To think selling a car to a family member is not a 'favour' and shouldn't be treated as such?

[JaneS]

My brother needs to sell his car as he's moving abroad. He approached me and asked if I wanted to buy it (I'd been trying to decide whether or not to replace my old car). Initially I said no, as I really needed a car then and he wanted me to wait three months, but he said he couldn't find another buyer, so I agreed, looked up the market price on Parkers and said it sounded fine.

Brother told me I could have the car the week before my wedding (when I really needed a car), then apparently forgot about it and said could I pick it up from our parents' house two days after I got married, as he was catching a plane out to his new job that day. I said it wasn't convenient and I could pick it up from the airport he was traveling from (much nearer to my house), if he sorted out the paperwork in time. I didn't chivvy him about this before the wedding as I was busy, but legally I can't do the sale papers myself (obviously).

Upshot is that he's left the country, promising to send the sale papers over, and the car is at my parents house. My parents can't store it there more than a few days and think I should insure myself as a named driver and pick it up asap as my brother was 'doing me a favour' and was 'too busy' to sort out the paperwork.

AIBU to think that my brother was being lazy/taking advantage? He has been very generous about wedding presents but he has also caused me a fair amount of unexpected hassle!

I think you're a little bit unreasonable, but I see your point. It sort of sounds like your brother has been a bit lax with his organisation, but he certainly doesn't sound malicious. So, IMO, YANBU to be annoyed with the extra work, but YABU be get massively annoyed at your brother, who doesn't seem to have any ill intent here (and since he has recently been generous to you with gifts, he sounds like a decent guy).

be get? I mean to get!

yanbu

he sounds like my brother, leaving everyone else to pick up the pieces

Oh, yes, Lou, he's certainly not malicious! He is generally kind if a bit pompous, and he thinks he is so immensely busy that it's all perfectly understandable. I guess I should get over it, but it is annoying to cut short my honeymoon and faff around sorting out insurance when my impression is that he simply hasn't bothered.

YANBU - he obviously thought as it's 'only' his sister, he doesn't have to get it sorted. If he'd sold it to a stranger he wouldn't have acted like that would he? V. annoying.

I don't think he's awful, I just wondered about quietly deducting money from the price of the car for travel and so on ... I know he wouldn't realize I'd done it but it would make me feel a bit better.

Well you know your brother & whether or not it was likely to end up like this.

TBH I would be pissed off with him "moving the goalposts" " would have expected things to be sorted as soon as I paid.

Otherwise I would have cancelled, I think.

Have you paid for it ? Is it the DVLA papers he needs to sign ? Yes he's been lazy and taeknthe easy option but ultimately you either want the car or not. Where does cutting short your honeymoon come into it and why does it matter to your parent sot keep it a little longer ? He's rather shafted them too by the sounds of it.

To be fair, diddl, I haven't paid him. I've offered (I have written him a cheque and tried to give it him), but he says I shouldn't pay yet. It is kind of him on the one hand, but on the other I have a suspicion he's enjoying being the generous well-off one. I've never bought anything from him before, so I didn't expect it to end up like this.

Liz - parents can't keep it long as they have builders in and won't have a space on the drive soon. I'm on honeymoon atm (and DH is off work), but my parents would like me to get the train up to theirs asap to get the car off their drive.

Yes, he has shafted them too, but they agreed to it on my behalf as 'LRD isn't very busy at the moment' (like hell!).

Does he know what an inconvienience it is to you? And that you're having to cut short your honeymoon? If that's the case, then he's more in the wrong than I thought.

Well you can´t do anything atm can you?

You can´t insure/drive yet as you are not the registered owner?

He knows I've just got married; he knows DH has two weeks off work. He also knows we're only at home as we can't afford a holiday away (but we do have things like theatre trips booked, which he knows about too). And he knows that the train takes 3 hours and then there isn't a direct bus (it is not a fun journey to my parents'). He knows I'm doing a PhD but doesn't quite believe this is like full-time work (though his was, of course).

It isn't as considered as all this sounds though - he means well, it's just never been possible to explain to him that I'm busy, because he imagines no-one is ever busier than himself. He does work hard, to be fair.

diddl, he says I can insure myself if I have the registration number? Can I not?

Eek. Better sort that out then!

So you are not actually away on honeymoon ? He just assumes you've nothing better to do. Could you parents drive it part way ?

No, we're not away (I didn't say we were). But we did tell everyone about our plans and how we were really excited about having the time off work, so it's not as if he thinks we're just bumming around.

My parents would be furious at the idea of driving it part way, it's not their car.

I'm just on the direct line website trying to work out if I can insure myself without the ownership details - not clear yet.

Sorry, don´t know.

There´s a "change of ownership" thing to fill in?

I don´t think you can register though unless he has told DVLC that he is no longer the owner?

Why not go online and see if you're able to get a quote?
I'm not sure but if the car is still registered with the DVLA in your brothers name the insurance may want some assurance that you are driving it with his permission as her will still be the registered keeper

i'm pretty sure you need proof that you are the owner to insure the car.

Not sure you can insure it in your name if you don't own it... If you have plans, you have plans and it doesn't work for you to go pick it up. If you were buying a car from a stranger, you'd just say this week wasn't possible. It would be up to them to sort it out. Do your parents have the keys? Can't they just go park it up elsewhere or is it not taxed/insured?

BTW - if I could afford it, I'd be sending him a message saying you've decided not to buy it after all, thanks for the offer and your sure he'll find someone else who wants to buy it.

rat, getting a quote doesn't have anything to do with it. You could put in any registration number and still get one (only know this because I did it once when I wanted to know how much insurance would be on a particular make of car!)

Thanks diddl, I will call direct line and ask.

I think you can insure it even if you are not Registered Keeper yet but you do need to complete the transaction ideally. Otherwise is his insurance such that anyone can drive with permission, although it may only be 3rd party cover ?

I think if you´re not registered the only way is to add yourself to their insurance?

And they would still get the benefit from any claim?

when we bought our last car from a garage we arranged the insurance from the day we paid and collected but DVLA form was only sent off then. Maybe different for trade though.

Liz, no, his insurance doesn't cover someone else driving. I think it may be that he thinks I can add myself to his insurance ... which isn't what we agreed and isn't great because I have some no-claims built up. I will check and see if I can sort out the insurance to kick in the same day as the transfer papers though, that would be ok.

Sorry, I am being a bit headless-chicken here but I'm glad of the advice.