what I see.

People are so small-minded.

thewook · 12/10/2010 20:48

YANBU, except that you used the phrase 'suck it up' which I can't abide. On the other hand, you called Dave and his Tory crew a bunch of cunts, which is about right IMO.
I like the idea of us all being in it together, we do live in an actual society, as opposed to a big one.

cansu · 12/10/2010 22:06

YANBU I'm really sick to death of all this crap too, particularly this phoney idea of the Big Society where we will apparently solve all our own problems and stop caring about others.

DeadPoncy · 12/10/2010 22:22

Quite right, OP!

PinkieMinx · 12/10/2010 22:32

I don't think liggers are as rare as some peole think. I know many who abuse the system, and am sick to death of the lack of responsibility they take for their lives and choices.

DioneTheDiabolist · 12/10/2010 22:38

YAB a bit U. Yes we should all do our bit and the benefit bashing needs to stop. However I think that we shouldn't have to suck it all up when the government could implement and make it easier for the vast majority of us.

DeadPoncy · 12/10/2010 22:43

The trouble with the way we think about society is that people tend to congregate with "people like us", and as a result:

(a) There is a lot of resentment about "the amount paid out in benefits"/ "the amount those bastard bankers get paid" - no-one feels connected to the people across society from them, unlike YakkinTosh 's rather nicely-put explanation of how we all cross-benefit from one another.

(b) the different parts of society don't know much about one another, either. This is exploited by the endless "columnists" who fill the newspapers instead of proper reporters, whose material explains and spreads understanding rather than spreading prejudices opinions.

musicmadness · 12/10/2010 23:23

I'd normally say YANBU, however with the results of the Browne review (not suprising but still extremely disappointing) and having to hand over most of my loan to my landlord today I'm not feeling particularly "suck it uppish" at the moment! I'm feeling more along the lines of why the hell do I have to pay for anyone else when I've got no bloody money left for myself (not that a loan was really mine to start with but still...)
Will feel more altruistic again in a few days I'm sure.

BecauseImWorthIt · 12/10/2010 23:34

YANBU. It is the hallmark of a civilised society that we pay, collectively, for the greater good of all our citizens.

Unfortunately, the current climate and the way things are heading, pushed there by the current government, is only going to create more and more people who are losing out, and who are going to be resentful of those who haven't lost out.

Why should you care about someone else if you are in dire straits?

DioneTheDiabolist · 12/10/2010 23:47

Cuts at the moment fly in the face of economic logic. I am appalled that they are happening and that the govt. is using propaganda to brainwash people into thinking that they are good. We should not allow ourselves be sucked into this mindset by the government and media highlighting the case of the few professional spongers out there.

Original poster

Diamondback · 13/10/2010 10:36

"Why should you care about someone else if you are in dire straits?"

Because it's in your own interest - one day you'll be the one needing help, so do you want to be part of a society that will help you, or that will say 'screw you - I'm taking care of mine and no-one else's!'

I'm struggling against being sick of scrimping and resenting people who never feel sick when they see a bill, but at the same time, I do use the NHS, I went to a state school, I went to university, I drive on public roads, visit the local park, get my bins collected, etc, etc. I'm certainly not in favour of people who take the piss, but they are a minority.

Love the Robin Hood Tax link though - I don't understand how in America they could bail out the banks on condition that they paid it back pronto, and we couldn't do the same here. If we are going to raise bank taxes though we'd have to put some pretty stringent legislation in place to make sure they just didn't pass the cost on in charges to customers...

OP posts:

TheCoalitionNeedsYou · 13/10/2010 10:43

You don't pay tax for particular things. You pay tax to be part of a functioning society.

TheCoalitionNeedsYou · 13/10/2010 10:44

"I like paying taxes. With them I buy civilization."

PinkieMinx · 13/10/2010 10:58

I think that is a simplistic view - far too much money is wasted. I feel I buy 'red tape' with my taxes. Frankly I think people should be responsible for themselves and their own families far more. I like the idea that if you don't contribute you should have no access to public services, like the NHS, libraries, etc - everyone can contribute in some way.

Spidermama · 13/10/2010 11:05

I think there should be a 'close tax loopholes' march or day of action. We could all swallow the cuts so much easier without the sickening knowlege that greedy, rich fucks are getting away with it yet again!

How can anyone seriously embrace the Big Society notion put up by this toff who's protecting his mates and his wife with her £700 pound dress. GRRRRRR!!!!!

BecauseImWorthIt · 13/10/2010 11:27

Diamondback - I know that! I was meaning that it's not hard to understand why someone would think like that.

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