to not want to be forced to endure 'family time' with spiteful SIL?

[giantpurplepeopleeater]

Right, ok, this is a long one so I apologies in advance.

So that I am not accused of BU by stealth, here is some background -

1. Got together with partner 5 years ago - first met 'SIL' (were not actually married, but having a child, so it's easier to call her SIL) a couple of months later. She was 17 at the time.

1. When I met her there was lots of history and problems. DP had very little to do with her, and becuase of her actions with so-called mates the family was being terrorised by other yobs in the area

1. She was a very surly teeneager and could never bring herslef to say one word to me. DP was living at home at the time. If I went round she would ignore me, walk out of the room, or start an argument with her mother.

1. Within a couple of months SIL was pregnant by bloke who was a passing fling. She decided to keep the baby but the moment it was born wanted nothing to do with her. She never fed or changed a nappy - MIL did it all. SIL then started partying, never came home, got arrested for drug use - all the while PIL are trying to encourage her to have a relationship with baby, but these attempts just made her angry and fly off the handle. PIL tried to get her councelling/ doctor but she wouldn't have it. Eventually had to call the police on her as she turned up at the house off her face on drugs, demanded that the baby be handed over so she could take her out and when PIL refused and pointed out her innebrated state she pulled a knife on them and threatened to stab them. She left and went to live with friends - leaving baby.

1. PIL then spent next 2 years being dragged through court for custody of the child. As soon as SIL's benefit money got stopped (PIL had to apply for residency as she literally left them to it and MIL is disabled so they don't have much money) she demanded child. Residency had already been granted and concerns raised about her ability to look after child, but she got legal aid and took them to court. This was despite PIL saying they would have her back home with them and she could have custody if she could prove she could manage.

1. All the time this was going on, if she saw me or DP she would blank us, walk the other way, or on most occasions hurl abuse/ spit at us. Other than that we had very little contact.

Fast forward to now - baby is now 3.5. DP and I are living together quite far away from PIL who have made great effort to have better relationship with SIL and have gradually been encouraging more and more contact with baby to the point that SIL now has her about 4 days a week (residency still with PIL though but they have been discussing getting this changed). SIL now also has another little one - born in Feb.

There are still issues though - SIL can still be very surly to PIL and argues constantly with them, expecting them to look after her and pander to her all the time.

Not long before Christmas, PIL expressed the fact that they wanted to be a 'proper' family again and have everyone get a long. We thought we would give this a try so agreed to go round to PIL's when SIL would be there for a couple of family 'events' (meals really). Problem is, when we went round the hostility towards us continued. I in particular was made to feel very uncomfortable as was ignored completely, talked over, and (I believe) bitched about by SIL to her new partner. SIL also was very argumentative and nasty to her PIL. DP also felt SIL behaviour was awful and was very unhappy with her.

Christmas - was all arranged that we would spend time round PIL and stay on christams eve - going over to my parents at lunch time christmas day. So we turn up on Christmas eve to find that PIL had arranged for SIL and partner to stay also (not sure where though, as they didn't really have the room!). DP said to his parents that he wasn't prepared to put up with SIL behavioiur again and that they know this (he had talked to them before about it) and they should have told him. So we didn't stay the night - we went to my parents. We did go to PILs house on the day, but only ended up staying an hour as SILs behavoiur was so vile. Again, we were ignored, talked over and she tried to start a fight with FIL.

So we haven't seen her since. We see PIL regularly. THis week they brought up the idea that they would like to do a family thing in August - weekend away. DP asked if SIL would be there, PIL said yes. DP said no then - we have tried with her and her behaviour is awful. We do not want to be around that (when I asked him later it turns out he feels she should apologise for all the stuff she put the family though and the way she has behaved, but also that he doesn't like the way she treats me). PIL then went on to have 3 hour 'discussion' telling us how we should put it all behind us, accept her, that she has changed, that we are selfish and ruining things for them, and that we are the ones who should be better behaved. DP made the point that if SIL called him to discuss civilly he might consider it.

So are AIBU (or are we BU) for not wanting to spend a weekend, or any time really, with SIL??

A whole weekend is tough, even with people you get along with. I'd suggest you start small with a Sunday lunch or similar. Everyone be civil and make an effort for a few hours. If it falls flat on its face then you can't be accused of not trying. Who knows, maybe she's calmed down since Christmas?

She sounds like a nightmare, a blimmin selfish one at that.

God your PIL is a very forgiving person.

Sorry not much else to add.

I wouldn't want to spend time around her YANBU

How sad and awful for your poor PIL.

They sound like wonderful people.

I would go, and just ignore all the drama, I would do this because I would want to support PIL to the best of my ability. I completely understand why you and your DP don't want to though.

yanbu

the last time you saw her 7 months ago you left after an hour as her behaviour was so vile

why would she have changed in the last 7 months rather than in the previous five years?

I do feel terribly sorry for your PIL's though

OMG!!! Not a situation i would like my DC's exposed to, sounds like a weekend from hell, i wouldn't stop seeing in laws though they sound lovely, but SIL sounds like VICKY POLLARD with a child of her own, maybe try meeting her first without the children, if she can behave like an adult then maybe concider the weekend away, i would warn all concerned that if she repeats her past behavior you and DC will be leaving

God no. You are most definitely NBU.

I have a sister I refuse to spend time with. She's not as bad as your SIL, but she sucks all the oxygen out of the room when she enters. It was the best decision I ever made. Gradually all my siblings are coming to the same conclusion and we let her have her tantrums and perform to an empty room. When, and if, your SIL ever decides to grow up and start acting like an adult you can consider resuming contact with her. But until then, why bother making the effort when she clearly doesn't want to?

I think YANBU. SIL has proved over and over again that she is incapable of being polite to you or your DP. PIL need to understand that it is not fair to expect you to put up with that behaviour.

maybe give her just one more chance, let your PIL know that she is on her final warning and you expect an appoligy for all the crap she put you both through, only then can you put history in the past, and start a fresh.

Slug - I really do feel like this - when and if she can act like an adult we will happily see her. PILs point is that how do we know if we don't see her? DP says she would have to approach us. So were in a bit of a stale mate!

Char3mum - I think this is a really sensible approach. However I don't think SIL is bothered about seeing us or not. She really doesn't care. She would never ring DP and if we wanted to meet up with her we would have to do all the arranging and fit in with her.

ShirleyKnot - I would like to support PIL, and we do our best. But honestly I am amde to feel so uncomfortable I get quite upset about it.

On the upside, good on your DP for sticking up for you though! That's really special given some of the threads we see here

I understand that GPPE, and was in no way judging you. I just feel so sad for your PIL. It must be heartbreaking to have a child and for it all to go so horribly wrong.

That being said, you must do the best for you and yours; and if you really can't cope with her, then that is your choice.

Do you or your DP ever pull her up on her behaviour there and then? You know like saying "Don't you dare speak to me that way, it is rude and I am not going to put up with it?" or is everyone tip-toeing around her?

Sorry Shirley - I didn't think you were judging, just felt need to explain as I do feel very bad about it.

To be honest, we only ever see SIL when at the PILs, so tend to take our lead from them (I would feel very bad if, as is most likely, my saying something caused a big argument when we are the guests).

PIL tend to take a quite meek approach. MIL will tell her to 'say hello', 'stop shouting', 'no need to speak like that' but only in a very gentle way, which SIL often ignores. PIL on the other hand tends to ignore her when she tries to fight with him - this seems to be a particular past time of hers.

DP had a poor relationship with her before I came along, so tends to block it all out - years of practice! He does nptice that I go quite and often suggests getting out of there!!

What a bloody mess.

I'm quite a meek person nah, I'm not really, but I do try to avoid confrontation; however, if someone is being repeatedly rude to me, and upsetting my family, I do tend to think "ah, screw it" and I say something.

You can be assertive without causing an argument (although it sounds like she is going to kick off at anything, she sounds very spoiled)

I think your DP is quite right to say that he is not prepared to keep on putting up with her shit. A weekend is a bit much, and agree with the poster who suggested maybe just a meal, see how things pan out, and then make your decision.

I would not do a whole weekend with someone like your sil! I have issues with my own mum and we didn't speak for 8 months, she then invited me to spend a weekend with her and didn't get why I said no way! I don't see how you can go from not getting along with someone to wanting to spend a whole weekend with them!

I would apologise to PIL but decline the offer. your SIL sound like a nightmare!

I'm with your DP on this one. She obviously does not want a relationship with you or your DP, so why bother?

My sister is not quite as dramatic as your SIL. I do have to encounter her at family occasions. What I do, whenever she starts to perform is quietly, and unostentatiously, leave the room or remove myself from her vicinity. I generally find that 10 minutes later the vast majority of my family have done the exact same thing and drifted off as well and are happily chatting with me in wherever it is I've removed myself to. We figure that one day she might take the hint.

I think your very charitable PILs are allowing hope to reign over experience aren't they. And don't want cold water being poured on their hopes that all will magically resolve with a lovely family weekend.
Obviously it won't and can't.
A weekend is far too long. A lunch at the most I'd say.

Although it's a shame for your PIL, YANBU in not wanting to spend time around this vile woman. She is unlikely to be much different - it sounds as though her behaviour has always been the same - why should it change now?
Be gentle on your PIL, but stand firm against being forced to spend time with SIL. Keep it to an engagement, preferably on neutral territory.

I'm afraid your SIL sounds like a right little madam, trying to control the family and have you all as her slaves. Very unpleasant and normally a character trait that gets worse, not better, through the years.

IT sounds like you PIL take a "anything for a quiet life" sort of attitude (unless the baby's safety is at stake) and really want a happy family. HOwever, you and your DP should not be the ones making all the concessions. Why should you be trying to forgive her? She clearly isn't a bit sorry and just wants you and your DP to act like the PIL and constantly forgive and pander to her in order for her to assert her power over you all.

Don't give in and don't spend a weekend with her! Well, not unless you want a massive row.

I would just say to PIL that you are not pandering to SIL and you understand they want the best for their daughter but her attitude is so rude it is not possible for you to spend extended periods in her company.

Great that your DP is backing you up, he must have had a miserable upbringing constantly being told to be nice to his dreadful sister and seeing his parents treated like shit, no wonder he doesn't want to go back to that.

I don't think households/families should revolve around letting a vile person remain vile while everyone else is treated like shit and their feelings mean nothing.

Similar situation with my own SIL you see...we have to make HER happy, while frankly, we could starve in a ditch and she wouldn't care.

YANBU.

yanbu - I would have nothing to do with her.

However. Her daughter will need support to cope with having sil as her mother. Is sil baby being looked after well? Also pil will need your help to deal with everything.

Thanks to all. I was feeling incredibly guilty about letting down the lovely PILs but I really don't want to have to accept this behaviour from her.

We have said no to the weekend, but were discussing whether we should change our minds due to their reaction. Will have to talk to DP but think the answer to that will be no!

Very ealry to think about it, but I do think the next time this will come up will be Christmas - so am not looking forward to that discussion. I realise that PILs will want to see all their grandchildren on the day but really don't fancy having to sit down to dinner with her . Guess we'll have to cross that bridge when we come to it!