to think this nursery shoud sort out alternative transport?

[dilemma456]

Message withdrawn

Message withdrawn

TBH the ratios sound all wrong, never mind anything else

I think it's wrong that the children are standing up, presumably in the aisles. How far does the bus go? Is it feasible for the children to walk to the park?

They'd need more than 3-4 adults with 20-30 children.

Why do they need to go to the park everyday?
Don't they have a nursery garden?
My dd has only been taken to the park once in three years, it's too complicated with pushchairs and staff ratios etc

Message withdrawn

If they have that few staff with the children, walking might be just as risky (though they wouldn't be clogging the bus up, which is risky in itself for the children and other passengers).

Are you sure it is a nursery and not a playgroup outing, or something so that some of the adults are parents not all nursery workers? That might explain the ratios being out

Sounds really odd to be so often though

What about M&T groups SGM? Do staffing ratios apply here? If so, how can they know how many people are going to turn up on a given day?

Obviously since this is every day it can't be an M&T group, but really interested to see if the same rules apply.

No because parents are in charge of their child at toddler group.

SGM - I would think not!

There should be one adult to four children for the under 3s, and one adult to eight children for the over 3s when they're actually at nursery/playgroup - not sure if the ratios are different if you take children off the premises? The nursery I used to work in we only took children out if we could keep to 1:4 ratio.

I was talking about groups where parents stay (playgroups where parents drop are 'preschools' here and playgroups mothers and toddlers)there is a group that comes to a park near me (not daily) that has alot of children but most of the adults are parents so ratios dont apply. I think it is arranged by a childrens centre so there are one or two nursery nurse type workers employed by surestart

How do you know how old the children are? If they are all at least 3 then the ratio is 1:8, which would make it max 4 adults for 30 children.

Seems a bit odd that they use a public bus but perhaps it's too far to keep them safe if they are walking, and they can't afford a minibus. I would be concerned about the safety aspect if it was my child, but presumably the parents have agreed to it.

I think YABU complaining that they are taking up space on a public bus though- they are just as entitled to use it as you are, however inconvenient it might be for you.

There are no different ratios for taking children on trips. It is down to each individual setting to risk assess and determine if they need extra staff. As long as they have a senior member of staff with a First Aid Certificate they are probably ok. As someone else mentioned, the ratio for over 3s is 1-8. 4 adults could therefore, be in charge of 32 children if they are all over 3.
Personally, i would not like to take that many children on a bus, and I am surprised that the drivers allow them on, as they will be taking up so much space and not paying fares. But, if that is the only way that the children get to play outside, then surely they are just making the best of a bad situation.
I do think, though, that they could walk it, and spend less time at the park. 30 minutes walking there and back is the same as 30 minutes running around the park.

Didn't know that, they would save money too by walking then.

Having access to an outside play space is a fairly new development. It is possible that the nursery/playgroup was registered before it become a requirement.
I once ran a playgroup in a local church hall, many years ago, when they were registered with social services and not OFSTED. We had no outside space at all and nobody thought it odd that the children never played outside.

I was going to say that they could walk to the park but idf there is only 4 adults for more than twice the amount of oushchairs it is a bit difficult. Is that a regular but that anyone can take or one that is specific for the 2 nurseries? I cannot imagine a bus driver letting that happen.