How many kids do you have?

[ClivetheDestroyer]

Just wondering what's common for academics and if I'm being naive!

Some background: My husband and I have 2 children now, aged 2 & 9 months, and 8 months. We recently started discussing a third. I would love a third, he's not sure but doesn't think so.

After a PhD and 4 years postdoc, I've finally got a research fellowship, which has a permanent academic job at the end. DH isn't an academic but works in tech and has recently started his own business too.

He asked me if I knew any families where BOTH parents worked full time and they had 3+ kids, and I couldn't think of any (of our generation). Is it really that uncommon??? Am I insane to think we could have 3 kids and both still have careers? Neither of us wants to give up work but I wouldn't mind doing part time (4 days).

If it's relevant we don't have family nearby. They love the kids but aren't close enough to really be helpful. We have quite a bit in savings though so money's not really the issue.

I've posted on MN about this before. I'm an academic and have 3 DC (15, 11 and 7) but ime this is pretty unusual.

My DP is not an academic. We both work FT and always have, but as our jobs have become more demanding we have really struggled to keep everything going, and in the end his career has had to take priority (well, this is what we have agreed, for a whole range of reasons, including that he is the higher earner). I personally don't think it's possible for both parents to be in really demanding FT jobs, focus on career progression equally, and do justice to raising three DC. Sometimes trying to do it all has felt like it will finish me off. It's a LOT.

I am an academic, dh is not, although earns double my wage. Dh works full time, I work 4 days but could do 5. Probably will when youngest is in Upper primary.
We have 3 children.

The other thing I would add is that - contrary to my expectations - it has got harder as the DC have got older. When they were little and in FT nursery 50 weeks a year, things were pretty easy. But now they need much more input with school work, emotional support, generally being there for them. My 15 year old is in Year 11 and already I can see she is going to need a lot from me this year, despite being academically strong and pretty independent.

I have a very close friend with 3 young DC, they're both lawyers and work very long hours, much longer than me (I'm a teaching fellow). I couldn't do it but they manage very well. They have a nanny which I think would be essential.

I have two young ones and that's more than enough for me, this is hard enough!

I have 2 and am in a very similar situation to you & your DH. (I'm an academic, he is self employed in tech). I have a friend who has 3 and another with 5 but that is pretty unusual.

If you can afford a nanny 4 days per week until the youngest starts school, you'll be fine. And then an after-school nanny to do pickups until the youngest finishes primary. the nannies can do the kids laundry & dinners until they are old enough to help themselves, which makes a BIG difference.

Also a cleaner / gardener / other help in the house if possible.

if that is beyond the budget, then think more carefully.

I am an acadic and my DP is also in a full time demanding job.
I have 2 sons and DSS who's here about 40% of the time and it is really tough. Covering the sick days with them can be a nightmare and is pushing us to breaking point. I'm hopeful it will get easier as they get older 😭

Well this is depressing... not going the way I hoped at all!
I made it sound like we have millions in the bank 😂 Sadly we're comfortable with some savings but full-time nannies are out of the question sadly!

This is outing, but I have 4 kids aged 4-15. We don't have a full time nanny or anyone to do the before and after school stuff. We used nursery when our kids were little, and some wrap around care. I do have a cleaner once a week.

I'm an associate prof at a RG university. I've always worked full time, and my other half (a doctor) has too. I do most of the domestic labour.

The laundry is pretty challenging at times, as is keeping the house tidy, but we just muddle along and it somehow works. I had 2 of the kids during my PhD, one during my post-doc, and one during my first assistant prof post.

It really can be done. I know several people with 3 kids and everyone makes it work in their own way.

I really do agree with this. My DDs are 13 and 16. They still need me a lot and it’s much more complex/difficult problems to help them with.

Exactly @theferry. And I forgot to mention all the driving them to the billions many clubs and activities they have on. Each child does 4 or 5 activities so multiply that by three and it is a lot.

Things that helped me were:
Going to 4 days (I had one that only slept through at 9yo).
Very good childcare. Picked up and fed at home before I got home so I only had to do bath and bed.
Homework done at school homework club when they were older.
Kids taking public transport from quite young (4 of them) when needed.

Thing that continued to be an issue is the ridiculously forgetful kid.

I don't have kids but my friend is in a dual phd, dual-full time, dual lots-of travel family with twin girls and its fine. I don't know if they'd have 3 though: i doubt it! but they are both v much full time.

I have only two. And I am the primary carer, with no paid help or family help. It’s just nursery or before/ after school. I work a lot of evenings and my career has stalled for about ten years.
The physical, emotional and mental energy required to be ‘successful’ in academia (ie publishing) is incredibly difficult to sustain when so much is demanded of you with young children (sleep deprivation for years, constant interruptions).
Flexibility and autonomy are the saving grace for me. I’m fortunate that my teaching is in core hours, I have quite a lot of control over my diary. I’d probably be unemployable anywhere else due to lack of publications but I’m not looking to move.
In my team, many have grown up children, those I know with 3 or more tag team between them with grandparents help, or only one of them is in academia.
When I think of the senior women I personally know, they tend to have none, or one child.

p.s. the book Night Waking by Sarah Moss is a frighteningly accurate novel of sleep deprivation for a mothering academic, really resonated with me!

I'm a lecturer (teaching only, not research active) and DH works in insurance. He's full time and I work 4 days a week. We have three DC (all teens now). They're fab, but I have to say that three is much harder than two. As @MotherofPearl says, taking them to their activities (mine are all sporty and two of them are musical) is a part time job in itself!

I don't know anyone where both are full time and have 3 dc's.

I have 2 teens and a primary age dc and honestly it's so hard doing even a part time job with everything they need from you.

Luckily my job is not stressful but also not high paid.

If I had worked hard at a career and had had a good job pre dc's I would have definitely stopped at 2.

I'm an academic mum of one. A disproportionate number of my colleagues and collaborators have an only. Works well for us.

I have three, all under five so don't know about support during the teen years but managing with just a normal nursery. We have just started having a cleaner though which is bliss.

DH does 4 days in a senior role, and I'm FT, but he looks after them all in his nonworking day so I don't think it's really much different from both working FT (which we have done previously with two, he just felt he wasn't spending enough time with them and that was worth the pay cut). I think he will go back to FT after they're all in school.

I'm a Reader (promoted after having first two DC), but teaching focused although I do still publish and have a bit more of a leadership role now.

It's busy but fine so far, I'd say go for it if you want 3DC! My experience with three is very recent though so perhaps I will regret it, I would definitely be happy to pause my career and so would DH for a bit of necessary, and DC3 brings me so much joy I don't think I'd resent it.

One thing though, I'd only do FT or 3 days max, in 4 you will, in reality, just be doing a FT role for 80% pay. I do compressed hours so also get a week day with DCs which I love.

I think some things have to go though, I'll be honest and say I have very little social life outside of DCs, and we have no family support so an evening out with DH is very rare. This will change a bit when they're older though I hope.

The vice chancellor of Oxford has three kids. Her husband is also a high flying academic. She is a super human though.

I have three. DH and I are both full time academics. I am yet to be convinced that three is much different from two, but if you want to go full steam ahead on your career, one is probably the right number (as with only one, one adult can work a weekend or whatever without leaving the other adult outnumbered).