Applying for PhD funding- how important is geographical proximity to the institution?

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I am applying for a (local authority) doctoral fellowship from the NIHR. The fellowships are highly competitive, and I am stuck.

The leading academic in my niche field has agreed to be my primary supervisor, but works at a (RG) university very far away, about 6 hours on the train. I am in London.

Another highly respected academic in a field which has very close connections to mine has also agreed to be my primary supervisor (they both know about the other one). They are based at a university about an hour away, but the university is not RG and has less kudos.

Given that my fellowship application will be reviewed by non-specialists in my field, which option would you go for? This would be for a Sept 24 start but the application window for the fellowship closes in November 23.

Any advice gratefully received; my profession/area of interest is pretty niche so I don’t have a wide field of expertise to rely on. I won’t be able to do a PhD without the fellowship at this stage, so completing a competitive funding application is my top priority.

I should add- if option 1 was not so far away, it would be a no-brainer as the supervisor is ideal and I’m amazed that he said yes!

How is the PhD structured? Are you going to have to take certain classes and how often are they? Or is your PhD thesis only? Where is your data-collection taking place and how far are you from it? What does your potential supervisor think about the distance and how to tackle it?

Those are the questions I would think about after first reading of your post.

Do check if either university has residence requirements - Cambridge does (you need to live within 10 miles as a PhD student; I don't know how easy exemptions are to obtain).

Thanks for the quick replies.

There have been a small number of previous overseas students completing the PhD at the option 1 university; there are no residence requirements, but attendance to classes/networking events is encouraged (thesis only PhD). The supervisor in question was previously at Oxford where they have similar residence requirements as Cambridge, so we checked this earlier. He is quite keen to supervise me, and has suggested alternatives such as going on the payroll of another university, although I don’t think this will be feasible. Both potential supervisors know each other well and have worked together in the past, so would be open to an arrangement if one can be made. However, the fellowship does not fund supervision from anyone outside of the host university.

Data collection will take place in London and some national travel will be required.

I'm a distant PhD student, less than yours would be, probably about 4 hours away, and it is ok, but not ideal, especially as my uni is in a very expensive city and I don't have the stamina to do there and back in a day. I have missed out on lots of stuff that would improve my networking and skills development, though there are lots of excellent online resources for postgrad students which help with skillsy stuff so it's not a complete loss.

I will also add that it's been totally worth it as my 2 main supervisors are fantastic, and perfect for me. My advice is talk to current PhD students who are supervised by your potential supervisors, as sometimes top of their field supervisors can be a bit crap, and supervisor trumps institution every time IMHO.

6 hours away by train from London, so in Scotland, I guess?

Why not have as primary supervisor the 1 hour away Uni person with the one in Scotland also on supervisory panel, as a co-sponsor for your application, is that possible? Although my actual criteria how you choose the primary is which one is actually most available. Doesn't leave the country, won't go on sabbatical, won't leave you to sink or swim, answers emails, won't take credit for your work, etc.

My guess is that what really swings success is YOU & the LA support, not the supervisors. The supervisors might barely support you, they shouldn't matter so much. It's your record, research plan & merits of your research idea that will count.

PM me if you want, with possible supervisor names & the niche field. I may have some insights.

Sounds fine to me. When I did my PhD I was 22 and needed some emotional support and handholding! Also, I was based at the university as that's where my lab was and I used the facilities. However, if you don't need physical facilities and you're not v young, I don't see the problem! You will need to see them face to face every couple of months, but so much done via zoom etc that I'm not sure what the issue would be, assuming your funding body is happy with the arrangement?

Well, it may depend on how you work. I have a PhD student who finds working in isolation quite difficult. I also think that it can be good to be part of a scholarly community so it's not just you & your supervisors. That can be quite isolating and if supervision goes wrong r gets difficult, there's no-one else around to give you support.

If you attend maybe fortnightly, you can also start to develop a network of peers in other Doctoral students, and also learn about collegiality by going to research events & seminars etc.

In your position I'd have the local supervisor as lead supervisor and host institution. Have the far away person as second supervisor and pitch the PhD as collaboratively supervised between the two institutions. You can explain this as a strength of your application to the NIHR - you will be exposed to two different research environments, which will enable you to expand and build a wider network. In your Gantt chart, schedule visits to the far away supervisor 2/3 times annually. Find a way to describe how the strengths of the two individual supervisors are different and complementary. The NIHR are v supportive of 'less common' situations as long as you can justify it.

That’s really interesting, Tulip. I had thought that that might be an option but have been told by the NIHR that there will be no funding for any supervision outside of the host organisation; in effect, the supervisor would have to do it for free. For a number of reasons, they cannot do this.

I wonder if I should approach the NIHR again?

Thanks Dolly- this is what I’m wondering about when thinking about being so far away; although I work well on my own, I think being able to form bonds with others doing similar work would be good. Although I may be able to do that outside of the university.

It depends on your research, but why would the far supervisor need finding as a second? You'd go there, give a presentation, attend as many seminars and lectures as you can, have a few meetings and make sure you drink lots of coffee with their research group. You might need funding if you want to use the labs at that location, but being a guest researcher is very normal.

I’m certainly not very young (or even a bit young) and yes, I am wondering if it would be an issue at all given my advanced years and general misanthropy 😂

I did not know supervisors got paid to supervise. Viva examiners get paid, but not supervisors, I thought. I didn't get paid extra to supervise (as i happens , different funding structure but also ultimately NIHR) a funded PhD student. Peculiar.

This is a really helpful post, thank you.

I think much of the issue is around the NIHR’s desire to work with local authorities but a lack of understanding as to how they actually work. Likewise, the LA needs a LOT of support to understand what’s required of them in an academic context.

Funding a supervisor from another HEI doesn’t seem like an option according to the funding criteria.

I will definitely PM you 😊