What happens at 16?

[Rosebud2005]

Ds came to us age 7 but had always been clear he wants to meet back up with mum when he’s 16. I’ve been very aware lately we have just over a year to that date. I try and talk to dh about it but he’s just never as concerned about it as me. It will be his choice by then but what did your children do by that age? I can’t help sorry he might actually move. I’ve made it clear to him we’re his family and we want him to understand we’re not going to make him leave or anything. Could he? I think he’s happy, he always says he is but he does have personal things going on in his head which I’ve always tried so hard to talk to him about. Now age 14 (15 soon) he doesn’t talk about anything and gets stroppy if I even ask these days. He always opened up to me. I’d hate to think he feels the need to not be here.

O'vienna before I start please note that me disagreeing with you does not mean I am minimising your point of view.

It may be inevitable that the OP's son reaches out; I didn't say that this wasn't something she shouldn't prepare for. The lifestory work sounds valuable regardless of what he decides to do you and I basically agree here, but what I had said was that given he was older when he was adopted and he has said consistently over the years that he wants contact, then that needs to be acted on and listened to.
Although, his views might change after life story work - as I said, things change.

I did say she shouldn't initiate contact until he does I didn't say anything about initiating contact in my latest post. I spoke about preparing for contact. However, my view on this is different from yours - I think that rather wait for him, there is a need to talk about it, not just wait for him to raise it - though again this will hopefully happen naturally after life story. I don't think in this situation it is wise to wait especially because the dc has already made his views known more than once.

Someone else driving the pace of things isn't helping - it can be just another means of inserting themselves into a life step that isn't theirs to decide I agree with you if the adoptee is 16 plus. Deciding about contact when the adoptee is a child is a parenting decision imo.

The only other thing I think I might disagree with you on is to age - I think these issues are all better dealt with as young as possible. I suspect I have had an easier time of contact than you, because I did the serious work on it when I was an older teenager whereas you were nearly 50 (I think?). You may very strongly disagree, which is fine - all our views are valid here.

You said he gets stroppy and shuts down if you try and talk to him, in the nicest possible way, drop the topic.

You’ll push him away, you’re putting too much pressure on him, if you have a positive relationship with him he already knows he can come to you.

Let him do what he wants on his terms, I have little contact with my parents and my older brother has no contact with his adopted parents who adopted him at 8.

They constantly had opinions on what he should and shouldn’t do and what support they had, although well intentioned it actually ended up smothering him, he left for Uni and never went back.

OP the other thing I'd say is just to repeat what I said in my first post upthread that for you to focus on your relationship with him. Whether or not he wants and succeeds with a relationship with his bio mother, it won't be a rejection of you. His relationship with you now and in the future will depend on the strength of his relationship with you. This is a good video about teenagers if you haven't seen it:

I appreciate you saying you validate my view - thank you.

Deciding about contact when the adoptee is a child is a parenting decision imo.

Contact with a biological parent should be child-led IMO. I would have found it very invasive if my adoptive parents tried to initiate this/orchestrate it in some way and also I found them difficult to manage when they expressed discomfort at my approach to talking about it. What I wanted from them - simply - is for them to follow my lead and support my decisions, whatever they were. To be there to listen and talk to me but not try to control or take the lead in the process in any way. Answering specific questions is one thing or helping me access information I would not have been able to is different. If this is what you mean, as opposed to trying to take control of the actual speed of contact, I agree.

The only other thing I think I might disagree with you on is to age - I think these issues are all better dealt with as young as possible.

It depends very much on the child and their sense of self and well-being. There can be no hard and fast rule. My reaction to this case was being adopted at seven is very late and from an adult's timescale it is not very long to have processed/altered some of the issues that may have predicated that decision to remove (as I mentioned above.) I'd want to be very clear about what the child was walking into, as a parent, if contact were being made.

I can't for the life of me see a reason to argue sooner rather than later is better in most situations like that.

We are speaking in abstract terms now as we don't know the particulars of the OPs son's situation - enough of them to form a view.

But this is the difficulty in terms of it being all child led: if you are dealing with at child interested in contact before adulthood, as a parent you would want to have enough information to risk assess whether contact would be advisable at that particular point based on where the child was and also the biological parent. The child that previously lived with a biological parent was removed for a reason that will have been explained to the parents. I guess all the adoptive parent can do is really keep talking and supporting and I do agree that working on your own relationship with the child needs to be done concurrently.

ovienna
Contact with a biological parent should be child-led IMO we can agree to disagree. I give my dc a huge amount of guidance with relationships, learning to deal with difficult situations, learning to process difficult situations, teaching about boundaries which I see as an ongoing thing to teach about with dc, I decide on which adult relationships we continue with, and what adults are or are not in their best interests to see, I explain why with them in age appropriate ways and discuss (and modify my thinking sometimes if I learn something I was not aware of from them) and of course take their feelings on board, and things have evolved as time has gone on and will continue to do so as they mature, though they generally trust me and agree with me at the moment (which is good) but at the end of the day I decide at the moment - they are still in primary - and I would see any contact with bio parents in the same way if I had adopted them (they are bio dc).

I'd want to be very clear about what the child was walking into, as a parent, if contact were being made of course, I absolutely agree

I can't for the life of me see a reason to argue sooner rather than later is better in most situations like that I am not sure why you'd think that - so we must see things very differently. If you mean that if someone is removed it means that everything was negative, then that isn't correct. I went to live with adoptive parents at 6 and had contact until 9 or 10 and then again at 14 - there were many, many positives. Looking wider, if you look at the longitudinal studies in many situations there are positives. I have listed the positives I perceive there to be in a different thread. Though it has to be managed properly and it won't always be possible - it has to be assessed on a case by case basis. Most parents including birth parents do their best (not all, but most) and even if for whatever reason they are not responsible enough to parent a child day to day, there may still be love and positive things about the relationship. This was my experience.

ovienna
this can escalate quickly into something that is deeply unhealthy for the child and hard to extract themselves from both in a practical sense and emotionally

I have also given some more thought to this. I think that how you bring up a child to deal with relationships,to deal with difficult situations, about boundaries, etc, will have a huge impact on how well they are able to cope and then cope on their own as adults. Yes, adoption is hard, but there are many other adverse childhood situations which are hard, and many people are confronted by potentially toxic relationships in adulthood. It is how we learn to deal with things which matters. Incidentally, in my case I found establishing healthy boundaries with my adoptive parents as an adult far harder than with any other relationship! Adoptees can feel guilt and responsibility about that too.

An experience which is hard is only going to get deeply unhealthy if the adults around the child let it and the older child has not been given the tools for extracting and processing and dealing with difficult feelings, imo.

It is by talking about feelings and learning to live with difficult feelings that we learn to cope and expand our tolerance - as time goes on dealing with difficult things becomes a skill making it easier to recover from difficult events. Unless we experience difficult things and are taught how to process, we cannot mature.

You may not agree!

Yes - we just see things very differently. The 15 year old me would never have managed the boundaries I found I needed to cope with a reunion the way a 25 year old me would have. Maybe I would have found a way eventually, at 15, but also? That would have ended up being a big part of my childhood that I could have done without. The people who have shared their stories with me in some cases found birth parents so needy, with so much invested in what the reunion would do for THEM, it formed a large part of their life going forward. In some cases practically, for a period of time, but in all cases emotionally. I don't think a child deserves to feel the weight of that. Especially after a disrupted early life. They don't owe the birth family that - at all.

I've just seen your last message, which IMO assumes that the birth parent is putting as much into the reflection on their own behaviour as possible, into any reunion as the adopted child and the adoptive parents supporting them might be.

You can't assume this will be the case.

Sassy - we won't see eye to eye on this. Your general perspective is well-represented on FB forums and most adoption sites where the OP might be seeking advice. I am sure there are many that agree with you.

My experience is very different. I know I am not alone but seemingly in a minority. I just wanted the OP to hear things from another point of view. She knows her son and the circumstances and I am sure will make the right call.

The people who have shared their stories with me in some cases found birth parents so needy, with so much invested in what the reunion would do for THEM I know no one who has experienced this personally. I don't doubt you for a moment. I imagine that people supporting you in this way are doing so because you all have shared experiences, whereas if I wanted support, people with similar experiences to me would come forward. I would have no idea what percentages reflect your or my experience as there is no such info available - we simply do not know. It would be useful if we did.

I've just seen your last message, which IMO assumes that the birth parent is putting as much into the reflection on their own behaviour as possible, into any reunion as the adopted child and the adoptive parents supporting them might be no not at all - the acting parent or professionals need to manage situations - the birth parent's reflection on their own behaviour is completely irrelevant. As I say -I have been through this - I had contact in childhood with a bm where there had been neglect. We still have a relationship which is worthwhile. I would not leave my dc alone with them for exactly the same reasons I was removed. Their reflection is totally unnecessary as I am the one in control - as parent - and there to manage everything.

Your general perspective is well-represented on FB forums and most adoption sites where the OP might be seeking advice. I am sure there are many that agree with you I have never been on a FB forum and rarely go to other sites. The majority view out there actually is your opinion, not mine. If you are comparing what i have said the "angry adoptee" fb sites, in fact what I have said is what is also said in research in the UK. Research about this issue is why adoptions are open in Australia. More bona fide research and guidance is needed in the UK and the US. In the UK 2018 Enquiry this issue was highlighted as important and it was acknowledged that there is a dearth of research informing adoption in all respects including in relation to this issue. So it is something which needs attention and worthy of discussion.

I just wanted the OP to hear things from another point of view. She knows her son and the circumstances and I am sure will make the right call I think that the key thing here and the immediate and urgent need is for good life story work, especially about the circumstances of her ds' birth, as many pps have said. I suspect that this will also be very helpful in relation to making decisions about contact, when and how.

PS if anything in my posts is expressed badly or appears blithe or anything else, please give me the benefit of the doubt - I have had to bash it out at the speed of light before the mumsnet police in my house find me and lecture me about whether i should be allowed on mumsnet. It seems wanting to be "in control" is hereditary and my dc are chips off the old block. (I am joking - I do actually think parents need to be in control)

ovienna
I just wanted the OP to hear things from another point of view my last post was light hearted but true in the sense that i didn't read back and edit. I just wanted to say that where you say I just wanted the OP to hear things from another point of view you are absolutely right and I apologise if it seemed that I was riding roughshod over your point of view - it wasn't intentional. I am not sure whether the general consensus is for or again f2f contact in the US - in the UK it is still very rare (I believe). Apologies again.

@sassy hi. Thanks for your messages. I'll try to come back at some point and respond properly. Might send a PM.x