Birth mum had another baby

[JohnPA]

A couple of years ago we adopted siblings and have learned recently through our kids’ previous foster carers that birth mum had another baby.

What happens when someone who has had their kids removed for adoption has another baby? Are social services aware of this? Is the new baby put on a child protection plan? Or do social services only get involved if things go wrong again?

Also, if the new child needs to be adopted at some stage, do social services always contact the family that has adopted their siblings first?

Thanks for the clarifications. Hopefully everything will go well with the new child, but we were wondering what other people’s experience was.

It's likely that social services would be involved before the child is born, but it doesn't necessarily mean that the child will be removed or placed for adoption. There's a very recent thread on this where people have shared their experiences of this kind of situation.
www.mumsnet.com/Talk/adoptions/3878870-Birth-Mum-Pregnant-Again

Usually when booking midwives ask about previous children, if it isn't told then, then it would easily be found out via health record (that she has other children, not where they are now). Most midwives would then contact Children's Social Care to see where the other children are, if they are concerned.

An assessment would be undertaken, depending on mum's situation, anything could happen, support, Child Protection, Removal, mother and baby placement, the list is endless.

If Adoption is considered the plan Children's Social Care always seek to contact adoptive parents of other siblings first, prior to search for anyone else.

Thank you for your responses. We read in the other thread some people recommending adoptive parents to contact social services to express interest in adopting the new child, if adoption was decided as the best plan, because social services might not always considered them first as per the protocol. However, not sure how I feel about that since I would potentially be preempting something that might not actually happen. What’s people advice on this? Should we be proactive or wait to be contacted?

If you don't know the status of the baby then no I wouldnt approach social services.
I don"t think the FC should have shared that information to be honest. I found out that my son's birth mum had another baby through 'unofficial ' sources, I don't think its any of my business. Its a sensitive issue

I don't see the harm in making it known to the adoption team that you are open to adopting any further children from the family if they are not staying with their birth mum.
There could be other possible family options for other children born to her but it sounds like you're aware of that.
The foster carer has found out from someone, possibly even social services with intention of them fostering this new baby if needed. It is not your fault you have been given the information, if the foster carer has been indiscreet that's for social services to take up with them.

I wouldn’t expect social work to discuss a new baby with foster carers unless they were in the process of placing the baby with them - the birth mum has a right to privacy and telling someone “on the off chance” would be an appalling breach of confidence.

I personally wouldn’t approach social work about this new baby, there’s something to me that’s distasteful about hearing about a new baby and pre-empting things going wrong. Given it’s information you wouldn’t usually have, I’d wait and see if you’re approached if the baby does need to be removed. It’s not always the case that subsequent babies are removed - she may have changed enough or have enough support to keep this little one.

Our ds bm had two more children. She kept them both.

Hi op, do contact social services. I know of an adoptive couple who reached approval for the second time and only by enquiry about a birth sibling did they find out that birth mum had not only had another baby but the baby was already in foster care with a placement order for adoption. Don’t rely on social services.

@muminabun that's a very different scenario.
Adopters need to be very careful that they don't come across as waiting ounce on any new baby, the birth mum happens to have. The birth mum is entitled to her privacy, and adopters have no rights around any subsequent child.
the OP was quite right in being cautious

Why would an enquiry to let social services know that you would be interested in adding to your family and making a lifelong commitment to your child’s birth sibling be seen in a negative light?
The point in my post was that sometimes ss can be unreliable and you my have to be proactive.

@Muminabun adopting a child does not give you rights or priorities over subsequent children.
In the situation you describe the adopters were informed by social services about a child who had been removed and with a plan for adoption. It wouldnt be wrong to enquire about the possiblity of adopting that child.
My son has two half siblings, I have never been been informed by social services, both children are with their mums. I found out about these children through unofficial means. It not my place to be 'proactive' about children who have not been removed from their families.

I've come across some very worrying situations where adopters have found out about a subsequent pregnancy and have effictively stalked the mother waiting for the birth as if they had some rights to the child, just because they had adopted a sibling.

Hi ted, nowhere have I said that adopters have rights or priorities over subsequent birth children. Biology matters and that was not just any child to them but the biological sibling to their child. I think that adopted children do have a right to know about their birth families and have some information about birth siblings. Birth parents have a right to privacy but if they have neglected and/or abused a child to the extent it was removed by ss then I think that ss do have a right to monitor any subsequent pregnancies. Child welfare must come first.

@Muminabun you're quite right to say that any child born to a birth family who have had a child removed from their care will be closely monitored. However adopters do not have an automatic right to know about anything that happens within the birth family post adoption and this includes whether they go on to have more children. SS would have to get permission from the courts under data protection in order to share this information and that assumes that SS are aware that a previous child has been adopted. People move around and change local authority and LAs are notoriously bad at sharing information.

@Muminabun

you are missing the point.
Adopted children do know about their birth families. My son talks to his brother nearly every day.
SW do monitor children before birth. Some babie are removed at birth.
That wasnt the point at issue.
What was being discussed was adopters approaching SWs about children who they had found out about unoffically, that is not by social services, BEFORE a decision was made about the child's future and when the child may well still be in the care of the birth family.

Because my son and his brother are in contact, I found out about the mum's pregnancy via facebook. That baby remains with his mum two years later. Can you not see it would have been completelt inappropriate of me to contact SW and express my interest in that child, ie another woman's child, on the basis that he is my son's sibling

Birth parents have a right to privacy but if they have neglected and/or abused a child to the extent it was removed by ss then I think that ss do have a right to monitor any subsequent pregnancies. Child welfare must come first.

There’s a vast difference between social work monitoring and supporting a new mum’s care for her baby and someone contacting social work expressing an interest in adopting that child. Social work is a reserved profession with duties and powers clearly set out in legislation. A member of the public contacting them about the potential for adopting any child is a breach of boundaries regardless of whether they happened to adopt a previous child.

The adoptive parents have no right to further information about the birth family unless the issue potentially might impact their care of their child. If the new baby is removed, and if they are considered for adoption social work might put out feelers, but they may also know of reasons why it wouldn’t be appropriate to place a new baby with siblings which it wouldn’t be appropriate to discuss with the adoptive parents.

Honestly, these things are incredibly complex, involve the privacy of birth parents and other children and decisions aren’t made lightly. It’s not a free for all, or a baby market.

The point in my post was that sometimes ss can be unreliable and you my have to be proactive.

And you know enough of the situation to know there was absolutely no reason the child needed to be placed with a different family? There are sometimes very good reasons not to consider existing adoptive families when looking at placement of subsequent children. I wouldn’t expect social workers to discuss these issues out with the birth family because they’re private, personal and very sensitive discussions, I’d certainly not be jumping to SS are unreliable as a starting point - and I’d want to know how the birth families confidentiality was breached and by whom that the adoptive parents knew about the pregnancy in the first place.

We had a call yesterday to say DD's birth mum is pregnant again. In her case, the midwives at her new LA were aware of her history and contacted the LA we used. We are being given first refusal.

They live really far away so we wont be able to foster to adopt because we cant keep up with contact multiple times a week for the first few months. Also we feel that we're complete with 3 DC now. But it is a real guilt trip to say no to the next one.

Not necessarily, I would also base any actions made, on what the circumstances were for mother to give up the other two children, not all adoptions are from child abuse/neglect etc, but then I take it you would know the circumstances as you are the adoptive parent. It is a delicate subject, and one that I find difficult to get my head around too, to be honest. I do know of mothers whom have had children removed then gone on to have others, I think there are only one or two situations where I can even start to understand how that can be okay. But focusing on this particular situation, is it a case of you being quite happy to take on another child, as I'm not sure if that would be enough or right. I am sure that medical staff involved in the mothers care will of noted things down, and if anything, they will forward it on to the relevant team/s.

Hi all. I’m new to this. I don’t want any judgements or anything.

I unfortunately had a corrupt social services worker and they basically took my daughter into a adoption on the basis that I have learning needs. I also fell pregnant months later with another baby and they done the same with no chances or anything but I was lucky that I was given a chance with my daughter and done everything right which baffles my brain. I see them and receive letters. Don’t wanna go into to much detail on here but happy if someone wanted to contact me privately etc.

My questions is, will I ever be able to have a baby in my care ever? I’m still young and do want to be given that opportunity to have a baby in mine and my partners care.

Thanks for listening

Hi @Rose2424 I’ve replied on your other thread, you might not get many replies to this post because it’s an old thread and you’re asking a different question, so folk might not pick it up. Hopefully you’ll get helpful replies on your thread.

No. I wouldn't contact them. Feels a bit handmaids tale.

I have freinds who were approached about their child’s biological sibling. They went ahead and adopted him. They children have a wonderful bond. But the parents now have a ten year old and 4 year old children with very severe additional needs. I can’t help wondering if it was the best thing for the younger one.