A Birth Mother's Story - Video

[SnowBells]

Has anyone watched the below?

I know it's American. I know she mentions God a lot. But somehow, amidst all the threads going on about most BMs needing their baby taken away due to neglect/abuse, etc. and how hard it is to raise such children because of the things that happened to them, I found it really refreshing that someone could completely remove herself from the equation, and do what she thought was best for the child.

I feel the above is a lot more likely to happen in the US than UK though...

I have to say I quite liked it, while also disliking it!

I also have to say that I am a Christian and I kind of 'got' all the spiritual stuff she was saying, which I would imagine would be rather hard to hear for others. I also feel (even as a Christian) that it doesn't always make sense and the idea that they only way God could get through to her was through a baby was very hard to hear. Yet the Christian message is all about a baby who came to save us so maybe it is not so difficult to put together when you view it in that light!

However, I would imagine for many people in this country (UK) whose children are adopted the story would be totally alien. Very few babies are relinquished for adoption in this country, which is (I believe) very different to the USA.

Because the situation is so different here in the UK and because this story is one about a 'spiritual' kind of journey I don't think it would resonate at all with most people who had 'lost' their children to adoption and may offend greatly.

Thanks for sharing it SnowBells because even thought it is kind of weird to watch it is her story and I think all adoption stories can help to build up a picture of the loss and the sorrow and the occasional glimmers of joy that are there.

Italiangreyhound (like that name by the way) I was discussing the video with DH this morning. My own theory is that by bringing in the religious aspect, it is easier to take yourself as a mother out of the equation. It is not in the human nature to be completely selfless.

The woman in the video said that she herself wanted to keep the baby, and that she would have been a good mum. Her parents were reasonably affluent. She could have brought up the child herself. But when she took herself out of the equation (i.e. what she wanted), it was no longer a choice between good and bad. It was about what was good and best for the baby. Because someone out there who had been waiting for years to have a baby could possibly do better than an unexperienced 17 year old, and I found it good that the birth mother had a choice as to who would be receiving their child.

I think that by asking "what would God want me to do", a lot of birth mothers in the US are able to put their own desires aside, because really… what God wants is always a selfless act. They can instead ask what is the best for my child.

That's what I find refreshing. There are too many women or even girls in this country getting pregnant, and thinking they can make a living even though it may not be a great one. Unlike in the US, they don't have to think about healthcare, etc. They don't care whether their children will not make it farther in life than them. But is that really a great attitude to have?

Oh, and yes… more common in the US. Loads of videos on youtube...

disclaimer - I haven't watched the video

But I really don't like the whole premise it seems to be about from what you've said

I was raised Christian and I've read the entire Bible start to finish and I've read a lot of things written by the adoption community including by birth mothers who relinquished their children

WHY would God want you to relinquish a child? When you hit struggles in life, the Christian message is to lean on God, and He will support you and lighten your load. Since when did you have to give up your child? If you choose to raise your baby, God will support you through it all. Believe that He will make it ok. Isn't THAT a better message? I'm an atheist now, but I am sure that a truly loving God would never want one of his people to lose their own child and go through such terrible grief.

I've read a lot of birth mother blogs and adoptee blogs...and you know, the amount of birth mothers who several years down the line feel tricked and coerced by the religious message and deeply grieving and feel they made the wrong decision when actually they COULD have raised their baby and they really would have been a good mother.

It also conflicts with my very strong opinion that adoption is born out of a tragedy, which is a child losing it's birth family, and that adoption should ONLY happen when the birth family are truly incapable or truly don't want to raise a baby. Why would God want to create that terribly sad situation where it doesn't need to happen?

It seems to me that a Christian agency dominated multi-million dollar adoption industry are using God as a new method to make women give their babies up so the agencies can make money, and provide adoptive parents with babies. Which I find pretty horrible

JMHO

Lilka

What I am trying to say is not that in my mind, not the video, "God" is often used as a method to take yourself out of the equation. I'm Catholic, but not really practicing. However, anyone who has read the bible a little will know that what you wrote above is not what "God" is about. Yes, God is meant to help you, but speaking logically, and knowing about human minds and how religion works in the Third World, it really is more about the hope that you will be helped, and a lot is actually about sacrifice and being tested. Clever really as it makes it easier to deal with the bad parts of life. No religion on earth would have been successful at gaining followers, if everything was about a god that makes your life all better. Because most likely, life will throw sh*t at you… and then, you would start "questioning" that god. Much better to let the follower think that their faith is being tested. Quite clever, really.

If I was in a was in a difficult situation, was pregnant, had no one to turn to, thought I couldn't offer my child what other couples could… and more importantly had that American adoption system, I would actually think about giving up my child. Not because of religion, but because my very own thought process would propel me to do so for the child's sake. I'd take myself out of the equation. That's easy to say but not easy to do though. The video is not the only one on youtube. Other birth mothers don't talk about religion but were more rational, i.e. "I already have two kids to provide for, not much money, I want the baby to have to go through what his/her siblings have to go through." They didn't need religion to come to that conclusion.

The way adoption is here in the UK, I guess it's a tragedy. I don't think it's like that if it was carefully planned, and if the child goes on to live with parents who allow him/her to fulfill his/her potential which he/she may not have been able to do with his/her birthparents.

I don't think it's like that if it was carefully planned, and if the child goes on to live with parents who allow him/her to fulfill his/her potential which he/she may not have been able to do with his/her birthparents

See, I still think that's a tragedy. The child lost the family they would have grown up in in an ideal good world. The mother lost her own child.

Adoption is not a panacea. It's not in any way guarunteed to give the child a better life, just a different one. If a birth mother wants a GUARUNTEE that her child is going to say, be fed a good diet every day, then she's going to have to do it herself. She can't control the actions of adoptive parents, who are not necessarily the people they present themselves to be, and she has to understand that adoptive parents are just as likely to lose their jobs, fall on hard times, divorce etc as anyone else. There's no guaruntee the child won't have difficulties related to their adoption either

When I did believe in God, I felt helped when I needed it. If you thought I was saying God will sort all your problems out or stop bad things happening, you misunderstood what I was saying. But if God never provided His followers with feelings of being supported, or 'problem shared, problem halved', just some general emotional help/support, then no God based religion would have any followers either. When I was young (like, young teen), I leaned on God for support. That's the message I always got from the Bible and church. That's what you do. That helps

Neither does that ask my question of why God would want a mother to lose her child or a child to lose its mother, if he truly loved them. There's no reason for him to want grief and sadness and that split. Wanting children who HAVE to be adopted to find good homes is different

It's very interesting that although I am a Christian, unlike Lilka, my response to the video is pretty much the same as her response! Why would God use a baby to get you to get your life together and then lose that baby?

I don't to challenge this woman's view of her own experience, it is how she chose to see it and it has made it easier for her to cope with it. It is her story through her eyes (at the moment) but I don't think it is a shining example of her adoption works well. I think it is this woman's view of her own tragic experience and if it makes it easier for her then so be it, but I would never ever want to encourage anyone to go down this route for this reason. If people are capable of raising their own kids they should, I think, and I think money does play into it a lot in he USA. Far better to educate young people, women and men, not to get pregnant until you are ready to raise your child.

I originally gave up my baby for adoption, believe me most people's attitudes to me were horrid.

Clearly if you love your child you are the best person to bring them up regardless... at least that is the message you are given/told/have shoved down your throat.

Instead I feel like I was selfish, kept my child and have actually ruined her life because I've lurched from one disaster to another.

I'm so sorry to hear this ChangedMyMind is it possible for things to get better? If you have identified the 'disasters' can you move on to something better? Really sorry to hear this, of course, there are two sides to every story and what works out well for some does not for others. We are talking in generalistaions here (or at least I am), and you have lived it. Is your child still young or are they now grown up? Please don't answer if you do not want to.

My dc is an older teen. As she would have been signed over at a very young age she would have been adopted as a baby so chances are that the would have had a very good emotionally secure upbringing as an adoptee.

They say they're glad I changed my mind but on the other hand admit my much younger dc have had much better parenting from me and that the can see the difference.

I knew people approved for adoption and I know how hard it is to be approved to adopt young children and how you are matched with similar traits so this of course clouds my ability that my dc would have ended up with fantastic parents who certainly could at least financially provide etc.

I tend to believe that choosing adoption in America is really an indictment of their punitive welfare, high health care charges and the coercive pressure of certain church and community groups.

I chose to do this and really made a decision that reflected the pressures around me from church and home. I was clear headed about how I benefited, about how I gave an unbelievable gift to an infertile couple but I neglected my needs and babies aren't unbelievable gifts much less for strangers.

Adopted people are pretty clear that some don't ever feel like their adoption was a gift to them and I recognise that one day I may be confronted with a very hurt, rejected person. I may never see this person again what a loss either way. And we coukd have a happy reunion and a relationship with wider families... Gains and losses all round.

I think it is telling that all the support from the church pre adoption vanished the minute forms were signed. I can't respect any group who promote the separation of children from their mothers. That it had to happen sometimes is bad enough.

I haven't watched the video, I hope she keeps her positivity but it is ruined for me by my developing understanding of my situation and the testimonials of older American birth mothers who see their earlier acceptance of their child's adoption as part of their tragedy.

I haven't ruined my life, I still see some positives, what I see the most is that I am a resourceful emotionally resilient person who copes well with pressures. What a good fucking job because it would have destroyed me otherwise.

Even as it is I am compelled to keep reading, learning in preparation for sharing this narrative with my birth child and to allow my children to accept this without it impacting on their life negatively.

There are parents who give scant thought to the importance of their role but reduced adoption of relinquished newborns says good things about uk society. More support, more tolerance and more choice.

Christ and I typed all that on my phone....proof I still have issues!

ChangedMyMind I am pleased to hear that your children are pleased with your choice,that is a good testimony to me. And it is never too late to change things, develop relationships and make new family traditions that make everyone feel good. Thank you for sharing.

Trofast I am so sorry for this loss in your life and I really hope that when/if you meet your child again the reunion is sweet. I am interested (and nosy) as a Christian to hear of the church's involvment in your adoption. Please do share anything you want (PM if you prefer) and don't if you do not want to. As a Christian I am very uncomfortable about any group seeking to separate parents from their children for anything other than the safety and well being of the child.

Trigger alert The Church of the Latter Day Saints (sometimes called Morom) are not a recognised 'Christian' group although they identify themselves (I think) as a Christian denomination. I stumbled onto this website while looking for something totally different. It is very interesting, and quite heart breaking. From a quick reading it looks like the The Church of the Latter Day Saints is involved in finding families for babies of women (I am not sure what criteria, young unmarried I am guessing). This woman goes on to talk about her experiences. It is quite emotional and not suitable probably for some to read! Too upsetting. But I found it interesting.

letterstomsfeverfew.wordpress.com/2010/01/12/god-doesnt-do-adoption-the-jesus-was-not-adopted-version/

In light of SnowBells post at the start of this thread it is an interesting aspect of how religion plays into adoption in some societies.

I am also wary to point out but there seems to be guilt and sadness for many mums who keep their child or who give up their child and maybe to some extent as parents we always question what we do/did. The fact someone did something at the time for the best reasons for their own situation probably goes to show that these things are hugely complicated.

I just really hope that I (as a not yet an adopter, never been in these circumstances myself poster) am not saying anything painful or offensive, it is not my intention to say anything offensive at all.

Trofast
It's sad that your church just abandoned you like that. That should not happen. But I guess humans du lack empathy these days.

What I want to say though is that reduced adoptions of relinquished newborns is not really great for the UK actually. The stupid thing is that numbers will never tell the full story. Even if there were plenty of babies relinquished at birth, they won't be 'newborns' by the time they are adopted. In the UK, babies are hardly ever adopted when they are born. Instead, they are taken into foster care, might get passed around… and most of the time, they will be closer to 2 years or older by the time they find their adoptive parents. This does have consequences - not great ones.

Lilka
We don't live in an ideal world. That won't change - ever. Probably only going to get worse. So there will always be tragedies. However, I do think you put too much importance on blood families. But that may just be me. I lost my dad when I was very young in extremely tragical and devastating circumstances, and was adopted by my stepdad years later. I do view him as my dad although still appreciating I had a different biological dad who loved me very much. To be honest, my 'step' dad is now getting old. This Christmas, he was talking to my DH about my 'grandmother' - a woman I never met because she died a few years before he and my mum met (but after I was born). He talked about her as though I knew her and that she really was my grandmother… I think he completely forgets I'm not his biological daughter. In contrast, I have zero contact with my biological dad's family (incl. stepbrothers) - when he died, things sort of became messy. I don't even have the urge to meet them again… despite them being 'blood' family.

Changed, we spoke on another post... Hi again. You have been so strong, you did both choices, not easy. I think generally that most women who change their mind are pleased and have seen research that confirms my gut instinct that most birth mothers are traumatised to large extent. I hear such a lack of support around you changed? I admire you decisions

Italian am from an Irish catholic family, the Catholic Church has a history (of denigrating the rights of women) of forced/voluntary relinquishments as we all know. And you can ask anything, it's not a sensitive subject for me (don't ask about how often I have to pluck my moustache though:)

Trofast can I ask if this was in the USA or elsewhere and what denomination the church was, please? Did you feel you were making the decision yourself? Thanks so much.

Sorry snowbells I wasn't clear - it isn't the reduced adoption of relinquished newborns but rather the reduced availability of voluntarily relinquished newborns that is a good thing. It's not true that newborns relinquished deliberately by mothers who start the process whilst pregnant languish in care and foster families for years. These babies may go into a foster family for a fewer weeks but that is usually all. In the uk there are a tiny number of babies in this position. Babies who stay in care for longer usually have much more complicated backgrounds and a rise in concurrent care and push to speed up adoption means that these babies are often placed more quickly than they would once have been.

Hey Italian I am in the uk and the church I once belonged to was the mainstream Catholic Church.

Making the decision myself? Such a tricky question. Yes I did make the decision but against a background of absolute understanding that it would be very much expected of me and would be the only thing that might heal my parents. I wanted to make things better for them, for my partner and wanted to further my education so it seemed a good choice. It feels like a decision made more than a lifetime ago whilst inhabiting a very small world (am a bit ancient so pre internet etc).

Thanks Trofast am so sorry to hear the church played a part in your choices.

I have a friend who adopted a relinquished baby, I am not sure how old he was but he was very young. A few months not years.

I too agree it is a good thing that babies are rarely relinquished in the UK. Although, of course, I do feel this must be available for some who choose it.

As a potential adopter I had really seen things from a very different standpoint when I first started looking adoption. I think I have realised the longer that I have looked into it that whatever situation brings children to adoption there are always some problems and sadness for all but also there is some hope and some wonderful things too. It can be quite hard as a potential adopter to know how to bring all these things together in my mind and talking to birth parents and all involved in the adoption triangle is very helpful so thank you for sharing.

Are you still involved in Church, Trofast?

Sounds like you are prepping thoroughly for your journey Italian.

I am an atheist really, an unrelated choice. Wouldn't pick the Catholic Church though if I needed one, it has too many institutionalised inequalities. I can't respect the adherence to dogma in the face of suffering but can feel a tangent coming on so will leave it there! Oh and with the disclaimer that most catholic parishioners I know are gorgeous individuals.