to think that we NEED libraries? This is horrific.

[StuckInTheMiddleWithYou]

Would MN like to run a campaign on this?

www.independent.co.uk/opinion/commentators/terence-blacker/terence-blacker-hands-off-our-public-libraries-2057131.html

I actually feel really strongly that libraries SHOULD stock a wide range of popular stuff.

The pleasure of choosing a frivolous read or getting hold of the latest Twilight or Harry Potter isn't something that should be confined to children with parents with a fiver to spare.

Reading is a delight as well as a learning experience - and people who enjoy Mills & Boon are just as much entitled to that delight as people who enjoy the Encyclopaedia Britannica.

libraries should be growing in popularity, whilst we all declutter and recycle more libraries are the perfect eco friendly service. They should be expanding libraires. I use mine at least 6 times a week. Its a real cultural community centre.

David Cameron is a nut job

oops sorry x-posted. I live in North London. It depends what you mean by reference library - basically most boroughs should have their central hub library which contains the basis of their collection.

You can also use inter-library loans which is a fab service - however that tends to work only within areas. There were moves (I think) to link it up but I believe that's been abandoned.

Are you looking for something specific? Most libraries will allow you to access their catalogue online and you don't have to be a member to use the reference collection.

And although I feel a bit of a traitor for linking to it on a thread about local authority libraries, there is also the marvellous London Library www.londonlibrary.co.uk/

I have no problem with popular books. So long as they are not the only books being stocked.

I am sentimental about the notion of a library. Just find that the reality of what I get in terms of a library is very different from the 'library' in my heart. Hence, my questioning the value of my seemingly underutilised local library. I probably need to look harder for a better library.

youngvisitor, I understand the London Library costs hundreds of pounds a year to join. I guess if libraries were privatised, that is where we would have to go to get proper facilities.

As for what I mean by a reference library, this is the library of my heart. When I was growing up, I wanted to do ballet. I would go look up the ballet section in my public library, find shelves and shelves of books on it and lose myself.

I reckon I would do better browsing at a big Waterstones than going to the public library.

So would you be prepared to pay more council tax to keep your library open?

In the county that I live the

Cheif exec earns £206.000 per year
his side kick earns £126.000 per year

The next 5 top earners earn £750.000 between them

90% earn under £30.000

you listen to all the cuts - but I don't see the top earners getting cuts

yet 1000 people in the county council where i live will live that earn under £50.000 will have a pay cut

libraries don't have books in them and are going to have self service counters - yet the wages each year for the top earners is obsceane

yes the London library isn't cheap, although there is a day rate (or used to be).

I think what you're talking about is not the reference section but the non-fiction section - reference usually refers specifically to the books you can't take out of the library ie encyclopaedias and dictionaries. Most of the non-fiction section will be available for borrowing.

Westminster has good libraries - you could try the Westminster reference library or the Marylebone Library? Maybe start another thread about best London libraries in your area though - because this one's liable to get derailed!

taken from the North Devon Journal

Last month it emerged Kevin Lavery, chief executive of Cornwall Council, cost the taxpayer £239,000 a year after employers' pension contributions were added. He was one of 30 council officials in Cornwall earning in excess of £100,000.

and this isn't the same county that I live in

try looking up Essex or Pembrookshire and Kent county councils chief executive salary - they are way out of control and costing thousands and thousands each year - over a million pounds is spent each year on the top earner in the council - less than 20% of the workforce - yet at the bottom 80% of earners are earning far less than £50k and face cuts of 20% of the wages

Volunteers can do the jobs - but it will nto effectivley cut the wages bill - you need to go to the top and cut wages at the top, as this will save millions over a decade - country wide

youngvisitor, yes, I mean non-fiction. Thanks for the tips

i love our library. we go every week to story time and get books out. they have lots of toys out and colouring in. it's just a lovely pleasant chilled out place to idle away an hour or so. i get all my info from there too about what's on, classes for children, that kind of thing.

i haven't heard ours is closing..

YANBU

Last visit in 1996.

Libraries should be privatised and/or abolished.

Working-class taxpayers subsidising the intelligentsia is not my idea of "social justice"!

i have mixed feelings about this, on some moral level i think that libraries should be left alone, but i can't help but think...

amazon recently reported that the sales on e-books were more than real books for the first time ever. I don't think it's a stretch to suggest that the future is online. and therefore perhaps the govt should invest in some kind of dot gov library.

perhaps save city libraries and privatise the rest?

i dunno, i think it comes down to whether we really believe the country is in financial shit street.

tax payers subbing the intelligencia? dont make me laugh, libraries have either

mums and babies

students

or old people.

its hardly boden welly clad people checking out nigella on dinner parties. i would suggest its a lot of reference, carboard books that squeek and agatha christie/ dick francis

i get my books from charity shops, or i buy them, cos i like to keep them.

Even during the depression in the US in the 30's they kept the libraries open and working. That's what allows for social mobility and 'big society'.

And its not just books, I'd have never left the house when DD was born if I couldn't go and BF/use the loo in the middle of a freezing December/January. There's nothing else free to do on a wet miserable school holiday round here. Libraries are essential to me, and many people like me with small children who are voracious consumers of books. I buy 2nd hand where I can, but the library is invaluable.

and barmy - I don't think the working classes (ie me) are subsidising the 'intelligentsia' - she's only 2 and a half!

BarmyArmy, libraries are just as much for "working-class taxpayers" as they are for what you label the "intelligentsia" (who of course, are also taxpayers). Library membership is open to all.

If people really can't find anything of interest among the wide range of books to borrow for free, they can always order in any title that would interest them.

notrightnow Sorry, but it IS true. I have a job that when I applied required an NVQ level 2 (and NOT in library skills...in anything). Most public libraries will hire librarians NOT just assistants with no library qualifications at all. I have an MA, and in one of my courses this year, we had guest speakers...one from each sector, and in EVERY SINGLE library sector: law, public, schools, corporate...NONE of those required a degree from a library management programme. Not one.

So, sorry, it is not as respected as you might think, and it is a huge problem for me to think that someone with an NVQ is able to be a 'qualified' librarian...sorry...it requires a whole lot more education than that.

I would hate to see our local libraries close.
They run mother and toddler reading groups and song time so lots of chances for young mums and dads to get together and opportunity to get kids to see books. They also have internet facilities and you can get help with CV's. You can order just about any book that is in print and there is a huge choice of large print and listening books for those unable to read fine print.
How is our 'government' going to provide decent services if they privatise libraries? I understand that we are seriously in debt and money needs to be saved but everytime they sell off a service it declines.

With the fact that so many kids struggle to read and write shouldn't they concentrate on keeping as many resources open as possible. Mind you if they shut libraries and young single mums can't afford books for their kids and then they struggle to find work due to illiteracy then that is another stick to beat a single mum with.

Our library does provide ebooks now

I think a lot of you are panicking unnecessarily on this thread

we don't know yet how much money the government is going to allocate to local councils yet. Until that happens no actual decisions have been made. I doubt very much that every library will be closed or privitised. Yes libraries do use volunteers, selfservice machines are being introduced and some smaller libraries will no doubt close

but they'll stil be a council run library in most cities and towns

not sure what this debate about qualified librarians is. Qualified librarians do still purchase all the books etc make the big decisions but your storytime and ryhmetime session will be done by a library assistant. And the counter will be staffed by a library assistant, there the ones you see shelving. Librarians will be out in the community promoting things like the space hop Reading challenge, or ordering ebooks or deciding how to spend the budget

To be frank in our area they are closing other things and putting them into libraries to make it even more vital - like adult ed, some council services, tourist information

Barmy Army, this topic is too important for your reactionary trolling, go play on 4chan or something.

I'm planning on writing to my MP on this issue this week.

Would anybody else like to join me in this?

The more who write, the more they will have to pay attention.

www.theyworkforyou.com/mp/

An easy way to contact your MP.

Imagine if every MP recieved a letter on this issue in the same week...