to find people ignoring their babies in public uncomfortable?

[QueenSconetta]

I was in the outside decking area of a cafe recently with my Uncle, Cousin, DP and DD (8.5 months).

There were a group of Mums a few tables away, one of whom had a 10.5 month DS (I know his age because I heard her saying).

The little boy was crawling all over the floor, along the walkway between tables, under the table of people next to us and annoying their dog (to which the woman which getting pretty annoyed), came over to us and started to try and pull himself up on the back of the buggy.

AIBU to feel a little uncomfortable with the fact this woman was letting her DS crawl around everywhere while she seemed to be too busy chatting with her pals to pay much attention?

She retrieved him every so often, but surely this was at best unhygenic as it was essentially an outside floor where loads of dogs were sitting and at worst downright dangerous, with the potential of dog bites, toppled buggies and scalded babies as hot drinks were being carried around.

None of my business really and I didn't say anything (although I did nearly remove him from the back of our buggy at one point), just wondered your opinions.

I think it is a toss-up situation. Today I made DD sit in the pushchair when she wanted to crawl and explore. So instead she screamed the whole way round.

Which would you have preferred with your lunch?

(we were at the supermarket)

Personally, I would prefer a safe baby laweaselmys . So YANBU IMO. I don't mind a baby/child having freedom in that kind of situation, but when it's downright dangerous, that's another thing entirely.

I think there is a happy medium. If DD starts when we are eating and won't be amused with toys etc, one of us (usually me) takes her out until someone else has finished their lunch, then we swap over. I have got used to cold food. Not hugely sociable I grant you but I don't think its fair to let my DD spoil other people's lunches.

Probably not a popular opinion though.

Was she ignoring him or just letting him crawl around?

yabu
I am able to hold a conversation and keep a steely eye on my houdini of a son, while to the casual observer it would probably look like i was ignoring him. I'll bet anything you liek it wasn't her first- with the second you do grow more relaxed, even though my second is much more adventerous. Strapping down a wilful (and I do mean wilful in my sons case) toddler is much less pleasant all round, unless you'd liek to witness the tantrum of the year. In which case, you'd still no doubt be on here complaining. Take off the judgey pants, they don't suit you.

like law said, I think it's a balance thing. I am overprotective of my dd and very rarely let her do what you have described. My friend is like the mummy you described, but in a good way, she'd intervene if she thought her son was disturbing others or in danger.
TBH I wish I was more like her. I sometimes feel like I hold my dd back but like you I can't help thinking of all the germs and so on. So now, I make a conscious effort not to worry about such things, tis hard though.

I don't think letting a baby crawl around makes it particularly unsafe.

Generally I dont mind babies crawling around and a bit of benign neglect going on. I believe in a tolerant society.

The way you have described it sounds like the baby was being a bit of a nuicance, for want of a better word, if for no other reason because it was concerning others. BUT - the things you talk of were all potential and none of them actually happened, which makes me wonder if you just slightly more reactive than she, not that its a bad thing, but nor is it fair to place those standards on others if they are essentailly caring for their children with nothing bad happening.

Hygiene, for instance, is really not your concern.

I can't decide if YABU - bearing in mind your YABU was whether igorning babies in public was uncomfortable, and yet nothing happened, I think YAB a bit U

DD is afraid of dogs, so I wouldn't have let her down to crawl in that situation. If she wasn't I would have, she likes to explore and I'm happy to keep half an eye and just grab her if she goes too far/is annoying anyone/gets in the path of foot traffic. I'm not bothered about bugs. Can't be any worse than letting her crawl around at the park!

If the baby was annoying people then maybethe mum should have had a closer eye. But I was not there, and am not up for judging.

YABU

This is MN, where simple judgements that normal people make are considered nosey and unreasonable. You could practically post that the parents were jacking up and people would just tell you it was none of your business.

Lol @ Posie, but I've noticed the same thing at times....

of course ignoring a small baby crawling aorund on a dirty floor with dogs about is rather stupid.

YANBU. Of course it's fine for a baby to crawl around, but not just anywhere. The other day a mum was letting her toddler have free reign of a cafe I was in (at the dc's swimming place), the child was even exploring the bins . I was wondering if it was left to us (the other people there) to look after the child as the mother was busy chatting and wasn't so much as even looking her way.

i wonder who the mum would have though was to blame if the dog had bitten the baby?

I've got a toddler similar to other posters - if you insist that he sits in a chair/ buggy for an hour then you've got a screaming child who would definitely disturb others more than random crawling around.

It's up to the mother to judge how dirty the place is for her child, not you. Some people's 'filthy floors' are fine for others. I've let my child explore places that aren't spotless; some of my friends wouldn't have done the same with their kids, but everyone has different dirt tolerance levels.

I also agree with innocuousnamechange - chances are that the mother was actually far more aware than you thought, and just more laid back.

However - I don't let my DC 'meet' strange dogs without me being there with him - too easy for a dog to nip. And while general crawling/ wandering in a public place which is relatively quiet is fine by me, actively disturbing others isn't, so I'd have probably stepped in at that point. And I'd have kept an eye on waitresses carrying hot things, but it does depend on the activity levels in the cafe.

But, each to their own, hey?

YABU, up to a point!

You stopped being unreasonable when the baby started trying to pull itself up on YOUR buggy (if I'm reading the post right). There's being laid back and then there's allowing other people not related to you to be adversely affected (you bet it would have been your fault if the buggy toppled over lol).

OP - YADNBU.

I thank the lord that where I live people are more considerate then some of the posters on here. If your child/ toddler is bored - you leave the restaurant! Or one of you takes them out/ walks them around while the other eats. It is not acceptable behaviour to let a child crawl around unattended, nor is it acceptable to strap them into a buggy/ highchair so they scream the place down. What about the other people who are there trying to enjoy their meals?

I have two young DC's under 3 and for now accept that leisurely chats/ meals are a thing of the past. We are into a restaurant and out within 45 mins/ 1 hr max. Because that is the threshold of boredom for my 2.

Isn't it just amazing we have actually made it to adulthood given the number of deadly germs around, which I am sure our parents let us crawl in. For goodness sake, I remember eating mud as a child.

IME, it is really, really hard once your child starts crawling to contain them. They want to be everywhere and put fingers in everything. The only time I make him sit is when we are eating / it is a formal restaurant which we are inside. The rest of the time he can crawl / walk to his heart's content so long as there is space and it is easy to keep an eye on him.

As someone who has worked in restaurants it is dangerous for a toddler or small child to be running/crawling around.

You can't see them when carrying heavy plates or trays of food and drinks.

However closely a mother is watching they cannot react instantly to stop heavy plates or glasses smashing on their child when a waitress trips.

To echo the person who mentioned a dog biting, who would the parents blame if the child was injured?

YADNBU

It was the waitress tripping that crossed my mind. Thing is the hot stuff would probably go flying over the baby and land on some other person, maybe another child. So the mother wouldn't care about that probably. I have lost count of the number of times I have done without what I have ordered because dd wouldn't sit still.

As the owner of a rescue dog who is for whatever reason unknown very nervous around children (and therefore being a dog trainer many years I know could be dangerous around children) - then I am certainly uncomfortable about the dog scenario - toddlers are just the right eyeball to eyeball height for most dogs and in dog language thats a challenge. If the dog is not remotely aggressive or nervous then thats not a problem - but otherwise could be nasty. Our dog has never actually bitten but has been known to growl the odd time when feeling unsure of the situation or feels cornered especially by noisy children. This happens less and less now as he has become much less nervous in our care but we still muzzle him when our grandchildren are round and I always keep him under control when out. But the situation you describe would be very difficult trying to keep him away from a moving target i.e. a crawling toddler !!

I have my first restless child, all others have been persuaded to sit with toys and/or food whilst I chitter chatter...however DC4 has his own plans and so we avoid cafes and restaurants until he is containable.