Understanding academics contracts

[andthebandmarchedon]

Can anyone please help me understand how academic contracts are supposed to work.
I have been a researcher for a few years post PhD, and always on fixed term contracts so far at the same university.
I am battling to get a permanent contract given that once you’ve worked more than 4 years, legislation says that you should automatically be on a permanent contract. The university seems to only want to pay for me via our externally funded project which is 3 days per week - however I’ve previously been working 4 days with one paid for from another funding pot, which cannot be used for permanent staff apparently.
So, if I get the permanent contract it will only be 3 days. I will be fully commited to project delivery for those days - how am I supposed to do everything else expected of me? I feel like I’m being set up to fail, won’t be able to advance as I’m not doing all the additional stuff we have to do or otherwise work extra days for free. I’m sick of doing this and I feel so disheartened.
I don’t know how other researchers do this at my place but they are all much longer term employees and seem to have permanent contracts that aren’t dependent on project funding. Is it unreasonable for me to ask that they give me a four day contract? Our HR is absolutely useless, provide no guidance and don’t even reply to emails. I don’t know who to approach for support or who needs to make the decision as it just seems to get passed around from head of school/faculty and no one takes ownership of this. My boss is very lovely and supportive but she doesn’t seem to get anywhere either.
I would really appreciate some advice. Thanks.

At my previous place, the 4 years didn't grant a permanent contract, rather an open ended one, which meant when your funding ended you were made redundant and received redundancy pay. Whereas before 4 years your post just ended and you were out on your ear.

Permanent contracts were advertised as lecturer posts and had to be applied to along with everyone else.

Depending on the fellowship, some funders required the post to be underwritten as permanent post the end of the fellowship, but they were few and far between, and only independent fellowships, e.g. Leverhulme Early Career, not for post docs on some one else's grant.

Are you a member of UCU? I know they are not popular on here but stuff like this is why unions exist.

I think it would be pretty unusual to have a permanent contract as a researcher - they are certainly thin on the ground in my institution.

Yes my institution has moved to open ended contracts for research staff, expiring once the funding ends.

In my area it's astoundingly rare to be a researcher on a permanent contract - research and teaching/lectureship route gets you permanancy. Is this something you would consider? Might be helpful to see what you need to do to secure a lectureship (more publications? Teaching experience?)

My PhD supervisor worked for years as a researcher on funded projects. She was a workaholic and published an article every month. Eventually she was head hunted to be a professor at a top ranking university. If you want a permanent contract you need to move into a teaching related post

When I've stayed after a fixed term contract has ended, it's because they've found some money from somewhere internally but it's usually a small pity project/casual teaching - it didn't feel too good just hanging around tbh, waiting for work.

It's better to separate the contract from the employee - so after 4 years of continuous employment you become a permanent employee, with rights such as redundancy pay, redeployment etc. However, you don't necessary have a permanent contract - your role is not permanent. Agree with others that researchers generally don't get permanent contracts (as far as I've seen).

Just to add to the be careful re the 4 year means permance idea. I battled for it after way more than 4 years of rolling contracts, they made me notionally permanent and then redundant in one move. I got a redundancy payment I wouldn't have otherwise, but it took a slog of a year long negotiation between me, UCU and HR.

As to how you get everything done, you can't. Not in the hours you're paid for. And probably not with a load of unpaid work on top. You have to priorise the things most likely to lead to getting a lectureship at interview (publications, funding, and likely some teaching experience/qualifications).

Most universities will have criteria for deciding what happens once you reach four years of continuous employment. They don't have to give you a proper permanent contract.

Most commonly for research staff working exclusively on externally funded research projects, the University can use an objective criteria for exclusion, one of which is that you are working on a project with time limited funding and there is not sufficient evidence to show that there will be any funding available once the funding for that specific project finishes. You can push back and say that your successive fixed-term contracts demonstrate that there is ongoing funding around and a reasonable chance that you will win some of it, so continuing to fund your post. This is easier to claim if you are winning funding for your own research as at least a named researcher on proposals or if you are working on projects with a very prolific and established PI who can provide evidence of their ability to continually win funding and hence support your post.

If the university decide not to give you a permanent contract, they can give you an open-ended contract where you have certain rights around redundancy but basically once your funding comes to an end, you are made redundant unless you have managed to source further funding. In certain circumstances, they can refuse the request entirely and keep you on a fixed-term contract.

I do know researchers on proper permanent contracts, but as far as I know, this has come about in one of two ways. One is where they are members of a research institute / centre/ group and the centre collectively maintains an income on a sustained basis sufficient to support the salaries, etc., of all their staff. The other is where someone had a permanent teaching and research contract and moved onto a permanent research only contract because they were consistently winning enough research funding to demonstrate that they can, on an ongoing basis, fund their post on research income alone.

In terms of doing other stuff and progressing, this is very difficult when your post is entirely funded by an externally funded research grant because you are funded to fulfil the terms of that grant. Ideally, the grant you are working on should include time for you to do things like publishing and professional development, but this is far from always being the case. The people in research centres with permanent posts are able to have time for other activities because their collective funding comes with a high profit margin that they can reinvest in the development of their staff alongside income the centre as a whole gets from other income sources, including the REF. This is not really the case for lone researchers outside these centres, unless their research has some kind of strategic or reputation benefit to the University. The bottom line is that everything has to be paid for and you have to be able to show where the money is coming from.

if your salary comes from a grant that can pay for 3 days per week, then you get 3 days per week. whether the contract is 'permanent' or not doesn't make a difference - a grant-funded position is entirely dependent on the terms of the grant and when the grant runs out, so does the position.

in the long term, are you looking to move to a lectureship? university-funded research positions that don't require teaching / admin are incredibly rare.

After 4 years continuous employment on a succession of FTCs you have the legal right to request a permanent contract. So you have to make the request, your employer has no obligation to be proactive. Once you have made the request the employer should grant permanency unless they have a sound and objective reason not to - typically they’ll review the reasons for FTC status in the first instance, funding streams etc. Importantly, and it always surprised me how often colleagues made this assumption, a permanent contract does not mean a job for life - the days of tenure are long gone- and you could still be made redundant at some future point following an appropriate process.

I'm not following how U can't get it all done if only permanent for 3 days or ...Are U saying that you'll be paid 3d/week but expected to work 4 d/week, or 3+4 da/week?

#Confused.

Our arrangements as the same as others have described - you become 'permanent' after four years, but your contact still ends when the funding that supports your post runs out, if you are a researcher tied to a grant or project. Moving to a permanent lectureship is the most common route to 'true' permanence. How to get the experience to apply on a 3-day research only job? You have to volunteer for teaching and extra duties and hope that your manager is supportive. It's very difficult.

Hi everyone, apologies for the delay in coming back to you. I’ve been unwell.
Many thanks for all your very helpful replies and this useful information. It is much appreciated.