when cousins marry

[bradfordhousewife]

before i begin let me get this out of the way. i am a Muslim married to my first cousin by way of arranged marriage. we have a beautiful and healthy son. and we live in Bradford. we're happy. and thankful.

now that's out of the way, let me tell you about my 'well meaning friend' (her words). when i saw her last week i mentioned that the husband and i were thinking it was the right time to try for another baby. yesterday she messaged me about a documentary another Muslim friend of hers had told her about and that i should watch it. i am obvs referring to When Cousins Marry (more info at www.channel4.com/programmes/dispatches/episode-guide/series-68/episode-1. initially i decided against watching it because a) it clashed with Eastenders and b) i would be too busy cooking for dinner to break our fast. priorities, eh?

i wasn't offended by her suggestion, that documentary highlights a harsh reality that people must wake up to. i want to be one of the people who breaks this awful cycle where my kids are concerned. but i think i might be taking this a bit personally. having just told you i am planning to have another baby would you really ask me to watch a documentary that i will most likely find distressing and potentially put me off trying?

"and i too would not think highly of anyone who is made aware of the risk, and chooses to ignore it."

What do you mean by this though? You say you married your cousin?

Indeed.

"i didn't enter this marriage blindly, i am well aware informed about this issues and if there was a history of problems with my husband's family i would definitely not have married him."

Well, anyone who had a baby over the age of 35 is taking an increased risk with birth defects. Over forty, the risk of birth defects is much much higher. No-one is suggesting a ban on women having babies over 35 (or indeed having children with older men, as paternal age is also connected with increased risk of birth defects). Surely the solution is to get as much information as possible, have genetic screening if possible, whilst changing social norms along the way (which the OP said she did want to do for her children). Many people are often very good at pointing the finger at others and declaring they would never do anything to increase the risk to a child, whilst doing things like having babies over 35 which is a known risk (and one I'd take myself).

i was referring to the post where cashmygold where the parents were in denial.

But you are in denial bradford. As far as I am aware you have not had genetic testing and are relying purely on the fact there are no obvious problems in your families.

According to other posters here the programme showed that that was not enough.

YOu are one of those parents!!!

Yes, I was just trying to make the point that people often make calculated risks with having children, not just those marrying cousins, such as people having more than one child with a genetic condition such as Huntingdon's, or people who have children over the age of 35.

no, we did have genetic screening. i'm not going into the details here because my OP was about whether i was wrong to be upset at my friend's suggestion. i am not ignorant of the problem, yes we went through family history and have had genetic screening tests.

re: 'i was referring to the post where cashmygold where the parents were in denial'.

sorry onetoomany was referring to reply previous to yours.

I agree onetoomany. But each person in these groups need to recognise that they are taking an increased risk - I certainly recognised it having children later in life. We knew we were increasing the risks of problems to our children but it was a risk we were selfish enough to take.

No use denying it though like the op seems to be doing.

i see what you mean now frogety frog. i recognise the risk will be there regardless.

Wow. Terrible idea. I saw the first half of the programme and couldn't bear to watch the rest.

Is there more inter marriage in both your family's histories?

it is awfully sad that this still goes on. Can't quite believe it. I know it's a cultural thing, but when I heard last night that one third of the children with kidney abnormalities are pakistani even though they make up only 1% of the population, that should really bring it home.

The gene pool needs to be wider. That is the bottom line.

Did you have genetic screening before marriage bradfordhouse? At the proposal stage, before anything was finalised?

It is good that you have decided to break the cycle with your children. I have no problem with cousins marrying, only when generation after generation of them marry each other.

Good luck with the new baby, hope everything goes well Insha Allah.

I didnt know op had had genetic screening prior to trying for children. That seems sensible and responsible to me. Then surely the risks are very very low of problems?

I think your friend was probably meaning well, but still a bit out of order. This is particularly so if she knew you had done all the testing.

FWIW this is always going to be hard. I realise intermarriage raises risks, but surely, all this suggests we should all have genetic testing before we have babies with our partners! For instance, I have a genetic disorder (mild in me, can be more severe but not normally life threatening), which is 50/50. Unlike what I had once been told (less than 25%, cos I am mild... by a dr who was meant to be a specialist... tbf, not her fault because it was still in research phase at that point). You either have it or you do not, you don't carry it. I have 2 children. I won't be having any more because my 2 are ok and so I won't take any more risks. BECAUSE it is not how the condition affects me that is crucial... it is how it interacts with mine and my DH's genes.

Was it unfair of me to take the risk at all? The consultant didn't think so, but he made it clear that I could have children who were much worse off than me.

I am a mutant... maybe my parents have it? I don't know...

Maybe we should all test for stuff. Known risks should always be accounted for, but I think this raises issues about all of our genetic health!

OP - I think your friend was responsible to let you know about the increased risks.

Bradford is well known for concentrated pockets of children afflicted with rare genetic diseases.

I don't believe the OP or any of the other pakistani cousin marrying people I know have had any sort of genetic screening.

Most look at their close family and think - looks fine to me..let's have kids.

A lot of denial going on!!

OP did you say you already had genetic screening done before you had your first dc? if that is the case and got the all clear then I really wouldn't worry, you can't just never have more children your whole life just incase of possibility that something may be wrong, which can happen to anyone anyway - it's an increased possibility, not a certainty that it will happen if you are cousins and impossible if not. You are already married now so just have to get on with your life and insha Allah it will be okay...
Would be different if you were not yet married but considering your cousin, and they mention these risks but what can be done about this risk now, you are already married..
I know there is a risk but tbh I don't know anyone with a disabled child who is married to their cousin, and do know of quite a few healthy children, so not to say there is nothing in it but perhaps the scare mongering is not really necessary especially for those already married and already done the genetic tests and everything!
You said you will break the tradition of cousin marriages with your own dc and try to marry them outside, that's probably the best & only thing you can do. You cant exactly put your own life on hold by never having more dc, or what else does your friend expect for you to divorce from your dh and marry someone else? clearly unrealistic and ott reaction
i hope everything goes well for you

The Op has said several times that she has had genetic screening.

OP - I think it all depends on your relationship with you friend. Does she know you're aware of the risks or not? Genetic screening won't pick up everything. If you've discussed all this with her and she knows that you've considered it YANBU.

However, I live in a country where cousin marriages between the local population are the norm (have heard it described as 'well I know the family will get on with her and it means fewer people at the wedding"!). There is not widespread awareness of the true risks and there is (of course) a significant number of children born with birth defects. They've recently introduced compulsary genetic testing before marriage. From being here, I'm well aware that just because someone seems educated doesn't mean they aren't in complete denial of the risks.

If a good friend was worried I might be in denial I'd expect her to point out the documentary. To be honest, I don't see why it's offensive unless you're burying your head in the sand a bit. If there was a programme on TV that related closely to my personal situation I'd expect a friend to point it out even if it was negative.

At the end of the day what you do about further children is your choice. However,there is an increased risk of a disabled child with or without genetic testing. You're not selfish for wanting to bring that child into the world (hell, that would be saying it's wrong for disabled people to be alive!) but it is important you truely understand the risks you're taking when you make a decision. Overall, YABU.

GothAnne - what she said was that they had screening done during pregnancy with their first child.

That's a different kettle of cod.

I don't think its relevant at all that no "history" in your husbands family. If you are both carriers of a genetic disease unless one carrier marries another everyone has healthy (carrier) babies and everyone is happy.

A carrier has a 50% chance of passing on carrier status. If 2 people share grandparents and one of the GPs was a carrier of something then there is a higher chance that 2 carriers will marry each other - which gives a 1 in 4 chance of a baby with the condition, and a 2 in 4 chance of the baby being a carrier.

Also sadly some of these conditions are not apparent until the child is slightly older, and only 40% can be tested for. I think your friend said the right thing so that you go into TTC understanding the risks.

What MumNWLondon said is true, the "no history" isn't entirely relevant. My mum's step-sister married her cousin, and now their daughter (my cousin) has gone blind because of a congenital disease. She must have been in her 20s when it was diagnosed, and had had children herself. Her sister is fine, though, and no other family members show the condition - although many must be unwitting carriers.

OTOH I was an older mum, and looked at the risks before I contemplated having a child. But like the OP, would have been a bit put out if another well-meaning friend had also pointed out the risks to me! I guess she was concerned you didn't know the facts.

I wouldnt be offended if a friend asked me to watch a programme which featured people in my position. I find it interesting to watch other people deal with the same issues I am dealing with.

And besides, the programme may have thrown up new research that wasnt known at the time of your tests.

OP - a lot of people have said your friend's timing was tactless, but she wasn't in control of when the programme was on! I suspect she just texted you when she saw it advertised. She seems like a friend who's looking out for your best interests.