to refuse to let the agents in to show new tenants round?

[EricNorthmansmistress]

So, my letting agents are cunts. Long story of shitness, starting with a report saying we were not keeping the flat clean enough. When pushed they could not give any concrete examples. More recently they mentioned the mould in the bathroom over winter (too cold to leave bathroom window open) and candle wax on the tile mantelpiece, and the grubby carpet (toddler) all of which are completely fixable.

So they served notice to sell the flat, LL changed her mind but decided they wanted us out anyway due to the report. One year after we moved in and paid £480 in fees.

Fine. We want to move anyway, need a garden. Yesterday agent left me a voicemail asking if they could bring tenants to look this afternoon. I only picked it up this morning. I called them and explained that DH's stock was in the flat, and that we had gone out without knowing they were coming, so hadn't tidied.

I just received another voicemail at 6pm, saying they will be bringing people over tomorrow at 5pm, and to please tidy up because it was very messy.

1- the tenancy agreement says no less than 24 hours

2- the tenancy agreement only specifies access, does not specify tidying up

3- she was a bitch

I have left a voicemail saying no, they can't bring someone at 5, as that is less than 24 hours notice. I have suggested they do not leave voicemails in future and call me tomorrow to rearrange.

They write in their letter that it is better if we tidy up so as to minimise disruption to us as they can let it quicker. Frankly, I don't care. I have seen the house and it's ok, it's messy because DH has a lot of stock in the flat and DS has toys. Frankly it's fine, according to my standards. AIBU to not want to spring clean a flat I'm moving out of in a month, in order to do a favour to a letting agent who I hate, when I'm not legally obliged to do so? I just feel like asking her who the fuck she thinks she is to be honest. That's the problem with this agency - their report referenced how messy the flat was (they hadn't given proper notice and we didn't know they were coming) but the mess was ours, nothing to do with the actual flat. They don't seem to understand that they cannot dictate how people live inside their flats as long as it doesn't cause any damage or nuisance to the LL's property.

So, AIBU to say they can't come tomorrow at 5?

Oh I feel your pain - the letting agent for our old flat arranged loads of viewings for our move-out day without telling us. SO there's us with boxes, bags, random crap all over the place trying to move. And there's new tenants plus arsey agent walking round the flat complaining about the mess.

in the end I snapped (was also 6months pregnant at the time)

We cornered some of the prospective tenants and warned them about the trailing wires, the fact the management agency never did any maintenance or repairs, the fact they would let themselves into the flat while they thought no one was there, the fact they tried to force entry into the flat then tried to get dp arrested for assault when he refused entry. the list goes on and I heard the agent lying about how the whole flat was going to be gutted and redone (yeah right, they'd never so much as fixed a broken cupboard door in that place)

oh dear, who knew I was still so bitter [cofused]

They will do you no favours - dont do them any.

Keep the flat to a reasonable standard but nothing out of the ordinary and dont let them in unless they have given you the required notice.

Sorry, as someone who is currently desperately trying to get my deposit back for a house I had professionally cleaned including the carpets, had repainted, replaced flooring and curtains, I am probably biased.

They do have the right to have access for viewings, yes. But the tenancy agreement says 24 hours written notice and does not mention tidying. I will be very magnanimous and allow 24 hours verbal notice. But that will have to be an actual phone conversation, not a voicemail, and I will make it clear that they take it as they find it and do not mention the tidiness or otherwise of my home to me ever again.

They're not going to give you a good reference, anyhow.

So I wouldn't be bothered.

You tell them where to get off with their arsey demands, by asking them to take into account that you are both working, and that (a) you are paying for it until the last day and (b) they are paid to market it, not you. Perhaps they'd like to pay for you to go part time so you can keep it tidy to them? Of course not! It's not your job to do that for them, whereas it's their job to sell it, and they are pretty lousy at their job if they can't persuade you.

Really sorry you are going through this, by the way. You're welcome to CAT me for a good moan, if you like, and I promise I will let you, as it sounds as though your situation is worse than ours.

They may just ignore you what ever you say.

I've had this - there was no dispute I was moving to another city.

They were letting people in while I was at work without my knowledge - something went missing and neighbours told me.

I was reasonable requested 24 hours notice as per contract. Contract said written notice I said phone call or voice mail would be fine.

Then I had some time of work - and found they were still trying to let people into flat without telling me.

Let one woman with agent look round got told off for place being untidy - I was packing.

Said that would be last time and needed to know when people were being let in as the contract said 24 hours notice.

Then letting agent tried to let someone in when I was still, in bed kept trying to push past the chain. Had to get dressed and have words.

Dispite having a clean bill of health from checking out agent they charged me a hugh amount of the deposit because the carpets hadn't been professionally cleaned . This was before deposit protection scheme was in place but still - may have been lucky I didn't need a reference as was moving in with fiance just before marriage.

Thanks Plu - don't know how to use CAT though!

I'm very cross but just looking forward to being out of this craphole and into a lovely new place with a garden DH has managed to persuade me to look slightly out of town, I can't really argue with 3 bed house with garden for less than we pay now, only 6 miles away from where we are currently. All will be ok...yes it will!

I'm borrowing a proper carpet cleaner thingy. Are they any good? Will need to pretend it was a professional carpet cleaner

FIL told me afterwards you could hire the professional equipment they used to pay to get theirs done every few years. He thinks it would have been a dam site cheaper than the £450 I got charged but I had rented before and carpet cleaning by professionals had never been an issue before that.

We've had a Vax carpet cleaner - O.K. but professional ones better.

If you have a chain use it - (and put on pjs even if weather is hot - I was so thankful for that chain ).

YANBU. We are leaving our current rented place at the start of September and our LL are being ridiculous. The agents are lovely but we had a request passed on by them saying we needed to move all our furniture out and put theirs back in now. Ffs, where do they expect the dcs to sleep/us to put our furniture for a month?

I asked our agent about this and tidying for viewings, they said just to live as we normally do, its what we pay exorbitant rent for.

I've used a rug doctor and our carpets came up brilliantly. There was one mark on the carpet in the smallest bedroom (6ft x 6ft) and they wanted to charge full replacement cost for a carpet that was 8 years old and they reckoned was around 200 quid.

So glad of the new tenant deposit scheme, originally they tried to charge over 80% of our deposit, i think in the end I got the deduction down to 30 quid for the mark to the carpet. I'd taken photos of absolutely everything and I knew that if it had gone to arbitration anything showing on those photos would have been attributed to fair wear and tear (we'd been there 2 years). They tried to claim for paint marks where we'd covered over stuff, but in fact they were paint marks they'd made before letting the place!

Hire a Rug Doctor from Homebase - they are fab!!

But beware your agent might ask for receipts from professional cleaners - mine did.

Jesus, I am so at this. I am a landlord and would never expect my agents to be so unreasonable. (Actually, I think we go too much the other way, our rent hasn't been on time since November!)

When I was a tenant, I remember being shown around a flat that was a bombsite untidy - it had a single guy living there apparently and it had stuff everywhere - down to used condoms intimate items on the bedroom floor.

Yum.

BTW, you are not being unreasonable Eric, it should be a relationship based on respect both ways, and clearly they are not treating you respectfully.

I've spoken to Shelter when I was told my landlord was selling up.

Your right to quiet enjoyment overrides the part in the tenancy allowing access for visits.

The man from Shelter told me that I didn't have to let them in at all.

I'm not suggesting this as you don't want to make things even more difficult- but you could always threaten them if they get worse.

I don't think you have to let them in for viewings at all - whatever it says in the contract. Because in law you as the tenant have a statutory right to 'quiet enjoyment' of the property' - that means you don't have to allow access if you don't want to and this right overrides anything in a contract. AFter all you are paying a lot of money to use the place as your home. As long as you hand it back in the same state you got it (less 'fair wear and tear') at the end of the tenancy, that't all you're required to do. Why should you break your neck dashing around tidying up when its of no benefit to you at all?

Of course if you need a reference from them or something, you may want to be a bit more accommodating, but you would certainly be in your rights to say, for instance, 'all viewings on Saturday afternoons only'. Amd the cheeky whatsits have NO right to TELL you to tidy up - its the landlord's property but your HOME while you live there.

I have read about this many times on lots of forums so I'm pretty sure it's right but you could ring SHELTER and doublecheck - they're very good for advice.

I am using the tenants deposit scheme to try and get my deposit back. Despite the fact the house was left in far better condition than when we found it (even though it was still a hovel), my previous LL is trying to keep £1000 of my deposit.

Thanks folks. Have decided all viewings must be made by phone in a conversation, not by voicemail, and can only be when either of us will be home. That gives them 9-12 3 days a week and after 5.30 any day. Pretty fair I think.

sb9999 same here, we are currently in arbitration with the Deposit Protection people... fingers crossed!

You do not have to let anyone in - unless in the event of an emergency repair etc. You do not have to agree to viewings even if it says so in your contract for the final month. It's bad form, but there is nothing anyone can do. I refused all access to my LL from hell, due to her screaming and shouting at me , sending rude and belligerent texts and trying to force me to pay for a service charge in her name, and that was never discussed with me.

If a LL/Agent says they will use their own key and you are unhappy with this, say so! They are only allowed to enter with your express permission.

If you tell them they can't use their key, and they do so anyway, then they are trespassing and you are within your rights to change the locks. Either handing over all sets of new keys to the LL/LA when you leave or reinstate the locks.

If they continue to hassle you regarding this, then you can do them for harassment.

You can stipulate days and times for viewings, with 24 hour notice.

LMHF - could you post an update on the outcome, I would be really interested to hear how you get on.

Have just posted my forms off today.

Sorry for the hijack ENM!

God, God, God, it's all so depressing what shits people can be! I am very depressed hearing these stories. Imagine doing this sort of thing for a living. How could you start doing it, I mean (once you get started no doubt you have to keep going so as not to admit you have been wrong for a long time)?

EricNorthmansmistress, you CAT by going to www.mumsnet.com/InTouch. I have set up CAT on my account (it is £5 for the year), and have tried to send you a message, but you have chosen not to receive messages from other MNers. You can change this in your profile, or just flip me the bird! No hard feelings; you may not want to be harassed by every random MNer!

Oh no it's not on purpose! I'll try to fix it.

These sort of landlords and agents are scum. They'll keep your money whether you clean the carpets / tidy up etc or not. So annoying.
Good luck!

I once lost some of a deposit- the washing machine broke while we were in the house, previously the LL had paid for it to be mended but when the washing machine man said it was broken (it was older than me, fgs) the LL said it was not part of the fixtures of the house and nothing to do with him. So we bought our own, which of course we took with us when we moved out. Then the LL removed the cost of a new washing machine from our deposit.

He also arranged for the new tenants to move in on our moving out day. They locked thier dog in the bathroom on that day and so it damaged the floor, and the LL tried to take that off OUR deposit.

He also refused to repair a leak that meant it rained on our baby's cot. He suggested we put towels down. Same with the leaky shower.

The next tenants had him reported and fined by the local council

We once rented a house (when students, long time ago now!) where the landlord sold the house but didn't bother to tell us, just kept collecting the rent

Several months down the line we had visit from burly bloke wanting to know where his rent was for the last few months and wanting it paying within the next few days. Eventually got them to accept that we were only going to pay rent to them from the time that we knew officially that they were our new landlords and had it confirmed by solicitors. Apparently original owner had told them that he would tell us that he'd sold and didn't. He kept using the address though and loads of unpaid bills and demands kept coming. Had to turn the baliffs away on several occasions, used to just send post back as 'No longer at this address', but for some reason we opened one letter and discovered our water was about to be cut off as he hadn't paid water rates as he was supposed to.

We always suspected he lost the house in a card game , the new landlord was an old lady but with a couple of very burly sons who we were told we had to be nice to because they had previous form for GBH and would often be uncontactably 'out of the country' but return looking more like they had spent some time at her majesty's pleasure than on a pleasure beach somewhere.

Bizarrely, particularly given that the old landlord hadn't handed over our deposit, the solicitor took pity on us and let us pay our last month's rent to her and then have that back as deposit (long before any deposit scheme). She hadn't heard from the ll for ages so eventually sent them a 'I assume that everything is OK unless I hear from you in the next month' letter and she didn't so gave us our money back [falls over backwards in shock smiley]

sb9999 - i sent off my statutory declaration, they then sent me the cock and bull letter the ll had sent me, which i'd already sent a response to the dps, showing how all of her 'claims' were either fabricated or not applicable, they asked for a copy of my tenancy agreement, and that was that.

I'm waiting to hear from the adjudicator with the final response.

Oh, you do know you can ask for the non-disputed amount back? If you've not done that, email them asap and they'll have it transferred back into your account in no time.

As you were op, good move on the viewing slots!