Twin Sisters:A World Apart

[Chocolatebreadcrumbs]

I found this on iplayer, and it's breaking my heart. I find it very hard that the parents continued with the adoption, when the question was first raised in China, and have brought the girls up so far apart.

There doesn't feel to be a simple solution, but I'm not sure that growing up in a different country to your twin can ever be the least damaging option. When they talked about getting the DNA results, and justified keeping the girls because they'd fallen in love, I feel the parents focused on their love rather than the girls' best interests. However, perhaps a second move for one girl would have been damaging, too, and whatever it's almost too late now. I grew up away from my siblings, and it tore into me as a child.

Did any of the wise people on here have any thoughts? Has anyone seen it?

Was it the one that first aired some time ago?

I seem to remember that the simple problem was that they couldn;t confirm that the girls were twins at the time, it was subsequently confirmed through DNA.

Knowing how badly affected DS was by the changes that happened in his first 12 months I can't honestly say I could be sure that moving one of them again would be for the best or not. I think it's impossible to tell at this stage.

I also accept there was a degree of selfishness involved. Having met and started bonding with my new child, could i have beared to give them to someone else - not even a biological parent? Then started on the matching journey again (I doubt China would have let them jump the queue when they already be matched with a child and legally adopted them in China).

Impossible situation and one I'm so glad I didn't have to deal with.

I don't know- I've only just come across it on iplayer. It does feel like it has an anti-American, pro Norwegian bias! And the parents do appear to be doing their best with what's happened now they're older. But the whole situation is very uncomfortable.

I'm still going through the process, and finding the idea of divided siblings heartbreaking.

It was made by a norwegian company I believe - so the bias is understandable.

Divided twins is very rare even in China - I know of several sets of twins and generally as long as they are given up together at the same place with a note making clear they are twins then they would be adopted together.

Divided siblings? Very common, you'll have to get your head around that - for all that attempts are made to place siblings together I know many many situations where siblings are split for VERY good reasons:

I know an adoption that disrupted when older child was discovered to be abusing younger child and had to be returned to foster care prior to the adoption.
I know 6 siblings who have been adopted one at a time, first 3 by one family (one a year!) then when they got to three they said "No more" and the next three went to a different family (one every 18 months) who have now said "No more" and any future children will be placed elsewhere.
Also very common when a group of siblings with large age difference will be placed separately or some be long term fostered and others adopted.

Chocolatebreadcrumbs I just watched it on iplayer. It says there are 27 more days to watch it. So thanks for the heads up.

www.bbc.co.uk/iplayer/episode/b053pxdt/twin-sisters-a-world-apart

I am very sorry that you grew up away from your siblings. I am sure it must be very hard. I guess for most people their first and most profound relationship is with mum and/or dad. From learning to relate to parents and to be loved and valued by them we learn to form further relationships with others, including siblings.

It is curious, because if I had not read the comments here I would not have thought really that there was any other way of doing things than the way they were done (in terms of the girls going to live with the families they were matched with) and I still do not think that anything to do with that could have been done differently.

Clearly, the authorities screwed up and had the parents not chosen to dress the girls in the same dresses they would never have known of each other.

I feel both sets of parents might have done more to help the girls to learn each others languages, or a third common language (Chinese!) which would have helped them to bond better and might have taken them to see each other, I am not sure when the programme was made; but the girls were adopted in 2004 and at the start of the programme had only met up together once. That sounds very judgemental on my part, I don't really mean that. I wonder if fear played a factor and they worried that the other family would make moves to get the custody of the other girl. The Norwegian mum says that right at the start of the programme and I do wonder if that is why she had trouble passing on her contact details.

The girls lives are so totally different and it would be easy to pick holes in or see faults in one lifestyle over another or to see the good in one place or other. I am sure shots may have been arranged like that, chicken nuggets verses a piece of bread, the safety to walk everywhere verses being driven around. Yet actually each family is doing the best for their child in the setting they are in. And as the American dad said, most (almost all) adopted children from China will not have any one who has a biological link to them - so in that sense they are more 'fortunate' than most. I put 'fortunate' in '' because we all know it is not lucky to get adopted but if they must be adopted, and they were, and adopted separately, as they were, then to find each other was, I feel, 'fortunate'.

Chocolatebreadcrumbs I don't really understand your comment, I find it very hard that the parents continued with the adoption, when the question was first raised in China, and have brought the girls up so far apart. When they first met the other couple they had been assigned a child by the Chinese government and were told the girls were not twins.

What could they possibly do in that situation. Reject the link and leave the child in the care of an orphanage. There would be no guarantee the girls would be adopted together or even that they would be adopted for sure. How could they just walk away? When we adopted our son we had a photo of him (UK domestic adoption) before he was placed with us, for about three months we knew he would be our son before we met him. If such a concern had arisen in this country an adoptive parent-to-be may feel more confident to probe the social service or adoption agency to ask about this, but in this situation (abroad, in Communist China) one would have no real way of knowing what would happen if you started to ask questions during an adoption process.

And six months into an adoption I really think is too late to change things around, who would possibly decide where the girls should go. I am not sure I heard anyone ...justified keeping the girls because they'd fallen in love, I can't imagine there could be different outcome. As Alexandria said, 'Mia wants to live with her family and I want to live with my family.' That's what adoption is, at it's best, as strong a bond as a biological one (IMHO).

I think the fact they are identical twins instead of 'just' sisters is probably the factor that makes it so very hard. They look and act alike and it must sometimes be hard to know who is who, Alexandra was not sure with the photos. That must make it feel very difficult.

As Kew rightly says sometimes in the UK siblings are adopted apart because it is better for them. Clearly, in this case there was no reason for them to be adopted apart aside from someone's negligence in terms of cataloguing. The fact they were both known to be born on the same day does suggest someone screwed up!

They lived in different countries where the couples each had at least one other child (although not necessarily living wit them) and work etc. How could they have just relocated?

It was clear Alexandra was more worried than Mia, I wonder if this was because she had fewer distractions or because her mum was more concerned about the situation than the American mum. Maybe because the Norwegian mum already had two daughters the situation was more of a concern for her. I don't know.

Re ...it's almost too late now. I think it is 100% too late for the girls to every live apart from their adopted parents while they are children. But I do not think it is too late for them to develop a lasting and meaningful relationship as sisters. The end of the programme signified that they may well do that.

It was fascinating and thank you for suggesting it, Chocolatebreadcrumbs. I hope you will not feel too sad for these girls. They both have two loving parents, they have each other and other sibling/s besides, they are growing up in safety and against all the odds they found each other before they China. I wish them well.

I hope these other stories will not upset you, but will show you some other happy endingss3

It's not easy to get your adopted child to learn a language that neither of you speak and is not taught in your local primary school . I know many families who sent their adopted Chinese child to learn Mandarin on Saturdays and after a while the children all wanted to quit .

Because, guess what, adopted kids want to play football or ballet or gymnastics on Saturdays, just like all their friends . Not struggle with a difficult language , in a class full of other kids who already speak it at home .

And that's in a big city where there is Chinese school at weekends. What about children who live elsewhere?

So I think it's easy to criticise other parents for not making an effort when it's not easy at all .

Getting a child to learn any language unless they're keen (and even if they are!) is hard work, even if you speak it too, so I don't criticise the parents for that.

I realise it's hard to question authorities in somewhere like China. However I think the parents had enough when they picked up the babies to question it a lot more closely. The Norwegian mum did refer to the parents having fallen in love. Having read 'The Primal Wound', and while I do have issues with some of the opinion in the book, separating babies who grew together in the womb is a wound which I cannot imagine not scarring the girls.

I can see there are good reasons for separating siblings, but do think they should be reunited whenever possible. Siblings can be an anchor for who we are, and rationalise where we come from. Kids can survive childhoods with terrible parents, with good siblings.

These girls have the 'trauma bond' of their whole early, and pre-birth life. To get to the age they have, and not even have the language to speak freely with each other, is sad. I'm not sure what the parents can do differently now, and I think they're doing their best, but it is a very sad case.

According to recent reports the parents have said that they communicate relatively easily (my guess would be through English) and skype weekly.

I'm afraid I don't have much truck with The Primal Wound as a universal truth, it is entirely opinion and not really based on any studies as far as I know - some adopted adults I know identify with it quite stongly and others think its a pile of tosh and not at all relevant to them. And dealing with the issues brought about by a child being moved repeatedly (4 times) in the first year of his life I'm more horrified by the thought of moving a child who was settling again than I am by having a long distance relationship with a twin.

Maybe because I have experience of one and not the other.

There was no chance that those children were going to be placed together - none. The authorities had opined that they weren't twins and they weren't going to place them together, the practicalities of it therefore weren't as straightforward as saying "we will give our baby to this other couple" neither family were approved for sibling adoption which I'm sure you're know from being a prospective adopter would have been necessary.

Kids can survive childhoods with terrible parents, with good siblings I'm not quite sure what you mean by this - as far as I'm aware both girls have both pretty reasonable parents and siblings and hopefully that will continue.

I don't think the girls were together in foster care in China were they (I can't remember)? They weren't social siblings but biological siblings.

I know I sound dismissive and really I'm not - but given the authorities views on the matter I don't see the alternative. Dealing with the reality of adoption is dealing with loss and separation and the effects of this on your child - I suppose this isn't by a long way the saddest circumstances I've seen so I am a bit more hardened to it!

neither family were approved for sibling adoption which I'm sure you're know from being a prospective adopter would have been necessary. My social worker has said this isn't true when I asked about this.

I think biological siblings are more important than you do, from what you've written.

I don't mean to sound critical of the parents. I think they're doing their best. However, the bit at the beginning of the story made very uncomfortable viewing. I wasn't criticising the parents in this case saying they're terrible, I mean that having your sibling, and more so your twin, with you can make up for many traumas. I don't think either of us can say which is more damaging- another move or being geographically, linguistically, and culturally, a world away from your twin. We are all formed by our experience, and that influences who we are as adopters, and the type of children we can best parent, and what we feel are major issues. Only a crystal ball/parallel universe reality could actually give us an answer as to what could have happened in this case, and what the effects of each choice is. None of us have that.

I'm not saying this is the saddest thing in the world ever. It's not a competition. I'm saying it's sad.

My point in the OP was because at no point did the parents say 'we did this because we considered the girl's best interests', but that could have been editing.

It isn't true today. But it was true when I was approved about 10 years ago. You even had to be approved for a specific age range - I was approved for a single child 0-2. I forget that its changed.

I think you are judging the parents "I feel the parents focused on their love rather than the girls' best interests" which I suppose is why I sound defensive of them. Its not about competitive sadness its about a whole myriad of losses and having to make a decision about which is harder - the loss of a birth sibling you never lived with or the loss of a family you have started to bond with.

It may be selfish but I would struggle to give up DS even in his best interests. Really I would.I would fight tooth and nail to keep him especially if I was not certain that what he gained would make up for what he lost.

Adoptive parents are very often held to a higher standard than birth parents and whilst a part of me understands that mostly I just think its unfair

As I said, it may have been editing, but the parents talked about their love being the reason for not moving the girls, and didn't mention the girl's best interests.

It may be selfish but I would struggle to give up DS even in his best interests. And I don't critcise you for that, in fact, I'd be worried for your DS if that wasn't true. However, thinking of those who have had to pack kids off in their best interests (I'm thinking war time etc), I hope I'd be brave enough to send my DD. I love my DD with all my heart, and hate being away from her even for work! You're right, though, you'd need to be pretty sure it was in their best interests. As I said, only a crystal ball would actually help in this case.

If someone was dropping bombs on DS I'd give him up in a heartbeat. Sending him off to the other side of the world after the DNA results came back knowing how traumatic he had found the move once... nope really not convinced.

I can't tell you how traumatic an adoption plus a country/language/food/smells etc change is in one go, the doing it twice within a few months gives me the chills - I can't imagine how badly DS would have been affected.

That doesn't mean I'm right but I suspect I would have done the same - particularly as there really wasn't the option of keeping them together in China but would have had to be done after the move and DNA results.

But I don't quite understand what the parents could have done? If they'd kicked up in China the children would have been offered to other adoptive parents - probably not together. By the time they got them home, they still couldn't have just packed one off to the other, even if they wanted to. They were both legally approved to adopt the child they had. It might have taken many months to organise an alternative solution - if it were possible at all - and by then the trauma of losing another family would have been far too high.

I tend to agree with kew that the trauma of repeated transitions is immensely damaging for a child.

I've just watched it. It's perhaps filmed a little bit over sentimentally with a lot of beautiful pictures of the 2 girls (identically dressed) running through the countryside with music swelling in the background. But it is incredibly moving how the two girls seem do to have a connection despite the language barrier. I cried lots. I'd have liked more in depth interviews with the parents about their feelings and how they saw the future. (I'm imagining that fairly soon the girls will be old enough to stay with each other and learn each other's languages without the parents coming too.)

You raise interesting points about what's in a child's best interest Breadcrumbs but I agree with others - once a bond has started forming with a child the stability and attachment is massively important than genetics, and what parent can honestly honestly say they would give up their child just because somebody else has a biological connection to them? (Obviously not most adopters anyway!)

Look at the rare cases of families finding out their babies were accidentally switched in hospital. The families almost invariably choose to continue raising the child they've got rather than to 'swap back' for want of a better word. I know I couldn't.