Jealousy!

[Italiangreyhound]

Hi guys, can I have some more advice please?

My adopted son is 4 and my birth dd is 10.

Ds has been home for about 9 months now. He seems to have settled very well and attached very well, mostly. It is very hard to gauge these things and I am keen to help him all I can.

In the thread I just created at

www.mumsnet.com/Talk/adoptions/2279052-Lots-of-tears?msgid=51814078#51814078

I said something like "The only two areas at the moment that are not so great are:"

• this is the second, jealousy!

There is lots of jealousy between my two at the moment! In the beginning it was just dd being jealous. Ds is pretty loving to his new sister. My dd is struggling a bit more and feels knocked off her perch a lot. Sadly, I think her jealousy of him has now led to him feeling a bit jealous of her!

One of the ways this plays out is that they both want to hug and kiss me in the middle of dinner times, usually stated by ds, and spend the time while hugging me looking at each other smugly saying 'I am hugging Mummy' etc.

In the early days when ds wanted a hug in the middle of dinner I felt it was genuine and all to do with him settling in. But in the last few months I have noticed that when my kids hug me in front of each other it all becomes about who has my attention, and it is quite sad and frustrating.

I have been trying to handle this with dd, we try and take her out for some one to one time with one of us and had planed to do this twice a week but reality is that it is more like once a month!

I know we need to do better on this but I also need to know how to work out how to help ds. I have told them both a lot much I love them both. This seems to be about me and not about dh.

So really I need advice on how to handle the tears and jealousy coming for both of them, please.

Thank you.

Today has been good so far, no jealousy or tears (except when he bashed himself falling over! Which he does seem to do a lot, he is pretty accident prone!).

It is weird how they can sometimes get on very well, today they are being cats together and all is well! But how long will it last!!!

This to sounds like DS, only his jealousy is when DH is home (works away). Similar behaviours but will put this animated voice, and will be all "daddy" in that voice, hugging him while glaring over at me. Just generic on going jealous behaviours each time DH is home.

We have a few little books on feelings, jealousy etc, we've read them over the year, he is now able to recognise his feelings of jealousy, I.e if hubby has given me a cuddle he will say I am jealous mummy, sadly though this does spiral into very rejecting behaviour towards me. Like what you have said sometimes he seems to be fine, others is very on edge with the three of us being home together. Very much needs to have us separated.

Hi Buster can you tell me which books you read with your ds, please?

Hope all gets better, thanks for reply.

We get a bit of jealously both ways. Birth dd 11 adopted ds 4, ds is a lot more vocal now!,he will scream and shout at dd and she quietly winds him up and waits for the fall out!
Dd will vocalise if she is feeling fed up usually or have a big strop then it all comes out. But they do play well despite the big age gap. Ds will get very cross and shout and scream and cry but calms down very quickly if I give him a cuddle and distract him.
Talking to lots of friends and family I think jealously is very normal part of sibling rivalry but its how it is dealt with. If it all gets a bit much me and dh tend to separate them and I do something with dd and he will play with ds. I find with the big age gap we really need to do this so neither of them miss out.
I should just keep going as you are don't make a big deal about it.At dinner I would just say I will give you both a cuddle when we have finished and leave it at that. Good luck

Thanks disneygirl great advice.

I don't have a lot useful to add. DD siblings are 5 years apart, and generally get on well.

What I do try to do is to voice how I am being fair. Otherwise usual sibling jealously can lead them to think I am being unfair.

e.g.
DD2 you got your choice of TV while DD1 was revising, so now DD1 gets her choice.
I know DD2 gets more of my attention in the mornings, that's because she needs help dressing.
I know we've just picked (other) DD's suggestion as to what to do today. Tomorrow we'll do your choice.
Yes I know I am doing this with X, but don't forget I did whatever with you yesterday.
(I always make sure number of presents is the same at Christmas too)

When they were younger, more the age of yours, whoever wasn't doing DD2's bedtime played a game or whatever with DD1. We still differentiate 'going up time' for both of them so DD1 clearly stays up longer.

Thanks Sanders we do try and do a lot of this but always good to be reminded. Great advice.

No siblings here so no jealousy issues but generally it sounds like a "sharing" vs taking turns issue.

Lots of children struggle with "sharing" but many of them get "taking turns better... can they take turns sitting on your lap. You could make it funny and everyone takes turns sitting on everyones lap/hugging.

I would also be inclined to be firmer about the hugging at the table if its turning into a oneupmanship contest.

"I don;t hug over dinner, its the time to eat. You can hug each other whislt I'm preparing it if you like though. Then its time for us to eat and chat"

Thanks Kew.

Do you have group hugs or family hugs with both at the same time? With mine I sometimes say that they can have one knee each and share me or we do "sandwich" hugs so DD1 and I will have a "DD2 sandwich" where DD2 is in the middle and we both face her and squeeze her and then swap over and take turns.

Hi Italian,

The books we've got are 'I feel Jealous' by Brian Moses. DS has found this very useful over the last year and is now starting to be able to identify when he feels jealous, especially of DH and I.

The other books were the 'I love you book', and the 'feelings book' and the 'Family book' all of which have came in useful. Todd Parr (for all I think).

Thanks, Buster, great suggestions.

I've borrowed 'I feel Jealous' by Brian Moses from the library.

Great, have you read it to DS,DD yet? I hope it helps :)

I don't have adoption experience but recommend siblings without rivalry for handling strategies, and how to talk so children will listen and listen so kids will talk, although not about adoption they include a lot of ideas, can pick and choose which to try.

For example the first one recommends that instead of emphasising that we love them both or equality (ie they feel they have to share affection) we tell them each, without the other present, how we love them and what we admire about them. Another suggestion is that when they are arguing about turn taking, quantities of food, your time or whatever, instead of emphasising equality we ask what the upset one needs. And provide it, or offer to do so later, if we can.

Another one I find useful is allowing them, again in private, to express negative thoughts and emotions about their sibling and help them to name their emotion as jealousy/anger whatever.

I had a very difficult relationship with my sibling growing up and still not great, so as a parent have tried hard to do what I can on this. But appreciate that adoption brings specific challenges so things that work for families like mine with birth DC only might not be relevant, sorry if so!

I agree with Surrey blah. Also with only 2 dc it is a very direct comparison/competition. I have 4 dc, with 3 being very close in age and I think there is less competition for parental attention because they have each other and because you are too busy running around like a manic idiot!

Thanks Surrey I do tell them both how much I love them and how great I think they are. I like when you say "Another suggestion is that when they are arguing about turn taking, quantities of food, your time or whatever, instead of emphasising equality we ask what the upset one needs. And provide it, or offer to do so later, if we can."

Random in adoption it is generally thought better to have a bigger gap.

Any tips when it is DS & DH? We do family cuddles, telling DS how I love him etc is something that happens daily. DH works away during the week or longer. He is SO much better at expressing and telling us it is jealousy, but Nontheless feels it immensly, he has been jealous of me cuddling a teddy too.

I think it's just something that is there & as typical as it sounds he may "grow out of it" when he's older?

Now he can express it things are a lot better.

Do you like reading? There is a good book called playful parenting by Lawrence (?) Cohen you might find helpful, not just for the jealousy thing but general approach and ideas. It's a bit 'American' in some parts but if you get past that it's got some good tips. The author is a play therapist so although it's not written specifically for adopters he has obvs worked with a range of children and background. Think you can get on Amazon.

Thanks TheannamoLeelu I hate reading but Buster may like it more!

But I did read How to talk so children will listen and listen so children will talk, and it is brilliant and a really easy read so I cope better with simple, direct, real life example type books. I am dyslexic and school so put me off reading that I never really got beyond Mills and Boon and Agnatha Christie (even though I did a combined degree is English literature and do creative writing as a hobby). I digress.... I like the idea of play. I have found that light hearted short, quick attempts to resolve beat long drawn out 'stuff'!