To wonder if people actually mean it when they say they love jesus more than anyone/anything else??

[phoenixflower]

I am in no way insulting religion or saying anyone's beliefs are wrong, but was just curious. Have been going to an elim church for a while now, introduced by a friend.

On a number of occasions, I have heard people say that they love jesus more than anything,he is their "number 1", they always "put him first" before their children/husband/wife etc.

One sermon was about how our children are not actually ours, they are God's that he has given us to bring up to be like jesus and that when he sees fit to take them ( to heaven) he will.

It un-nerved me a bit and made me feel uncomfortable and am now wondering whether or not to go back.

Surely people don't love Jesus more than their own children do they? For me, it's my DC I love ( and always will) more than anything! Do they mean it when they say they love jesus more than anything?!

Don't want to cause any upset here, just wondered really. If those are your beliefs then that is totally fine, I am just struggling to get my head around it a bit

As always it is the athiests' that are the most judgemental and everyone else just wants to live in peace without being ridiculed!

Oh and I didn't say I was a Christian dumb ass!

There are extremists in all walks of life. However the majority of people practising a religion are just getting on with it and not behaving like fanatics. It really annoys me when people produce an aunt or a colleague or a neighbour who goes too far and then uses them to denounce all religions.

a girl i used to work with believed that she loved god more than anything. i asked her about her children, and she said that yes, she loved them but god was more important. the conversation went on and i asked her, after talking about the god/isaac thing if god asked her to harm her children, then would she. she said that yes, she feels that if god wanted her to harm her children, then it would be for a reason and that she would do it.

we're not friends anymore...i just don't get religion to that degree.

but then again, i am another "non believer"

If anybody else said that they'd be accused of forming part of a cult..

I suspect the last 2000 years of indoctrination isn't going to be done away with too easily just yet..

I realise this adds nothing to the debate but the thread reminded me of this Jesus Is My Friend and I couldn't resist linking to it.

Bloody hell, that makes you think chim. To take it so literally that she's actually said she'd harm her children if God told her to

You've got to ask the question of how would she know for sure it was God saying it??

Also unrelated to the thread, but that reminded me of a prog I watched about memories of WWI.

When she was 10, this woman asked her mum what she'd do if the Germans invaded England, to which her mum said 'I'd get a pillow and smother you in your sleep, then do the same to myself'.

You're left with the nightmare image of the poor girl cowering in her bed at night wondering if this was the night her mum was coming for her.

I hope your ex-friends children never find out she feels like this.

i know agent. its unbelievable to me...shes a lovely girl, really generous of spirit and kind etc her and her husband are just completely involved only in their church, and everything they do in and with their life just revolves around it.

fucked right up if you ask me....i realise noone is asking me though so i'll just shut up!

YetAnother - precisely TWO people have identified as an atheiests. Neither they or anyone else has expressed an opinion that might not be held by a person of faith. I think this problem with atheists might be your problem rather than theirs.

That's insane Chimchar. Incredibly disturbing.

It's certainly not normal.

I don't think this is a generic Christian / non Christian discussion and shouldn't be. The Elim churches are the fanatical, crazy, extreme churches of Christianity and in no way represent the beliefs of most of you arguing in their defence on here.

As a young impressionable teenager, my DH was involved with them and they were strong on the "god comes first," thing. As his family weren't religious (although through apathy more than lack of belief) he was repeatedly encouraged to cut them out - he was even told not to interact with his 7yr old sister unless she converted. He still lived at home, it was ridiculous. It also caused all kinds of problems in his first year of university (before he gave it up, it didn't get better) as they actively encouraged him to ignore classmates and flatmates.

Elim is a church that appeals to people who like to feel morally superior, who are obsessed with converting others and have no shame on asking people about their sex lives and passing judgement. They are nearer a cult than they are CofE, is there not a nicer church you could go to?

I don't even know her, but I could be of the opinion that it's a fucked up thing to say.

You spend a large percentage of your time as a parent trying to protect your children from being physically and emotionally hurt, so it's quite disturbing hear a mum to say they'd do it themselves if God told them to. Baffling.

i know....it really upset me actually. we had quite strong words about it when i challenged her with my thoughts on it. it was at a work do. didn't make for the most lighthearted of night endings!!!

luckily jesus is unable to send instructions.

How about looking at what Jesus himself had to say about whether you should put God first.

Mark 12:30
?Love the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul and with all your mind and with all your strength.?

Luke 14:26
"If anyone comes to me and does not hate his father and mother, his wife and children, his brothers and sisters?yes, even his own life?he cannot be my disciple.?

When we love God with everything we have, he gives us the ability - the spiritual power -to love ourselves and to love others ? the love multiplies!!

Afterall, 1 John 4:16 says, ?God is love.? God never hurts anyone. Everything about him is loving.

He asks us to put him first a) Because he is God, and b) because it?s in our own interests.

Christians who put God first just obeying God.

Jesus was pretty emo, wasn't he?

in the old testament god did quite a lot of smiting and so on.

I'd agree with Justa. And, without wanting to Bible-bash, this quote pretty much sums up how I see loving my family and God as a holistic whole rather than either/or situation :

"No one has ever seen God; if we love one another, God lives in us, and his love is perfected in us." (1 John 4:12).

I'd say MannyW was about right. It isn't an either/or thing. But loving God first is No.1 commandment and helps put our priorities in order. Kids are not personal possessions and we don't create them in any meaningful way. But we have the responsibility to love/care and do all we can. The Abraham/Isaac thing is difficult but nowhere in the Bible is that a blue-print for parenting.
What is point of going to church or having a faith if God is your second-best friend (after all the other people)?

Thank you for all your opinions and views, has helped me to think about things differently and from other perspectives.

Hello. Just returning to this thread to pick up on the point about Isaac - I've started a new thread if you want to chew the fat!