Basically, I'm a twat.

[loopyloops]

After much to-ing and fro-ing, negotiating and the like, my brother, his wife, my sister and SIL all managed to go out for a drink today.
After a few (too many) drinks I felt I needed to make my brother understand how much it hurt me that he wasn't there for me when I really needed him. (One twin daughter was stillborn, other premature. He lives nearby but we had recently had an argument so he didn't visit or come to the funeral.)

He (also a bit drunk) wasn't seeing my point, so I, very emotionally, tried to explain to him how much it hurt me, but only ended by making everyone else think that I don't care about them at all.
I was trying to explain how much my children mean to me, but said (not sure) something along the lines of "none of you mean anything compared to my daughters." Now I am crying in my room and they are all downstairs thinking I'm a twat.
All I want out of life is to be a nice person, but I do want others around me to be nice to me too. Am I being unreasonable for this?

I'm so sorry to have offended my sister and sisters in law, but I just wanted it to hit home to my brother how much this whole thing has affected me. The last thing I wanted was to hurt anyone, but I'm in a bad place and need support.
Incidentally, his response was something along the lines of "well, I get how it hurt you, but for me it's still not as bad as XYZ". Hmmph.

Thanks BT. She's not a concern now as she's just over a year old, and perfectly healthy (apart from the £1 coin she swallowed on Friday...) but yes, for quite a while we were very worried, and yes, he is a twat. I just needed some reassurance last night from the others that they accepted my reasons for saying what I did. I just wanted him to understand, and instead I just offended everyone. For that, I am a twat, but still not as much of a twat as him.

I am glad your DD is okay

Realising it is a year on, I think that does make your brother even more of a twat if he still stewing over it.

I do hope you can both put it behind you, if only for the sake of any future nieces/nephews. Perhaps that is what you both need to do is forget the rows and try to start afresh? I do hope you sort it out as because you are nice person it is clearly causing you some stress and unhappiness.

LL, hope you are OK today. All very awful for you. Maybe your brother is not the person you need to lean on? Stick to MN

Cliche I know, but it really is a lifeline for me.

BTW, you are not a twat at all. I had a similar experience lately with my sister. She is manic depressive and I tried to empathise with her. Seriously, it nearly drove me over the edge.

I tried the clean slate thing, but I need him to acknowledge what happened first, I just can forgive and forget until that happens. Basically, I don't like him very much at all.

sorry, can't not can

Aw loopyloops, I want to give you a great big hug. No one should have to go through what you went through, and your brother is so insensitive it's unbelievable. I'm surprised you haven't lamped him one by now. Maybe he's just really uncomfortable with emotional things and doesn't know how to handle being around you. That's not an excuse, but perhaps a reason?

He absolutely needs to say sorry and ideally, the two of you need to have a real conversation where you can clear the air, I can't see things getting better between you until that happens. Perhaps tell your brother you want to talk and then leave the ball in his court. If it makes it easier for you, you could write to him, but it depends how you feel about confronting him.

If all else fails and you end up not being able to have a close relationship with him, remember that it's not your fault. And as SingItBack said, there are plenty of MN friends who will be there for you .

Good luck and MASSIVE HUG!!!!

Thank you

my god do adults really act like this - drinking games? vomiting on people's carpets? It's so teenage!

I am sorry for what you've gone through loopy but I think personally that it is simply wrong to feel aggrieved at someone for 'not being there' for you. People are NOT there 'for us' they are there for them....it's very lovely when family members are strong and loving and supportive but to my mind this is nothing anyone can ever expect and certainly not something to feel angry or aggreived over. All we can do is simply take graciously what people offer; imo.

And I think there needs to be a more adult way of dealing with each other that doesn't involve drink, fwiw. You might think your brother is talking to you drunk - but he's not, not really - it's a kind of skewed version of him; alcohol doesn't simply 'free up' people to say what they think imo. It removes parts of our personality and gives a skewed picture.

oh

Do you have any suggestions, Sleeping?

Well I think my suggestions would be taking your support and love where it's freely given and just taking the pressure off family relationships by not harbouring resentment re how your brother was or was not in relation to you at that horrible time. Because if you don't, you get into situations like you have described here basically!
And I personally would keep trying to keep contact with my brother if this was me but on a reasonable and sober basis; clearly, drunk there is no benefit to contact that I can see? Better limited contact on a sober sensible basis I would say.
Otherwise what do you both actually really get out of it?

Of course you are not a twat, dear heart! You've been through something terrible. My brother and I also have a difficult relationship (and parts of our childhood were v difficult too, though not like yours seems to have been, poor girl)and it puts a strain on both of us. My beloved grandfather died four years ago and we couldn't find my brother to tell him about the funeral. (It turned out that he was living on a ranch out West, being a cowboy of all things ) I cannot tell you how much I ached to have him there with me that day, and how a small part of me still feels let down that he wasn't.

Just get some rest, don't be so hard on yourself, and try to clear the air while sober. If he won't/can't do that, just accept what he can give you and put him on the back burner. Your daughter is your priority, and there's nothing wrong with that.

Hugs from across the pond!

Yes, no alcohol would be good, because I really get nothing positive out of it as it is.
I don't know how to stop harbouring resentment towards him, I really don't.

oh and I did mean to say, you are clearly not a twat and also it seems obvious that your brother's hurtful remark about your need to love your dd etc was as a result of ignorance and I guess from his own defences given your backgrounds - he's simply not qualified to say what is a healthy way for you to love your dd I would say - so why give his remark so much power? Just write it off as showing his own ignorance and his own problematic up-bringing. He's not going to be able to understand how it hurts you - he simply isn't, in my view.

You sound like you are bending over backwards to keep it going with him but it shouldn't be draining for you; it should be rewarding.

I agree with what you said up-thread - you need to prioritise your own little family now.

in my view resentment comes about as a result of expectation.

Perhaps you could look at your expectations of him and whether they are reasonable?

Given his up-bringing, his child-free state at present; was it reasonable to expect emotional support and understanding of your traumatic situation from him?

(I mean it would have been nice yes of course! But I still don't think we can expect it specially not given your bro's particular history and circumstances)

Cut your losses and don't bother with him anymore, he doesn't seem that interested. You can't make him be interested/the person you want.

you are NOT being unreasonable at all!!!

i just wanted to send you love and hugs,probably not particualy usefull i know...

you sound lovely...your brother sounds like someone i know who it is better not to expect anything from...although this is far harder said than done,i know.
perhaps better for you to concentrate on your own little family,and let the extended get on with themselves?

you have been through something utterly heartbreaking,
dont make yourself suffer anymore.

Thank you, I'm feeling much better now.

I think I'll just not contact him for the time being. There are no more family weddings or visits planned, so I should be able to get away with that (although I am quite inclined to bill him for my carpet cleaning, that would just antagonise). If he tries to contact me, or his wife does, I'm not sure what to do... any ideas? But yes, my daughter and husband (and sister) are my priorities now and I'm going to try to focus on them.

Thanks for being kind to me, it really helps.

I would make your excuses if he invites you out drinking again. You can't avoid him completely though, next time you see him just talk about the weather and beat a hasty retreat if he goes off on one again. I would say keep him at arms length until he grows up a bit. Don't seek his approval, you don't need it. You are an excellent mummy with a daughter who loves you, that's all the approval you need.

To say that having a "pathological need to care" for your child is a bad thing is just strange, and I think shows how selfish he is. Every mum has that need! And it's normal to be very protective of a child who has been poorly in the past. My DS nearly passed away at 3 weeks old and was in hospital for quite a while, that experience had a big impact on how I felt about him as a baby. I was very protective and had this sense of dread that he would somehow be taken from me. I was frightened I guess and a bit depressed. I've since found out that those feelings are normal and most people go through a low period after an experience like that, as I can imagine you definitely would as part of your grief for the daughter you lost. Just keep talking to supportive people, your brother isn't one of them for now I'm afraid. I think you are doing really well considering everything you have been through.

Apologies for the essay

You know what Loopy, blood is thicker than water, but bullshits thicker than both. You really don't need the fuckmuppet of a brother in your life - he's bringing you down when you're already not far off the bottom. What could possibly have been more important in his life that he couldn't go to his own neice's funeral?

I am so sorry that you lost one of your girls, loosing a twin is especially hard, i lost my firstborn twin son, and i can understand most of the emotions you must be feeling.

But sweets, you won't find an answer to your grief in the bottom of a bottle - i know because i've looked, and there was nothing there.

Thinking of you x

Just popping back to say that you're more then welcome to come and say hi over here if you like - sadly there are lots of women who have been where you are, and will gladly lend a friendly ear.

Thanks Deemented for your kind words. I don't think I can go on the other thread. Really sorry, but I can't handle it just yet.

Thats ok my love, take your time