PGCE advice

[MozzchopsThirty]

Hi
Can anyone tell me about a pgce ??

I have a BSc, a PGDip and have just submitted my MSc dissertation

I would love to teach what I know about to other professionals and students

What sort of PGCE would I need?
Can I do it alongside my job?

A PGCE is usually for teaching primary or secondary pupils. Is that what you want to do? (As opposed to teaching academics?)

There are part time PGCEs, but it's bloody hard work, so most people prefer doing it full time (often with a bursary) so that they can concentrate on it properly.

Do you actually want to teach?

I don't want to teach primary or secondary

But would like to teach adults and students of my discipline
No way can I take a year off work to do it

I don't think a pgce is what you need then. If you want to teach in university you will need a PhD which is 4 years full time, and a career in research ( not the same as teaching).

You don't have to have a PhD to teach at uni

Are you a nurse? My friend is a midwifery lecturer. She has done a PhD while lecturing (it wasn't optionsl) and she did a teaching qualification "on the job" as well.

The staffroom tends to be school teachers. Academics Corner might be more helpful?

A PGCE is for teaching primary or secondary school pupils. If that's not what you want to do, then a PGCE is not what you need.

There are post compulsory education PGCEs which cover 16 plus. There are also BTEC level 5/6 courses. Both are part time with some commitment to teaching hours for the duration but that, in my experience, is flexible.

Many FE colleges or University will offer this opportunity. I think the OU do it too. The qual does not attach a DFEE 'number' but it's transferable 'tween post compulsory centres.

FE will often employ a subject specialist (if you see a job you fancy in your field) and consecutively the qual.

Yes I am a nurse

Thank you I'll ask for it to be moved

As a rule, you do need a PhD to teach in university. I don't know if midwifery is different.

PGCEs are for schools. Sounds like you already know something about teaching in a uni.

The majority of nursing tutors do not have a PhD

Most unis now are expecting lecturers to have a post 16 PGCE but usually can be gained whilst on the job

Barely a minute of Googling found a good starting article for you . www.nursingtimes.net/how-to-become-a-nurse-lecturer/5002084.article

I qualified as a teacher on a post compulsory education & training course (PCET) so I'm qualified to teach in the lifelong learning sector (QTLS). This enables me to teach 14+ although I'm not sure it would be enough to teach at uni. I could certainly do adult education at a college, but I mostly teach 6th formers in a secondary school which is perfect for me.

Hi all, we're moving this thread over to our Academics' Corner topic now, at the OP's request.

Most unis now are expecting lecturers to have a post 16 PGCE but usually can be gained whilst on the job.

This is really not correct. High tariff research intensive universities appoint lecturers on the basis of their research profile (and they are expected to have PhDs + some years of research experience + grant income). Lecturers do not acquire a PGCE but do receive training in teaching - and are increasingly encouraged to obtain membership of the HEA.

Low tariff, less research intensive universities, may well recruit lecturers with professional experience without PhDs for certain subjects, such as nursing. However, even at such universities, lecturers are increasingly encouraged to be research active and to undertake a PhD in combination with their teaching/administration work.

OP should look very carefully at the future of lecturing in nursing, given the changes in funding for student nurses. I know that some nursing departments in universities are closing down; others are increasingly putting pressure on their staff to become more research active and bring in health care research funding.

More generally, lecturing is not a job teaching for adults. It is not comparable with classroom teaching - in a university you have to write all materials from scratch, validate them with the CQA, organise courses and course structure, become involved in student recruitment, take on student administration tasks, become involved with pastoral care for students etc etc. And that's assuming that you are in a lower tariff institution that doesn't expect you to be research active.

OP should look very carefully at the future of lecturing in nursing, given the changes in funding for student nurses. I know that some nursing departments in universities are closing down; others are increasingly putting pressure on their staff to become more research active and bring in health care research funding.

This could now change. Keep a close eye on the announcement of the Tertiary Education review on Monday. I've a feeling the government is going to reconsider the withdrawal of nursing bursaries and may well reinstate them. That would be good news for the OP. I also think they may reduce the criteria re research activity for lecturers. We will see.

Everything could indeed change, but I do not see any reason why universities would not push nursing lecturers to pull in research income, in addition to teaching.

(The pp is also quite strangely worded: who would reduce the criteria re research activity for lecturers? Not the government. It is universities themselves that impose these criteria. Why on earth would they not keep asking most academics to continue doing both?)

In reality if the government does drastically reduce fees without replacement funding, as pp keeps suggesting (as if somehow having inside knowledge that people at the top of universities don't have) universities will have to cut back significantly on staff. Not a time to look to move to a university job.

(The pp is also quite strangely worded: who would reduce the criteria re research activity for lecturers? Not the government. It is universities themselves that impose these criteria. Why on earth would they not keep asking most academics to continue doing both?)

The government indirectly controls research funding as they a) provide most of it in the first place and b) create and impose the incentive system which universities then have to respond to. Universities are only responding to what is dictated them to above, hence the central importance of the current Tertiary Education Review.

In answer to your second question, the government has already implemented the TEF, and many institutions have responded by creating teaching-only roles. For nursing, there is a clear shortage of nurses so it is likely the government is going to reintroduce the bursary system, and there will be a pressing need to teach.

So returning to the OP's original inquiry, I think it is very important to stress that things are changing, very quickly, and that is why your advice is out-of-date, as you assume the current state of affairs will continue.

In answer to your second question, the government has already implemented the TEF, and many institutions have responded by creating teaching-only roles.

Do you have data on this? Because certainly in the high tariff institutions I know, it is not the case that a significant number of teaching only roles have been created by TEF. REF has meant (and will mean under the new Stern rules) that some people are moved over to teaching only contracts (to avoid poor returns), but the vast majority of university staff are expected to deliver in both teaching and research. You get a greater pound of flesh from a staff member by forcing them to do both.

A Diploma in Education and Training will allow you to teach further and higher education. You already seem to have subject specialism qualifications. Course can be done part or full time.

My university would expect you to have a PhD or at least the ability to start one once in the job. You would also have to do a teaching qualification l.... it wouldn't matter which subject you taught. We offer nursing and midwifery and all lecturers have a doctorate or are on their way to achieving one.

I think the need for a doctorate varies widely across the sector for nursing/allied health. I'm an SL without a PhD nor am I working towards one. I have an MSc .

HE can't be too choosy now in recruiting lecturing staff from the NHS - the pay scale means that a band 7 Nurse would likely take a pay drop and university pensions aren't as good (and potentially getting worse)

The hit from cutting bursaries has varied across the country - the midlands and North have seen only a small reduction where (the more expensive) London/SE/East have seen much bigger reductions - they will be seeing reductions in HE staff.

A post 16 teaching qualification is needed for teaching pre-registration Nurse because the NMC require lecturers to be Registered as teachers.