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Original poster

Feel crap........do I back down???

52 replies

loujay · 21/05/2010 09:59

I know the answer already, just need some reassurance that I am doing the right thing!!

DD (age 6) woke up at 5.20am this morning,she has always had problems with her sleep, but we continued in the same way as always "go back to bed and stay there DD it is not time to get up yet"
Cue shouting, screaming stamping of feet and arunning inbetween our room and hers every 10 minutes for the next hour and 10 minutes. At 6.30 I said she could do her Kumon homework,which then took her an hour instead of 20 minutes! and then we had a whole drama about her getting herself dressed (wineing about putting socks on etc etc)
The upshot of this is that I have said that she cannot go to the school disco this afternoon.
Cue a very emotional scene at school, her crying, me feeling terrible and ALL of her friends bringing in party clothes for this afternoon.
I FEEL CRAP!!! I know that I did the right thing, but I feel so terrible.
Do I cave and take her dress in??
Help me wise mumsnetters......

OP posts:
HumphreyCobbler · 21/05/2010 20:21

I would prefer to come to some arrangement actually, a punishment is NOT always the most effective way of ending behavior that you don't like.

Punishment is not parenting. It is one parenting tool, and not the best one IMVHO.

junglist1 · 21/05/2010 20:28

You come to arrangements about certain things, minor things. You don't negotiate with a 6 year old on bedtimes etc. The parents make the rules surely

HumphreyCobbler · 21/05/2010 20:32

I think that having a discussion and coming up with a plan is a more effective way to deal with such issues.

It is not a case of either you punish or you put up with rubbish behavior. There is a third way.

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junglist1 · 21/05/2010 20:38

It's too late for discussion though. This child thinks she has the right to run around screeching when everyone should be asleep. In my house it would be "Get into that bed RIGHT NOW and stop your screaming! How dare you!" It's simple discipline and giving boundaries.

Tortington · 21/05/2010 20:40

yip am with junglist.

junglist1 · 21/05/2010 20:41

That's with a tantruming child obviously, not a child with a nightmare or whatever.
I had one of my DS friends try a 6 am wake up call. It was "get back into bed, stop talking right now. In this house we get up at 7. Lie quietly. Goodnight."

junglist1 · 21/05/2010 20:42

Oh good starting to think I was a right odd bod

HumphreyCobbler · 21/05/2010 20:44

It will always be too late for discussion if you adopt that route then. When DO you discuss stuff? I can't anticipate a problem and discuss it before it happens.

I think claiming that the OP's DD thinks she has 'the right to run around screaming' is a slight exaggeration of the case...

HumphreyCobbler · 21/05/2010 20:45

I would tell my child to go back to bed too ffs, who wouldn't?

It is just that I think that it was OK to go back on the disco issue and have a discussion about the situation instead.

junglist1 · 21/05/2010 20:47

The OP said she told D to go back to bed and the child straight away started up.
With my children, I discuss how to talk to people, how to deal with this and that at school, how to behave in peoples houses etc. I don't feel I have to ask their opinion on my fundamental house rules, such as waking up at a normal time. Those rules are for them to follow, not question.
God I sound like a twat

junglist1 · 21/05/2010 20:49

Discussion is fine aswell, there would need to be a discussion about why the disco wasn't happening. Respect goes both ways. Provided I could have a coherant discussion after being awake since that time

HumphreyCobbler · 21/05/2010 20:51

No actually, I think the more we talk the more we agree.

I am not suggesting asking opinions about waking times, just acknowleging that waking up early is not a reason for running and screaming and planning what to do next time it happens.

I get pretty annoyed when I can't sleep but I have ways I cope with it.

junglist1 · 21/05/2010 20:54

Different strokes and all that.

CoupleofKooks · 21/05/2010 20:57

well i still find it an odd attitude
you said junglist that children of 6 can ALL sleep through the night unless ill or with special needs
this is just not the case
i am thinking with studying and commuting you perhaps don't get to spend much time with other parents? because the only reason i can think of for you thinking this, is that you have just taken what your 6 year old does and extrapolated
plenty of 6 year olds do not sleep through the night
the OP says hers doesn't - so is she lying? or you think the child is deliberately waking up to be naughty? what purpose does it serve to turn a sleep problem into a discipline issue?

i think the problem could be that there is some fear here about meeting children's needs and parenting responsively
a fear that this leads to a loss of control on the parent's part
this is a really common misconception and i think is perpetuated by a lot of populist childcare programmes and books
personally i never feel MORE in control than when i am responding intuitively to what my child wants and needs
the loss of control comes when you let fear and anger decide your parenting for you
the result is often feeling 'crap' 'terrible' 'guilty' as the OP describes but people are scared to parent flexibly as they have been conned into thinking this will mean spoilt, demanding children who have the upper hand over the parents

Tortington · 21/05/2010 21:06

no no no - parent flexibly by all means, but i don't this its a stretch to suggest ( orindeed extrapolate) that if a child has nothing physically or mentally or emotionally wrong and gets up early and stamps and kicks - that its fine to say 'go to bed be dont get up til 7am'

if you feel at your best being attentive to your childs needs great - but with this statement implies that other mothers would too - which is not always the case.

me sleeping made me a better mother, if i am of no use due to being tired then the kids are going to get it in the neck - becuase as attentive as i want to be at 4,5,6 am - come the rest of the day i will be foul irritable and short tempered.

therefore in this area predominantly - it was super important to me to make no bones about what time they were expected to get up.

becuase i can;t function for the rest of the day with broken sleep.

now if you and others can - great - as junglist said - different strokes.

all our opinions are as valid. we parent different ways our opinions and different POVs allow the op to read them and make a decision.

junglist1 · 21/05/2010 21:06

All my friends are parents. Their children don't do this.
A sleep problem might well be a discipline problem if a pattern has developed of everyone fussing around at stupid times. If it was a medical problem the GP would be involved.
You think I'm odd yet reckon it's OK for 6 year olds to raise hell at that time of the morning? It's not on. It's a problem for the adult to deal with, not some run of the mill thing.
The only time my boys wake early is when summer begins and the light streams in. They are then told it's not wake up time, I explain about the seasons and that's that. I haven't got time for a load of pandering when I should be asleep

CoupleofKooks · 21/05/2010 21:18

"If it was a medical problem the GP would be involved."
most sleep problems are not medical - emotional or mental, surely?
children of this age having night wakings / early wakings is really common
you and your friends are just lucky! (ah, but you'll say it's because the others LET their children have sleep problems

i don't think i or anyone has said it's fine and dandy for children to be getting up and shouting at 5 am
but there are ways of dealing with the problem creatively and to everyone's mutual advantage surely? rather than going in with a big stick and spending the morning feeling crap and in tears as the OP relates? she isn't happy with her parenting decision on this - it hasn't worked - she's ready to try something else - good on her i say

HumphreyCobbler · 21/05/2010 21:23

I do agree CoupleOfKooks.

The OP said this was uncharacteristic behavior from her DD. I would want to find out why it happened. IME children behave well if they can.

junglist1 · 21/05/2010 21:25

I wouldn't be in tears at giving consequences to a child who refused to do as she was told. I would be in tears at the painful eyes and headache that would result from it.
If it's an emotional or mental problem you lie down with the child and cuddle them without fussing too much, to let them know you're there but it's not get up time

junglist1 · 21/05/2010 21:26

Uncharacteristic. Oh crap I thought she said characteristic (sends self to bed)

HumphreyCobbler · 21/05/2010 21:28

sleep well

junglist1 · 21/05/2010 21:30

Don't jinx me

HumphreyCobbler · 21/05/2010 21:36

bugger, you were right!

OP's DD did often have sleep problems, it was her general behavior that had been good recently.

CoupleofKooks · 21/05/2010 21:42

"If it's an emotional or mental problem you lie down with the child and cuddle them without fussing too much, to let them know you're there but it's not get up time "

i completely agree
i think that would have been a good thing to try here
maybe the OP will consider it if there is a next time (hope there is not a next time, OP, early rising and sleep problems are REALLY draining)

junglist i am glad we have found something to agree on
before it seemed your attitude was 'well my life is too hard to allow my children to have any emotional problems in the night time, it would make me too tired to deal with them, so i will punish them instead'
i am sure that is not what you meant but i couldn't make sense of your posts previously

junglist1 · 21/05/2010 21:47

Still here!
Ooh no didn't mean that. I took it as a tantrum thing rather than as she was scared or upset. Should have worded it differently

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