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Original poster

WWUD as a punishment if your DS hurt his teacher and reduced her to tears and had generally been Not Listening to Adults?

33 replies

Overmydeadbody · 15/06/2009 16:25

I'm so cross.

I need a punishment that will help him to rein in this apaling behaviour and start bloody well listening to the adults at school.

Please help me by telling me what you would do?

I am fed up.

OP posts:

Buda · 15/06/2009 16:27

OMG. How old is he?

Gorionine · 15/06/2009 16:27

How old is your DS? Do you mean he hurt her phisically or hurt her feelings?

Original poster

Overmydeadbody · 15/06/2009 16:28

He has already said sorry to her, but he stubbornly refused to for at least 5 minutes, just not giving her or I eye contact and stone-walling us.

He is 6.

OP posts:

DrNortherner · 15/06/2009 16:28

Ho OMDB, I have no advice, but am in a similar position

I too have a son who I am at my wits end with. Just thuoght I'd let you know we stand together!

Original poster

Overmydeadbody · 15/06/2009 16:29

He hurt her physically, grabbed her arm.

She was in tears more because he had reacted like that, rather than because it hurt physically, it was an emotional cry because she cares about him and tries to accomodate him so much in the classroom.

OP posts:

Original poster

Overmydeadbody · 15/06/2009 16:30

Thank goodness I'm not alone DrN, I have started a thread in special needs too about him

Now I have to take him to swimming, when all I want to do is stay here on MN.

OP posts:

MadameCastafiore · 15/06/2009 16:31

You stop all privaledges - TV, Computer, Playstaion, Wii, Pudding, Sweets, Going out to play with friends and make him write her a letter saying sorry and saying why he shouldn't behave like this.

You then make him earn back everything.

At 6 this is major bad behaviour I would say and I wouldn't normally punsih them like this but you need something that is gpoing to make a huge impact.

bigchris · 15/06/2009 16:33

I'm surprised a teacher would cry over that tbh
Was it in the classroom or later on just with you and ds?

bigchris · 15/06/2009 16:33

oh and I agree with MC - stop everything and writing a letter to say sorry is a lovely idea

Gorionine · 15/06/2009 16:35

I have had instances with my 5yo who is generally a real sweetheart but has moments when he loses control.

I found that he will say a genuine sorry if I give him time to do so but if I just have a go at him to say sorry he just clams up.

It did once happen with the headteacher in school, I was present as it was pick up time. I had to saysorry on his behalf but we returned to school about 10 minutes after the incident for him to say sorry as it hat taken him that much time to actually realise to what extent his behaviour had been appalling!The stone walling and no eye contact is exactly what he was doing as well, I think it actually is some sort of shame he felt but could not express.

Mercy · 15/06/2009 16:39

My dc school now has set sanctions for this type of behaviour (taking any SN or other home type stuff into account)

Is he like this at home or just at school?

MadameCastafiore · 15/06/2009 16:40

I think the actual saying why he shouldn't behave in this way is actually more important that the saying sorry - make him write it in his words so he understands the enormity of his actions.

Uriel · 15/06/2009 16:41

Why did he grab her arm - what set him off?

Original poster

Overmydeadbody · 15/06/2009 18:44

Thank you everyone for your replies.

We are now back from swimming and the first thing I did was sit him down to write a letter of apology which he has now done, very remorsefully.

It happened right before home time, the teacher was instantly reduced to tears (away from the children) and someone else had to cover for her for the last ten minutes of lessons.

Have now got whole story. He was encouraged by a friend to try to pull down a reception girl's skirt . The teacher asked him to stop and come inside with her, he didn't, she asked again, he ignored her, she went over to him, he lashed out and hurt her arm.

Madame, thank you, I have removed all privilages apart from a birthday party we have already RSVP'd to (no point punishing the other child as well) for one week.

He does have special needs, but is baffling the school as it isn't anything they can label like ASD.

He doesn't behave like this at home apart form the occasional outburst that is normal for children of this age. He is genuinely an easy child at home.

Giorine you are right, the no eye contact and stone-walling is definately shame, his eyes where also welled up with tears although he held them off as he seems to be unable to show emotion in public

He is quite shameful still now at home and keeps saying sorry and trying to get my affections back and getting reassurance that I still love him etc (obviously I have reassured him, just explained that I really don't like his behaviour)

OP posts:

Goblinchild · 15/06/2009 18:48

Sounds like the school need to concentrate on identifying his triggers and get some support sorted for him. Learning mentor, social skills group, CAMHS, Ed psych, there are a lot of places to access support.
Did he hurt the teacher that badly, nail marks?
Or is she a bit easily-startled and over-sensitive?

madwomanintheattic · 15/06/2009 18:54

i can't see your thread in sn, omdb?

i would agree with goblinchild though - has he got a social skills iep in place?

Original poster

Overmydeadbody · 15/06/2009 20:17

madwoman thread here

Goblin no nail marks no, I think what upset the teacher was how horrible he was to her when she genuinely likes him and cares about him and tries to accomodate his needs. She has invested a lot of time and effort into helpinh him. I guess she was upset the way we get upset as mums when our children act like they don't like us.

He has had numerous assesments and observations by Ed Psychs, the senco ec. He has a TA almost full time working 1:1 with him. He has a workstation in class as he can't work at a table with other hildren, he has a special sat in assembly as he can't sit with the class on the carpet etc etc

This is a step back and the worst thing he has done. He has been doing so so well in school recently and there have been talks of integrating him more

It is so frustrating as he is such a normal easy child at home, I wouldn't believe them but I have witnessed his behaviour at school. It is like jekel and hyde, like he becomes autistic in a school setting.

OP posts:

madwomanintheattic · 16/06/2009 09:28

oh, ok, it's in sen, not sn, that's why i couldn't see it lol.

i would post in sn to be honest. my own sn child doesn't have behavioural issues, but there are tons of people on the sn board that probably share some of your issues... and i have fleeting contact with a few through school...

it's not uncommon for children who are on the spectrum somewhere (even only just lol) that find different environments trigger different behaviours - sometimes it is the other way around - the children 'cope' in a school setting but the stress gets bottled up and so the more spectrummy behaviours spill over inot home, but you sound as if you have the other issue!

have camhs assessed him? did the ed psych refer?

has the 1-1 been given any specific training? (particularly in identifying triggers etc)

have we spoken before? i'm rubbish at remembering names lol...

Goblinchild · 17/06/2009 07:32

The teacher needs some training and mentoring to distance her needs from his. To be distressed because she's a nice person is lovely but unprofessional.She's the adult and he's the child with SEN, she needs to remember her role.
My son is more 'aspie' in stressful situations, and with less experienced teachers or those that don't think they need to follow the agreed procedures.
Last year he frightened an NQT doing cover, he got stressed and used his time out card. And she tried to stop him, by reasoning with him and laying a hand on his arm and twittering in his face.
So he stood up and the chair fell over, thrust the card into her face (without contact) and then left. But she was in the way, and he barged past her. She panicked.
Th school handled everything well, gave her some mentoring and training on Asperger's and following protocol, he wrote a letter apologising for frightening her, and explaining why he'd had a meltdown.
And the following year, the school looked carefully at how they communicated with staff, and how to make things better all round.

londonone · 17/06/2009 15:38

Goblinchild - I think your attitude is really poor. As a teacher who has a lot of experience of working with children with BESD I still can react to things they do, however rather than being upset it is generally a perfectly natural shock reaction. It sounds like the teacher did not necessarily react in front of the child but that she took some time out after the incident which is IMO the correct and professional way to react. Regardless of the fact that she is an adult it is perfectly normal to react in a human way to something thatis shocking or frightening. The most stressful part of my job is constantly suppressing my normal emotional recations to they way I am treated i.e hours of the most vile abuse and vioence. However at times I am still shocked and therefore react i.e I was punched in the face during a converstaion (non confrontational) with a child. Did I react? Yes I did and I chose to remove myself from the situation which is the professional response.

Goblinchild · 17/06/2009 18:52

That's why I asked if he'd actually hurt her, and the reply was no. I too have worked in challenging schools, but I wouldn't put that burden on a parent 'Your boy made me cry, and I do so much for him, and I try my best and he still hurt my feelings'
Parents of sn children are carrying enough already, without the gratuitous donation of hurt feelings from the professionals their children are involved with.

Goblinchild · 17/06/2009 18:54

He's only 6. No punching in face, no vile abuse.

londonone · 18/06/2009 18:22

As I pointed out the tears were probably a shock reaction more than anything else. It doesn't sound to me like the teacher put the burden on the parent more that the parent interpreted the teachers reaction as hurt feelings. At least this parent seems to show some empathy, something you are perhaps lacking Goblinchild. By all accounts the teacher didn't ask for any sympathy. I am very grateful that the parents of SN children I deal with do not have the same chip on their shoulder that you seem to.

Goblinchild · 19/06/2009 19:29

Are you going to advise me to home educate then? That seems to be your usual response to those that disagree with you on educational matters.

pickyvic · 19/06/2009 19:41

well goblinchild youd be very well qualified to do that wouldnt you....
or does londonone not know you are in fact one of those very rare creatures - a teacher with a special needs child herself?

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