Meet the Other Phone. A phone that grows with your child.

Meet the Other Phone.
A phone that grows with your child.

Buy now

Please or to access all these features

Adoption

Here are some suggested organisations that offer expert advice on adoption.

school and untrue disclosures....

7 replies

Jobionekenobi · 18/01/2024 12:00

TLDR - DD(5) telling school things that are not true following an incident of a care giver (after school club) hurting her that likely is true.

I'm probably massively over thinking this, but perhaps because my professional background dealt a lot with child safeguarding. I need someone to stop me from panicking or even tell me this is not uncommon.

My DD is 5 and started school in September (it's probably not relevant but we held her back a year as she is a mid summer and 4 week premature baby, and felt she needed the more nurturing environment of nursery for another year). Emotionally she is very much not at age 5. To add to the complexity she has mild cerebral palsy which makes her brain process things slightly differently.

Anyway, end of November/ beginning of December time DD made a disclosure that a woman who works at after school club had stamped on her foot and shouted at her whilst she was being naughty. I had bad vibes about this woman and this club from the start on reflection. Long story short, I gave up my 20 year career so I could make sure she never had to go back. To be clear, I absolutely believe my DD that something DID happen. She might tell me all sort of fantastical stories about dragons and ghosts but her account of what happened never waivers.

Anyway. none of this has helped my DD who was already really struggling with her emotions and anxieties at school. and the school note that since this incident she has been particularly heightened.

DD seemed particularly heightened this week. She was through the roof emotionally on Monday and I removed her from the queue at the school gates and put her back in the car with me to remove her from the situation. She was kicking me, kicking my car deliberately wiping mud from her shoes all over the inside of my car. I think I was in the moment and trying to keep calm but I think I said something along the lines of 'I'm going to have to clean this now'. She has gone to school and told them that I am making her clean the car. Queue safeguarding telephone call from the deputy head. I obviously hadn't said that at all!

Today....another safeguarding call. She has told them that daddy hurt her and scratched her. This stems from yesterday when she was also very heightened and she was going a little crazy at the same time he pulled the strap to tighten the straps. She screamed at him to stop hurting her - which he really didn't. So I was able to explain that it really wasn't that dramatic.

Every morning she screams at me to stop hurting her when I brush her hair, she yells at both me an DH to stop being horrible to her - what's actually happened is we've asked her to stop doing something. As a side note, she also tells us her teachers stop her from going to the toilet (I'm positive they don't!).

We had a very in-depth meeting with the school yesterday (which is why my DH was with me and the change in routine didn't help DD) and they are very aware of her background and the challenges - one of her teachers acknowledged that DD had told her that if she hurt her then she'd be able to go home.

But I'm sat here panicking about these calls about the things she is saying that sound awful but aren't true. This has literally just started happening this week for some reason. I

Is this is a phase? Is this common in children from trauma?

If you got through this - thank you!

OP posts:
Jobionekenobi · 18/01/2024 12:08

I forgot to add to my post, post adoption support has been absolutely awful from our agency. So we don't even bother anymore.

OP posts:
tonyhawks23 · 18/01/2024 13:05

I think it is common - I remember a podcast on it from the A&F podcast so may be worth a look, and there is some about it in the book The Trauma & Attachment Aware Classroom I think. Our DD 3 does some of this, confabulation, she will say things like so and so hit me, even if I know so and so wasnt in school that day, for example. Sometimes she will confuse 'hurt me' with 'hurt my feelings' which certainly has the potential for safeguarding worries. I think you are right to fully discuss with the school and make sure they are aware and make sure their policy is to always bring you in. I think the podcast mentioned a proper way to discuss the 'hurt' with child so that school can see its not a safeguarding thing, but I cant remember what that was called, maybe someone else will??

Jellycatspyjamas · 18/01/2024 17:08

Yes it’s very common for traumatised kids to disclose things that haven’t happened or to conflate one situation with another. Trauma impacts the way we store information so memory can be quite mixed up, it can to difficult to process information and develop a coherent narrative of a situation, and time can be quite mixed up too.

My DD has disclosed things saying her dad did x, y or z when I know beyond doubt that it didn’t or when I know it actually happened in foster care or with birth family. Life story work can help unmuddle their timeline. We’ve had social work involvement on and off for years - which is interesting given I’m also a social worker.

Jobionekenobi · 19/01/2024 20:52

Jellycatspyjamas · 18/01/2024 17:08

Yes it’s very common for traumatised kids to disclose things that haven’t happened or to conflate one situation with another. Trauma impacts the way we store information so memory can be quite mixed up, it can to difficult to process information and develop a coherent narrative of a situation, and time can be quite mixed up too.

My DD has disclosed things saying her dad did x, y or z when I know beyond doubt that it didn’t or when I know it actually happened in foster care or with birth family. Life story work can help unmuddle their timeline. We’ve had social work involvement on and off for years - which is interesting given I’m also a social worker.

Actually, that is so similar. Her teacher told me that my DD sometimes said that she did things to her on a certain day when it's not even a working day for her.

Her timelines do get mixed up for sure, and small incidents do get inflated in her mind.

We haven't revisited life story work for quite a while. She had quite an adverse reaction last time we did. So we talk about her life story for the moment as she seems to deal with it a bit better, but she seems to have no conscious memory of anything before us...but there is certainly some stuff subconsciously bubbling under the surface I think.

My DH was in bits that she had said what she had to the teacher, the crazy thing is she idolises him!

OP posts:
Jobionekenobi · 19/01/2024 20:56

tonyhawks23 · 18/01/2024 13:05

I think it is common - I remember a podcast on it from the A&F podcast so may be worth a look, and there is some about it in the book The Trauma & Attachment Aware Classroom I think. Our DD 3 does some of this, confabulation, she will say things like so and so hit me, even if I know so and so wasnt in school that day, for example. Sometimes she will confuse 'hurt me' with 'hurt my feelings' which certainly has the potential for safeguarding worries. I think you are right to fully discuss with the school and make sure they are aware and make sure their policy is to always bring you in. I think the podcast mentioned a proper way to discuss the 'hurt' with child so that school can see its not a safeguarding thing, but I cant remember what that was called, maybe someone else will??

Thanks so much. I'll check out those things. I think I was for sure looking for a starting point - wondering if this was a 'thing' and if so if there would be resources somewhere. So thanks, I have a starting point. The school are trauma trained and use PACE etc, but I guess still, when an issue like this comes up they have to follow it up each time. My fear if she keeps disclosing things like this that aren't happening that it's going to cause a whole heap of problems!

OP posts:
Jellycatspyjamas · 19/01/2024 21:14

We haven't revisited life story work for quite a while. She had quite an adverse reaction last time we did.

My DD is doing life story work as part of her therapy through CAMHS, who are pacing it well. It’s hard going and while we talk about her life story as it comes up but she needs the structure and safety of therapy. She has made disclosures in therapy relating to her foster carers (which have now been investigated and shown to be true) and the false allegations seem to have stopped since the therapy has helped her put together her timeline.

Your local authority may have a contract with someone like Barnardos who can do the work and offer a safe space for her.

Torvy · 20/01/2024 08:36

I used to work in an education safeguarding role and I can second that traumatised kids get things confused all the time- as @tonyhawks23 and @Jellycatspyjamas said, trauma does stuff to their memories and narratives that mean certain things get muddled or confused.

School have to investigate everything though, and it can be helpful to have a discussion with yourself and your partner about how you react when (not if!) you are contacted, because it can send you into a tailspin when you get the call. We treat it like any incident of poor behaviour- so we give our version of events if we know, say that we will have to speak to our other half if we dont know, but then ask for more details about the context of the disclosure- was he with friends? Who did he disclose to? What were they doing? What exactly did they say? Maybe they have a tendency to exaggerate when talking with certain friends for example, or dislike PE and know that saying soemthing on a Thirsday means they get to sit in an office and chat with a learning mentor rather than going out into the cold. Sarah Naish talks about one of her children being experts in appealing to get an adults "sympathetic face" because that is how her children survived their early childhood. This is really relevant because it tells you your child is triggered and feels unsafe and needs to appeal to adults in whatever way they can.

I also think it is important to know a bit about the process of safeguarding in schools to reassure yourself about any outcomes.

it may be different in your school, so do read the policy, but most schools ive worked in do something like this:

The child makes a disclosure. Teacher has to report it, even if they know it is unlikely to be true, because it might just be and they are not trained to make that decision. So they do that, the child is usually taken aside by another member of staff, usually the DSL and asked to tell again what happened. At this point the story either disintegrates or consolidates, but the line of questioning is very specific because leading questions aren't allowed. Based on what they know of the child and the situation, they will investigate, a part of which is getting relevant peoples version of events before making a decision about what to do next, which can include calling parents, speaking to siblings, discussing with the teacher about the context of the disclosure etc. From what brought are telling me, you have been involved at this stage, the information gathering. At this point the DSL will make a choice as to what should happen next.

In our area at least, the DSL would then have to be concerned enough to make a referral to MASH, and the first question that is usually asked is "what do the parents say". Most SG leads will have already spoken to the parents unless there is specific prior concerns because they know that question is coming.

At that point MASH will advise- it can vary in what could happen. It may be that they tell the school to say specific things to the family and signpost to resources, they might recommend a referral into early help programmes, arrange a visit from a social worker in the future, immediately send a social worker to speak to the family before the child is released into their care, or send social workers and police if a possible crime has been committed. (Im sure there are other outcomes too, but those are a few ive known to happen) It is a sliding scale, but trust me, i should imagine that if the DSL has any experience at all, they will have been involved in all of those at some point. None of those things are pleasant, or wanted, but knowing the possible outcomes always helped me keep it in perspective.

Obviously, not everyone involved in the process understands how trauma works, but it can be a very useful opportunity to advocate for further support for your child. I remember reading one person on FB explaining how her child made such allegations that were always found to be untrue, but after sitting down several times with social services and listing all the interventions her child had, how she parented and the challenges of the children, she was expedited through the CAMHS process and, bizarrely, had her child referred to a horse riding outreach programme. She took whatever they would offer her basically.

We have found it helpful to preempt lots of this with our LO- we have regular conversations on the school gate and with the DSL to ensure that we are all on the same page about what he is saying and how that can be interpreted. Nursery have noticed similar patterns, so if he says something about a teacher, I always speak to the nursery teacher and let them know he has said it so that they can speak with him and remind them that i trust the investigative process of the school, and offer to write up what he has told me in an email if they need it. I shared some phrases that we use with him when we know he is misinterpreting the situation and it has helped. School feels supportive, but we have had to lean into it and trust the key people in school with maybe more information about our parenting and personal lives than I would have expected.

It is a tough old road to tread, but as someone just starting out, I understand how scary it can feel to get that call. Try to see it as your child being scared and confused, and surviving how best they can, and then move through it with the professionals in that way if you can.

New posts on this thread. Refresh page