to think this man should have left his blooming chat to get his dog?

[Tokyotwist]

I took my 2 yr old to the park yesterday. While there a dog approached us and started running circles round dd. The thing was as big as she is. I wrapped my arms round her and tried to sheild her from the dog.

The owner was about 10 metres away having a chat. Eventually he noticed and called the dog. Didn't make any effort to come over. The dog runs back to him and we carried on.

Less than a min later it was back again. Same behaviour, same response from man.

My dd thought it was fun but I was really worried. Especially as she is the type of child who would try and pet the dog.

AIBU to think he was being irresponsible? I've been bitten twice by dogs so I'm not that keen on them. But I can't understand why he would think it was okay for his very large dog to be this close to a 2 yr old when he's not within reach himself.

Muddle, I'm aware of the laws you've quoted. I have yet to see the interpretation you've put upon them wrt a dog which doesn't return to recall needing by law to be on a lead, being implemented.

It's on signs in Wales. Let me see if I can find it out on my counties website.

Nan, I did. I work with dogs, I have sufficient experience and back up to do what I did and have and would do it again without hesitation.

I would NOT UNDER ANY CRCUMSTANCES recommend that the average dog owner does as I do/did.

I have to go walk my three dogs now - both on and off lead. :)

I mean, what Vallhala said in her original post.

Muddle, here in England that requirement might come under local bylaws but isn't a law in itself.

BTW, you've quoted the Dangerous Dogs Act, which the vast majority of those involved in dog welfare and rescue will tell you is a pis ear of badly thought out, rushed in, knee jerk legislation. It's something which I am actively involved in working to have repealled or at least sensibly, humanely and significantly altered.

now I REALLY must run - apologies to anyone who is going to argue with me and who I don't respond to, it's not personal, I have dogs to walk and work to do!

[s.3(1) Dangerous Dogs Act 1991] - and the definition of dangerously out of control is 'any occasion on which there are grounds for reasonable apprehension that it will injure any person'

Training a dog removes it's natural instinct?

Some one ought to tell my terrier that because he had a jolly good time playing ball with dd1 now his recall has improved enough for us to leave the long line trailing. It's probably the best fun I have seen him have EVER. And his walks are much enjoyable now that he is not choking himself by pulling on his leash so much. He is greeted by more guests now that he does not jump all over them as soon as they enter the house.

In general his life is improving in line with his training and he is become a much happier, more balanced dog.

I like well trained dogs with self control and good manners.
I think Muddle meant 'doesn't remove their natural instincts' as in even the best trained dog...

tbh "running circles around dd" isn't being aggressive or doing anything wrong. Was the dog jumping up or barking loudly or growling? If not it wasn't doing anything wrong. I have had to pick up ds when he was 2 years old in similar situations but more because I was worried about what ds would do not the dog.

As a safety issue I definitely would have moved ds away from the dog after he was called the first time. If the dog had returned I would have asked the owner if it was possible to keep his dog away from ds completely as a 2 year old can get very excitable around a running dog.

I would have approached the owner in a reasonable way but that is because I would not have been scared of the dog in this situation.

The Op has already said she was scared herself, that along with a dog and a very small child in the mix is not a nice situation to be in.

I suppose the real argument is between those who see the point of and like dogs and those who don't. If you dont like dogs and see no reason for having them as pets then no amount of arguing that this situation was not dangerous (based on what was written in OP)is going to wash

Ah right, I see that now. Although I still don't get it. It's generally not in a dogs instinct to chase, hunt, injure, kill or eat small children. Not unless they look and smell like small furry animals anyway, in which case you have more to worry about than your dog.

BYes, isn't that the point Bumbling? That if you don't like dogs then you shouldn't have to have one circling you and your children and scaring you? Or jumping up or whatever others have said? Even a nice dog can be scary to many so if your dog is likely to bounce at people or go back to them again and again then you should restrain it surely?

I love dogs and have dogs but I don't like other peoples' dogs sometimes

I meant you can train a dog but NOT remove their instinct. Retarded typo sorry.

I don't think YABU. I would not like a strange dog jumping around me or my children and I love dogs! I just think you need to be cautious. If the man was aware that you were uncomfortable then he should have kept the dog away from you. The fact that the dog came when his owner called him is all well and good but if he was so well trained then the owner should have asked him to sit or stay beside him until he finished his chat. Have some respect for other people in the park - not everyone loves dogs! You wouldn't let your child run off and clamber over other people if you knew he or she was annoying them so why is it ok to let your dog do it!

Tippychoocks - Yes but as others have said in the owners eyes the dog was probably just being a dog and he probably had no concept that it was being frightening.

As I said I would have asked the owner to keep the dog away but I would not have shouted as I would not have been frightened but just making sure that an accident didn't happen. Also shouting is counter productive in this situation

The dog owner in the OP was not being particularly sensitive to the needs of others. If someone looks distressed by your dog you need to remove it from the situation permanently. However maybe the dog owner was having a bad day, distracted or whatever

One of the reasons I don't like the AIBU threads much (I must keep off them) is the insistence that the other person is 100% to blame in the situation being described. In this case the dog owner was insensitve but the OP did have some control over the situation (which doesn't sound that dangerous anyway).

Of course in some situations dog owners are completely irresponsible and the outcome is tragic but there is a world of grey inbetween the perfectly behaved dog who never moves without a command and the out of control beast that savages everything that moves in its path.

In this situation the OP had some choices to improve the situation for herself but some of those choices involve taking some responsibilty for her reaction (asking the dog owener to take the dog away permanently, moving somewhere else, taking the opportunity to start teaching her dd about not touching strange dogs)

The problem is that the OP is afraid of dogs (that is OK a lot of people are) bit she is asking too much of invividual dog owners to know that without her telling them.

If the Op had posted that she had asked the owner to permanently take the dog away and he had refused my repplies would be different.

Ah that's no fun Bumble, stop being reasonable

YANBU. If I thought that someone was scared of my dog I'd keep my dog away from them. She's not a threat, I know she's a big softy at heart but doesn't mean others realise this.

I understand your fear as you have been bitten before but the worst thing you can do is project your fear on to your child. My DD loves dogs but she isn't allowed to pet them without permission from the owner. She once approached a border collie but the owner said not to stroke him as he was old, cranky and in a lot of pain so didn't have any patience for small children, so we walked away.