...in thinking that my partner has lost the plot.

[Uniquorn]

My partner is self-employed in a creative/technical industry where he either has an extreme amount of work on (say for an intensive few days a month, almost around the clock) or none at all (before the last 'batch' of work he did I don't think he earned anything for two months).

He's been doing this career for ten years and is obsessed about it and making a name for himself in it.

We have numerous on-going battles about the money that he is bringing in. We have just had a baby, so this is even more pertinent now.

When he does earn money he has severe cash flow problems, as the people who employ him don't seem to give a shit about paying contractors and he on average gets paid 2-3 months after doing a job, meaning that the money that comes in goes straight out again to the people who lent him money to tide him over whilst he was waiting to be paid!

He hasn't paid National Insurance in years and I am deeply worried about this, as it will affect him getting a pension in later life. He is burying his head in the sand and doesn't seem to give a shit.

He announced to me today that "my career is the most important thing to me in my life. Always has been, always will be".

This has made me deeply sad. What the hell am I supposed to think about this? :( Can a man's career REALLY be more important to him than his son and partner, or has he just lost the plot?

I am extremely sad (and angry - what a fuckwit - how can your career be the most important thing in your life?) and wondering whether I should just go it alone.

Why's that then? taxpayer largesse?

Thank you for all your responses. I read them and cried like a baby because seeing your impartial reactions in print made me realise that I'm not just being a moaning, nagging woman. You of course have only heard my side of the story and things are never as "clear cut" as that, but seeing your responses really made it clear to me that whatever the circumstances, that there really is something seriously wrong here and it can't go on.

I took a risk and showed my partner this thread. He did what I thought he would do: get angry, defensive and storm out to go and hide away and get stoned.

He emailed me at 4am to say that he had been crying for most of the night, taking stock and accepted that things are different now.

We shall see.

Me posting on here has proved a real turning point and I now know that we can't go on as we are. I will keep you updated as to what happens next.

Thanks everyone.

BTW - I'm such an idiot (blame it on sleep deprivation from new baby that I posted that response with my usual user name (I changed my user name for this particular thread).

Oh well, cover blown now. It doesn't matter.

SOmetimes otherwise nice men who are obsessed with their 'creative' careers (which they are either rubbish at, or which are the sort of 'career' that depends far more on sheer luck than hard work eg rock star, novelist etc) can change with a kick up the arse. There are quite a few jobs which are pretty flexible in terms of hours but which still bring in an income, he could do one of those and still carry on with his dream in odd hours.

Did he want to be a Dad?

Maybe you shuld read the 'wifework' thread?

Schnizel: I feel I was ever so blunt, sorry, but I guess I still feel a bit Grrr at my ex's way of living. I honestly stuck in there because I truely believed he loved me & dcs to death, and that someday everything would improve. In the early days I admired his tenacity, his willingness to stick to his guns and do what he loved doing. The scales began to fall from my eyes after years of struggling with unpaid bills, handouts, the insecurity of not knowing when the next job would be. Ofcourse he couldn't possibly find other work - he had to "be available" for his creative work. And that included not being available to look after dcs as he might take off on a wee contract at a moments notice...so couldn't rely on him doing schoolruns, holidays. He had to be "free". Therein lies the heart of it - freedom from responsibility.
I did manage to persuade him to branch out & get another skill to help supplement his creative career. Spent quite a bit on retraining HGV. For a few months he did that and weyhey we had money. Then he jacked in in. Did his head in apparently (the job). I actually started to see him for what he really was: a lazy bum, still living in the no-responsibility-so-what-if-my-family-is-on-JSA mindset of the typical weed-smoking 18yr old (mental age), who completely failed to see that after 15yrs in the industry he was never going to make a living out of it.
Oh- and the rushing out, getting stoned, back in floods of tears, declaring undying love for his family - always after being confronted with his responsibilities (sure we dont have same man here?!).

He is now free. Glory be, he's a happy man. Free of family responsibilities. Free to find someone else to support him in his quest for his career (which he quickly did). At the end of the day THAT was was he wanted - more than anything. You see, he didn't really love me & dcs to death atall, it was all part of the drama in which he had a starring role. Now he doesn't even want to see dcs. He doesn't have to play that role anymore.

I am so relieved to be living my own life again.

Oh and as a postscript. If there are not a shitload of responses, then ladies, it is all over and the men have won

Jameelaq, I didn't understand your postscript as your previous post got deleted.

Kissingfrogs - Don't worry about being blunt. I posted on here to get frank feedback and I got it. He is back now and has said that as a starting point he has to knock the weed on the head. I am going to be as supportive as I can but if he falls into the same cycle again I really do think I won't hold much hope for the future.

I am willing to give him a chance but a definite turning point has been reached this time.

It's the drugs. Everyone I know who has had a partner who used drugs regularly found they became increasingly lazy, selfish, demotivated and paranoid. I'm not saying he isn't naturally lazy and selfish and demotivated, but the drugs will make it all worse.

Jameelaq - the OP does have a job - she's on maternity leave. The "why don't you get a job" post was really unhelpful and insensitive.

Heh - nice of him to tell you his career was his priority before you had DS. Well, we will see whether his actions match his words.

In the meantime:

• do claim child tax credits
• do not lend him any more money and certainly do not spend any more of your savings because before you know it, it will be in the thousands not hundreds. I have been there.
• do not be his pension!

If he's been in the game 10 years and hasn't made his name in it yet, will he ever?

Why don't you get a job? or speak to iliketosleep who complains her husband works too hard?

Its true, I never see DH :(

You could claim tax credits in your own rights, child and working tax i think. He does seem abit obsessive about this particular job even though it isn't working out. Is it not possible that he could find a job with a company that allows him to have the same job he has now but with a guarenteed wage coming in?

Take this

It should show you how much or what you will be entitled to :)

It is a slightly sexist thread though. How many mumsnetters do not a stroke of work or else mess around with a very low paid arts type part time work and expect their other half to support them? Probably about 20% or more. Why is it okay for women but not for men? I support 5 children alone. Why shoudln't the original poster here? Just because you're female doesn't mean you can't be 100% responsible for supporting your children whilst your other half does a lot of childcare, cleaning and pursugin some very low paid type of work?

That's a good comment Xenia. Maybe the OP could comment on their childcare arrangements. Does her DP do the majority of the childcare, cleaning, etc?

Xenia the original poster does work, but the point is that this doesn't bring in enough to cover the bills. No-one has said here that that would be okay if the gender roles were reversed. I'm currently faffing about in low-paid, artsy work while my DH supports me - but then I supported him while he built up his business.

It's when one of you - either one of you - isn't pulling your weight and the bills can't be covered that problems appear and anyone - male or female - who wants to endlessly 'pursue their dream' at the expense of their partners mental wellbeing (because being the sole/main breadwinner is v stressful when there's not enough money) is selfish.

OP, I spent a good few years trying to break into the film industry, doing very low paid, insecure jobs for small production companies and trying for the big break of working on a production that would be successful and provide good CV material, but I found myself nearing 30 and that break hadn't come. I didn't want to live in poverty forever, waiting for a break that might never happen, so I went and got a proper job. Life is tough. Your OH isn't a teenager living with his mum anymore.

And legally, if you're self-employed, you MUST register to pay NI.

And if he has money for weed, why isn't that money in the food budget?

And how old is he that he's storming off into the night, crying and getting stoned, instead of talking to you about your problems and trying to work with you so that you're not constantly made stressed and unhappy by his lack of responsibility?

I'll stop ranting now - this guy just makes me cross...

Yes I didn't mean to suggest he was anything other than a waste of space particularly the drug taking but it's certainly a model often seen on mumsnet - women earning nothing much at all and expecting a man to keep her for years and years and perhaps not even doing 100% of the housework whilst looking after the baby.

His income may be below NI thresholds. You pay in different classes if you are self employed. He probably isn't earning enough to pay NI. As his partner - I thnk they aren't married so I hope she's not co signatory and liable on his £15k+ debts and I wonder who owns the house etc - she would not be liable for that.

It sounds like she loevs him so there's nothing wrong with one person working full time as I always did when my babies were even younger than hers and the other earning quite a bit less or nothing as long as they are doing their fair share of stuff at home of course. Presumably he can work this wonderful career around looking after the 4 month old baby when she gets back to full time work.

Xenia, send them all down the factories and the mines why don't you, hell you've done it so lets make sure everyone else has to do it too. That's how you come across.
If a man goes out to work and mumsnetter is at home with baby do you really think that she must do 100% of the housework - that hubby shouldn't lift a finger, that when he gets home he must be oh so unable to wash a dish after his strenuous daily 9-5? Isn't that sexist? Looking after babies is 24/7, there's no let up, it's mentally and physically demanding, it's work, raising children is work, but hey you wouldn't know about that would you?

Xenia- the Mumsnetters who you say dont work, do work, they just dont get paid for it.

and nor should anyone be paid to be a sahm.risible notion.to be paid for economic inactivity whilst others have to go out and do their tin in for min wage.dont be so daft. if a parent choses sahp that is fair enough just dont expect financial remuneration for watching your own kids or washing your own undies.what next a salary for walking your own dog?

Thanks for the info people.

Xenia - as the poster said, I was working full time and am now on maternity leave. I will probably have to go back to work (or find a new job as I hate my old one) quicker than I had originally anticipated, due to this situation. Before the baby, if I had earned a decent salary I wouldn't have had a problem supporting my partner whilst he "built up his business" for a finite amount of time. The difference was, I wasn't earning enough money to support us both and he has already been in his industry for 10 years, so hardly just starting out. The proviso was that I go on maternity leave and he get as much work as possible. Because that work (in his industry) hasn't surfaced his next thought should have bloody well been to do all he could (to work one or two more jobs if necessary) to bridge the financial gap.

After all the stress and crisis of this week, we are having a "summit meeting" where we are going to talk about what is going to be best for us regarding work. It could well be that I go out to work full time and my partner becomes a SAHD. If this happened though, he would have to realise that he could NOT do his career AND be a SAHD at the same time (I'm sure some people who plan to work from home comically think they can stay at home with the baby/kid and do a 40 hour working week - oh dear).

realistically after 10yrs is he ever going to make it?given it is likely every year new grads and new creatives enter his industry.is nice to dream and strive for sure,but not when it causes such strife and uncertainty

good luck with your discusssion

Good luck schnitzel.

I got flamed on a thread for being pissed off that my DH wasn't contributing. It's fine for them to have a dream, and for them to be supported while they try to achieve it.

But it can't be one-sided forever. If he is not contributing (child care, housework, financially, I don't care how) then you really have to kick him up the arse (or out the door).

The weed thing is where I'd start.

as adult and parent role of provider supersedes any dreams of making it.the need to buy food,pay bills and provide has to be paramount to what ifs