to be quite so angry with my mother

[NiandraLaDes]

My Mum is driving me rather mad of late. She is very control freak-ish... Feels like she should be involved in every little detail of our lives.

She and I used to have a close relationship, until she used me as an outlet to vent her frustrations at the affair she was having... My Dad can be a difficult man, and he and I have clashed a lot in the past, so I guess she thought I would condone her sleeping with a 25 year old - which I do not, but she still continues to offload on me, and think that I must always be there to answer to her and pick up the pieces.

Currently, I am off work sick - certified off by my GP, need to have tests, etc. She texted me earlier, to which I replied, then went to bed... At 8pm, I've been very tired!! My housemate wakes me up at 10 to tell me that while he was in the shower, he had 12 missed calls from her, and several messages saying 'let me in!!' and then 'let me in right now, you coward, stop lying for Niandra, she should be at work, you are both hypochondriacs!!!' At this juncture, I should mention that I never take time off work sick, am definitely not a hypochondriac and usually avoid doctors where possible.

She calls me twice daily - at least - emails me at work, texts me approx 10 times a day, expects me to call around every Friday night (if I don't, she takes the hump, big style) and expects to know my every movement... For example, 2 weeks ago she called me on my mobile at 09:10 (I was at my desk) saying 'why aren't you at work?' to which I replied that obviously, I was. I had to hang up on her and call her back from my work phone to convince her... She had 'thought' she had seen me walking down a street near my house... She also ascertained that she saw me walking with a bloke, so I was having an affair... Er, my XP broke up with me several months ago... And you can imagine how fun it was explaining that call to my colleagues... The girl that sits behind me had her chin on the floor, saying 'what?!!!! What on earth just happened?!'

Sorry, I know this is very long and ramble-y, but I just don't know what to do any more... She and I used to be so close, but now she is acting paranoid and mad (oh, one of my sisters could tell a very similar story), and there is no reasoning with her... Every time we try to point this out, she looses it and tells us we are in the wrong. Am seriously considering cutting her out of my life. AIBU to think she is being mad and that I need to cut off contact with her, at least for a while? I am so angry with her!

hmmm

You could say

"I am not going to discuss that subject with you. I will speak to you on at . Love you, bye!"

And then DO NOT ANSWER YOUR PHONE TO HER AGAIN.

but this is down to YOu. you cannot change how people behave, you can only change how you react.

Have her sectioned.

I refuse to listen to either of my parents vent about the other and have a zero tolerance to bad behaviour regarding each other I just say stop that is my Mum/Dad you are talking about.
Leave her get in a mood [pretend she is a two year old] ignore it
New policy at work no personal calls/ emails, you will check ph at lunch/coffee breaks

Thank you Ladies... I really do think it is down to me, I must stop pandering to her... The thing is, she is so demanding and needy. If I don't answer her calls, she calls my work line / housemate / calls around.

She vents at us a lot. I really do need to ignore the tantrums she throws when we don't want to hold her hand through the latest drama with her 25 year old... (she's 54, btw).

But, my problem is, she's my Mum. We have always (all my family) held that family relationships are so important, and space must be made for them. I have always honoured that, but now it's taking over my whole life, I don't know if I can anymore... I need to be an adult, not feel like I have to ask my Mum's permission to do things (which is how she thinks it should be...)

rupert22... Seriously, you may be bang on. She loves us, but clearly there is something wrong if she feels the need to control us to this extent?

She is mentally ill - that is an she is trying to control you and being irrational.
Got the same Dr's? If so you go and talk to them.

Pancake, we actually do have the same Dr, and I am seeing him tomorrow - perhaps I should mention this to him. I have genuinely worried about her mental state lately...

When I had my last miscarriage (my fourth), her words were 'ah, sure it wasn't meant to be. I know you may be sad, but you need to get over it, move on, go back to work'... Which was exactly what she said when XP and I later separated... Yet when he and her 'boy' are having issues, it's a giant tragedy, tears, snots and all the rest.

I have had to spend 4 hours on a Fri night (when she was drunk) assuring her that he does love her and it will all be fine. Fuck. Genuinely feel that she may be mentally ill now. Am I wrong in thinking that?

Why are you playing the game? It's obviously not making life any easier. You should prepare those around you for some explosions (flat mate, work colleagues/boss) and then stop playing the game. If she rings you at inappropriate times, tell her its a bad time and hang up. If she asks inappropriate questions/makes inappropriate (or over the top) demands, don't give in. It might be hellish for awhile, but by the sounds of it what is going on now isn't exactly a bed of roses.

And the repercussions of this could well let you know whether she is mentally unstable or not.

Niandra, is your mum doing the same to your sister? It sounds like your mum is dumping pretty much solely on you. Maybe it would help if you both went to her and pointed out that this is not acceptable behaviour.

While you are an adult, there still comes a point where there is a need for the child of adult boundary - and your Mum seems to forget that you may not want to know about her and her fancy boy, or at least, if she is going to offload on you she could be way more sympathetic to your own needs and issues. (I particularly sympathise with you over her mishandling of your fourth mc, that was really out of line.)

It's hard if you've had a close relationship with your Mum for years to suddenly look at it anew and realise that she might be either mentally unstable or just really selfish or both. There was another thread on here a while back that recommended a really good book, which while I normally loathe the self help genre was of great use to me. It's called When You and Your Mother Can't Be Friends by Victoria Secunda (I know, I know, that title is a bit melodramatic.) But reading bits of it came as a relief to me. I think sometimes we put up with our parents' bad behaviour because we feel guilty or that it's our parent so it must be normal.

You have my sympathies. I dunno what I'd do if my mum had a toy boy, she's nutso enough as it is. So yeah, YA deffo NBU!!

chitchat07, you are dead right... I have been letting this rule my life for too long. She really is the type though that, if I don't answer her calls, she will ring through to the main line at work... If I'm not there, she will ring my roomie... And if she doesn't get any joy there, she will land on my doorstep and ring the bell for 10 mins - which she has done. Then phone my roomie and tell him 'well if you don't let me in right now, I am sending round Niandra's father'. Jaysus, I can't believe he is still living with me!!!

Now that I see it written down, I really do need to put a stop to it. And probably buy my roomie a gift for putting up with it!!!

And when she does that, does she then get to see/speak to you? Sounds like a tantruming child, they throw a tantrum because they are trying to get what they want. If you give in, then they know they can win and will keep throwing the tantrums....!!!!

Oh and your flat mate is going to need a BIG gift if you do try to be firm, the tantrums will escalate before they get better! (I'd suggest his favourite spirit, large size!!)

Niandra ... have you posted about your mother before? I just seem to remember a nutter mother demanding money post that was kind of your style a few years ago.

LadyRabbit... Wow, it's like you climbed into my head. My Mum's handling of my fourth MC... Well, was much the same as all the rest - there is no such thing as problems, unless they are hers...

No, she is not like this with either of my sisters, in that she does not lean on them quite so much. However, she does feel the need to control them.

For example, my younger sister had a brief affair with a married man a few months back (any wonder, given the maternal example set...). I did tell my sister at the time it was very wrong, she should not do it, etc, etc.

My mother built this into a whole drama around herself (actual fling lasted less than two weeks), during which XP and I had to pick her up from work every day (fine for me to miss work when it suited her...) and comfort her, reassure her and deal with her prediction that if the bloke's OH ever found out, it could be a 'potentially lethal' situation for my sister. Really, she needs to engage with real life a bit more, and 'Eastenders' a bit less...

LR, I will deffo buy that book. It do believe I have been either normalising or rationalising my Mum's behaviour, purely because she is my Mum. Which needs to stop.

As an aside, are you Irish? The use of 'deffo' makes me wonder!! : )

colditz... No, I haven't posted about my mother before... Am relatively new to MN (only been here about 3 months) - though in a weird way, it is kind of comforting to know I'm not the only one with such a mad mother... Not that I'd wish it on anyone!!!

chitchat07... Usually she does get her way, but tonight I put my foot down... So my poor housemate had to endure 15 mins of her ringing and texting him... Wow. I will deffo need to buy him booze, or at least a big old pizza!!

Though we may be turning a corner. Usually I would give in to her. Tonight I didn't. Now I just need to barricade myself in for the weekend assault of calls...

She really is like a tantrum-throwing child... She digs in her heels and yells / calls in my Dad until she gets her own way. Then cries.

Now to turn off the phone for the next week!!!

If she threatens to send round your Dad, as a final resort say that you think that's a good idea, you're sick of lying to your Dad about the affair, there are a lot of things your Dad should know and you're looking forward to seeing him.

No, not Irish, but can relate! Come from big immigrant, God fearing family who use IT'S FAMILY as a get out clause for all sorts of dodgy behaviour and guilt tripping. It took me years of seeing that other people's folk didn't behave like that to realise that maybe, just maybe, 'they' (other people) weren't weird, maybe my family are!!! (My mum always refers to other people as 'English' when it suits her.)

I agree with lucky1979 - you can't be stuck in the middle between your parents, it's too much stress on you. Your Mum is making a huge demand on you, both practically and emotionally. The thing is, she probably keeps throwing tantrums because nobody ever does stand up to her. Do you think your Dad might know anyway and be slightly grateful that another man is dealing with your mum's craziness for a change? Just a thought.

Funnily enough, this place has really helped me deal with my mum. I came on here newly pregnant at the start of the year, when realising I didn't want to be the crazy mum to my kid that my mum was to me. I got my first result in years when I was able to put my foot down about her not moving in the moment baby was born. She is still a bit confused that I stood up to her but I think boundary setting is better late than never. I guess I really relate to your predicament because I think you are getting the rough ride my younger sister gets - she literally has no life because my mum has become utterly emotionally dependent on her.

This sounds a bit mean, but I'm learning it's a bit like training a puppy.... reward the nice stuff and refuse to put up with the nonsense!!

lucky1979 - excellent idea! She conveniently 'forgets' about her own antics and definitely believes she is above reproach - totally our fault for facilitating her and perhaps it is about time that we stopped doing this.

Lady Rabbit - 'she literally has no life because my mum has become utterly emotionally dependent on her'. I could be your younger sister! Thanks for the kind and encouraging words. I have been putting off establishing boundaries as things have been this way for so long, I worry that it won't be possible to change them. But you are dead right, better late than never. I need to reclaim my life now, before the situation goes too far and I have no hope of changing things. Or before my relationship with my Mum is damaged beyond all repair.

Also, I do feel that my Dad already knows the situation - he's a sharp man. I can totally see that he would be relieved that another man gets to handle her crazy. I see now how draining she can be, and after 35ish years of it, perhaps he is welcoming a break.

Families, eh? Wow, they can really be hard work, especially when they know just how to work the 'familial guilt' thing!!

Thanks again Ladies. I had a lovely 'phone and computer off' day today, gave myself plenty of headspace and had my sister round for a good chat so feeling more in control right now. And it does help so much to share with people who understand and have wise words to offer

"AIBU to think she is being mad and that I need to cut off contact with her, at least for a while? I am so angry with her!"

You are not being unreasonable. My mother is practically a twin of yours, and the only things that has ever reined in her behaviour, at all, is cutting off contact for a bit. At least a few months seems to be necessary for any effect, though.

jessiealbright - I think it may be the only way to proceed. In the past, I have gotten cross, ceased contact for a few days, then wavered the minute she sent me a text... Never an apologetic text mind, just a general 'well, how are ya?' text. It still has always weakened my resolve.

I think if things are ever to change, I must stand my ground this time. So if that means backing off for a couple months, then it must be done.

I'm sorry you have a difficult mother also... It can become all-consuming, hey? I used to think it would get easier, that she would change (dare I say it, mature?!) as the years passed. I now realise that she will never change, so I need to. Something has to give!

Yeah, I'm afraid I'm convinced that ceasing contact is the only thing that works. It's going to be hard, but it should ultimately pay off.

IME, nothing else I tried worked. I explained calmly and rationally that I needed sleep, or that I was perfectly entitled to move out of earshot of my phone (20 phone calls one time when I left my mobile on silent while I made myself a sandwich to eat in the kitchen!). I tried emotion, I tried reflecting her behaviour back at her, I tried explaining that she was hurting my feeling, and being unreasonable ("Yes, mum, I know that this 'escort agency' lists Jessie Albright, but it's a different Jessie. And frankly, I find your unfounded claims really hurtful and offensive")I tried everything. But nothing made her grasp the boundaries.

We're now in contact again. I'm not sure that she comprehends why I don't like her to do or say certain things, but she now has an incentive to keep to my boundaries- she thinks I could cut contact off again. She's deeply selfish and so that has some effect, whereas my explanations of how she was disrupting my life/hurting me didn't actually matter to her.

Bad news: you might have to move, though. Change your number, etc. And get some lovely presents for the people she's going to bother; otherwise you might feel like giving in, in order to save other people the inconvenience.

When You and Your Mother Can't Be Friends by Victoria Secunda? Oh, I think I've read that. It was, at the very least, comforting- other people in the same boat, kind of thing.

Jaysus,I thought I was the only one that got the '15 missed calls in a matter of minutes' thing! Er, I went for a pee, now calm down with the 'if you don't answer me right now, I'm never speaking to you again' type texts... I think, with my Mum anyway, it is down to a sense of entitlement... She gave birth to me, raised me, so believes that she is entitled to have a say / be involved in every part of my life.

Yes, she can dress it up as 'caring about me'. I have no doubt that she does. Which is lovely. However, she can care about me without needing to know my every move. Or whether I'm in work or not. Or if I'm out, in the pub, and what time I will be out until (oh yeah, I still get the 'where are you? What time will you be home at? I'll call you when you say you are home to make sure you are really there' texts.

I may have to move. And as you say, buy lots of gifts. She has currently gotten under the skin of several workmates, my roomie, my closest friends, and soon the new bloke I am seeing... She is very miffed that he doesn't say hello when he passes her in the street, even though they have never been introduced, and she only knows who he is because I pointed him out when we passed by him at work a few weeks back... And he has no notion who she is (hmm, guess why?!?!) Miffed enough to 'want to say to him' that he is rude for not stopping to talk to her. By all means Mother, ruin the first dalliance I have going on since XP dumped me!!

I will deffo need to read that book! Would it help if I force-fed it to her, page by page?!!!

Hi Niandra

I am in a very similar situation and offer you much sympathy! A few months ago I discovered via the Relationships forum on Mumsnet, lots of information about narcissistic mothers. There is a website called daughtersofnarcissisticmothers which is definitely worth a look. I haven't got time to write a full post at the moment (toddlers!) but will try to do so later.

Also a book I would recommend from Amazon: 'Will I ever be good enough? Daughters of narcissistic mothers.

Take care

Oh and YANBU but she most definitely is !!

Niandra, you say that your mother cares about you, but does she really care that much? I mean, from her reaction to your mc, it doesn't sound like it on the face of it.

It sounds like she gets bored very easily and is using you and your sister to facilitate her own personal soap opera, either by being the audience whenever she needs one, or by providing new plotlines. ("OMG, my daughter is having an affair!")

Oh and definitely never give her anyone else's phone number again!